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Springheel

Using Springheel's 2.05 Modules [download in OP]

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Excellent!

 

EDIT: I love your voice, you sound very much like some of the people in the Gambit podcasts, did you ever work for LGS? :P

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I always assumed I'd taste like boot leather.

 

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Just finished watching the video. I love all the new object variety that's now available for modular building ! :)

 

This exact style of piecing together smaller sceneries reminds me a lot of what Frictional did with their level editors for Amnesia and SOMA. I have experience in both, so I welcome we'll now have further accessories like this for smaller-scale building in Dark Radiant. I always fret creating bigger buildings from scratch, after already mucking about with the base level. This will help alleviate that minor "wish I could do this a bit swifter" annoyance. B)

Edited by Petike the Taffer
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Slovak localisation for TDM (my project)

What I'm up to (sporadic updates)

Partners in Crime (my FM series, in development)

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I can see all of them, what resolution to you screen capture at originally and I think maybe youtube is blurring them..

 

Bloody youtube, I was a 1/4 of the way it before it unblurred the video..

 

Created a discussion thread on the steam page -

 

http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/discussion/858048394/133258092253366416/

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I started fiddling with building pieces and mansion parts, and the first impression is... kind of messy. Pivots for walls seem to be in a wrong place, they should be at one of the wall edges, or even better, at a corner, to facilitate rotating. Mansion walls are impossible to snap to grid. When I align them with the ground brush, the pivot is somewhere in the air. Such big architectural parts should be easily manipulated within grid of 16 or 8, in all directions.

 

Clipboard02.jpg

 

 

The other problem is the meshwork, there seem to be unnecessary polygons and crossings here. Frames on the other hand, are long and have too few polygons. Lightning on long faces with only two triangles will look ugly, especially with specular.

 

Clipboard03.jpgtut_2017_02_28_00_02_59.jpg

 

And, assuming that I'm using those meshes correctly, they're not flush with each other as well. Column base trim texture seems to be inverted and the geometry of columns is off at every wall section.

 

Clipboard04.jpg

Clipboard05.jpg

 

 

Also, quite a few of these walls have faces on the other side that won't be visible. None of these walls is thicker than 8 or 12, so I assume wall thickness was left to mappers decision, as it should be.

Edited by Judith

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I started fiddling with building pieces and mansion parts, and the first impression is... kind of messy. The pivot is somewhere in the air.

 

Clipboard02.jpg

@Springheel I can also confirm this, as I have spent as much time as Grayman working with these modules. So if and when you start work on the Builder modules, could I humbly request that you have a look at all the current modular models and set the pivot point as Judith has suggested..? I would do this myself but don't have or know how to use lightwave,

 

@Arcturus/Judith -

  1. can Blender work with .LWO models and
  2. can it do so without mucking said models beyond us wanting to change the pivot points..?

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Origins for models shipping with 2.05 can't be changed.

 

Origins for new wall/door/window modules to be added to already shipped module sets should match those of the already shipped modules.

 

Origins for future models not part of the shipped module sets can be set at more optimal locations.

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I started fiddling with building pieces and mansion parts, and the first impression is... kind of messy.

 

 

 

Feel free not to use them if they aren't up to your standards.

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Feel free not to use them if they aren't up to your standards.

 

I didn't mean to offend you, the whole initiative is a great idea. But, I'd send those meshes for a peer review and listen to feedback before publishing. E.g. my work is rarely a result of a first try. Stuff I'm really happy with is usually the second or third version, often made from scratch after hitting a dead end and receiving a valid critique from my architect friend (who also plays a lot of games). I mean, players probably won't notice that. Fellow mappers and modelers, they will be much, much more harsh in their judgement.

 

 

@Springheel I can also confirm this, as I have spent as much time as Grayman working with these modules. So if and when you start work on the Builder modules, could I humbly request that you have a look at all the current modular models and set the pivot point as Judith has suggested..? I would do this myself but don't have or know how to use lightwave,

 

@Arcturus/Judith -

  1. can Blender work with .LWO models and
  2. can it do so without mucking said models beyond us wanting to change the pivot points..?

 

 

I haven't tried blender, but 3dsmax won't import lightwave files. I tried to convert it to ase or export to obj, but apparently this script works only with brushwork.

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Peer review won't help, because like grayman said, it is too late to change them.

 

*If* someone makes new modules to TDM core, perhaps then it would be a good idea to do some team peer reviewing.

 

But my personal experience is that whatever you do, and no matter how well you do it, and no matter how much others helped you to perfect it, someone else *will* find some component of your hard work, which they can (rightly or not) criticize.

 

And that is of course irritating, and it burns out unpaid voluntary workers ultra-fast.

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Clipper

-The mapper's best friend.

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That kind of depends on your goals, and the so-called peer culture. If you value self-imprevement most, you will receive even the most harsh critique. You might be angry at first, but you know it's valid, even if poorly-phrased.

 

Some communities (like Thief community in general sense) are very polite and encouraging, there's barely any critique. On Polygon forums, people are usually polite, but they will point out your errors, one by one. Last but not least, there are forums like max3d.pl, where people are merciless ;) They will tell you your wireframe is shit when they see it, and they will find every unnecessary polygon you may have missed, every wrong seam, and every distorted UV.

 

And that is good too, as long as you realise they point their critique at your work, not at you personally. You always release your work for at least three audiences: the general public, which is typically the most generous in their appraisals; your "specialist colleagues", who will analyse your work at every angle, and try to learn your technique, if it's good (or tear it to pieces, if it's shoddy); and finally yourself, to fulfill your creative needs or find answers or solve problems nobody else even thinks of. The first audience is nice to have, but the other two are true source of your self-improvement and development as a craftsman, artist, whoever you think you are.

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I fully subscribe to what you just said. That is the main reason I never finished three TDS FMs I had in progress, at least one GoW map, and two UT3 maps ;) But I still value that experience, It helped me grow, even if noone really saw it. I know your job, home, and other adult responsibilities leave little time for editing.

 

But, things like properly placed pivots are kind of minimum requirement to meet, if you want the modular system to work. There are free resources on the web to help you, like this one: https://docs.unrealengine.com/udk/Three/rsrc/Three/ModularLevelDesign/ModularLevelDesign.pdf

 

Also viewing and analyzing meshes in other game editors may help as well, like UT3 is pretty cheap now, it comes with the editor and mesh libraries.

 

Anyway, despite the language barrier or tone problems, my attitude is always "here, let me help you improve this", not "your work is shit".

Edited by Judith
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(If anything, I would have welcomed more small, less ambitious missions, but I can't be greedy)

Cough cough coercion cough cough... ;D

 

Anyhow, well said. If everything we do was honed to absolute perfection, we would not have finished anything.

 

Good enough is good enough. That's good rule. Then next time, we can do it a bit better if it is not too much extra work.


Clipper

-The mapper's best friend.

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Judith: Some people can cope better, but I'd be pretty heartbroken if I had multiple large, abandoned maps (that had little possibility of eventual publication).

 

Sotha: I wrote "more", with Coercion and Mother Rose duly noted. ;)


Come the time of peril, did the ground gape, and did the dead rest unquiet 'gainst us. Our bands of iron and hammers of stone prevailed not, and some did doubt the Builder's plan. But the seals held strong, and the few did triumph, and the doubters were lain into the foundations of the new sanctum. -- Collected letters of the Smith-in-Exile, Civitas Approved

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Heartbroken? I think that's way too dramatic :) Me ≠ my work. I don't feel like that time was wasted, quite the contrary.

 

Me = my job, that's probably more like it ;)

Edited by Judith

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