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Suggestion: Moorish/Middle Eastern setting

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Hi all,

First off let me say that TDM has renewed my faith in gaming at a time where bloated, soulless open world/multiplayer gaming seems to have taken over. There's real passion behind each level released, not a whole bunch of filler added in by devs working death-shift hours. This, the numerous S.T.A.L.K.E.R and Skyrim mods are pretty much all I play now. 

The only small suggestion I would have, if it hasn't been suggested a million times already, is perhaps getting a Moorish/Middle-Eastern setting going. The whole 1001 nights context would be an open pallette to explore. I personally can't wait to sneak around some Sultan's palace or some long forgotten tomb in the desert. Just my 2 cents. Anyways, keep up the great work all!

Cheers,

g0kud0

 

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I agree that does sound cool. Might come down to a lack of assets tho, I’ve not fully explored everything within DR so idk. We’ve got palm trees and sand so we’re half there. But how would one make those onion shaped domes like the Taj Mahal has?

Always seems to me like mappers start with creating their dream mission, one they always wished to play back in the day. Why don’t you take a crack at learning the software and fleshing out those ideas in your head? A wise man around here once said the best way to say thank you to the community is to learn DarkRadiant and give back.

I understand if it seems daunting and intimidating, I am pretty unsavvy when it comes to technology. But it really is fun to create and there’s no shortage of resources or helpful folks around here.

Time is another factor, I get that it’s never on our side. With two kids, soon to be three I am constantly faced with the predicament of what to do with my little free time: do I work on my own map, do I play somebody else’s, or do I catch up on sleep?

On the topic of S.T.A.L.K.E.R., I loved Shadow of Chernobyl and Call of Pripyat, but haven’t played them in about 3 or 4 years. What good mods would you recommend? I was super impressed with an HD graphics overhaul mod. Has anybody figured out how to add multiplayer? I was following Survarium a long time ago but forgot about it due to lack of progress. And then there was Fear the Wolves but haven’t checked on either in a while.

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Here are my thoughts on the 2 ideas:

1) A sultan's palace wouldn't be a problem from an architectural perspective. TDM has an incredibly large selection of stone and marble textures, and patches are very well suited for architectural details like arches and domes. The main problem may be the props: idk how convincing i.e. a sturdy wooden bed with linen bedsheets would look in the Orient. You'd also have to be creative with getting more diversity in the AIs because we only have 1 Moor, maybe by making tan skins for other AIs.

2) A desert temple is very feasible with TDM's assets (stone textures, rock models, zombie & skeleton AIs). Could look to Penny Dreadful 1 for inspiration, because this one already goes in the direction of an ancient temple.

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IMO to make it decent, you'd need a new environment pack: modular pieces, tiling materials, single props, loot, proper sounds/music, etc. Something much harder to do would be actual characters, I think we have some basic moor AI, as Dragofer said, but not much more than that. Skeletons, zombies, and spiders would have to make do.

Edited by peter_spy

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Previous discussion: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/16980-missions-in-exotic-locations/

I agree about assets: in general, I think 'exotic' ornaments/loot/etc. that could play the role of Thief's masks are something it would be nice to have more of. Besides 'foreign' locations or Lost City-style missions they could also suit museum heists, a gentleman's cabinet of curiosities, a mage's laboratory... Currently I'm prodding at this Aztec calendar I found on Burningwell.

(Since someone mentioned sand: surprisingly, if you search DR's Media tab for sand only a couple of suitable materials turn up, and they both use the dirt surface type even though there is a sand surface type. That's easily dealt with by scavenging more textures though.)


Some things I'm repeatedly thinking about...

 

- louder scream when you're dying

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13 hours ago, Jedi_Wannabe said:

I agree that does sound cool. Might come down to a lack of assets tho, I’ve not fully explored everything within DR so idk. We’ve got palm trees and sand so we’re half there. But how would one make those onion shaped domes like the Taj Mahal has?

Always seems to me like mappers start with creating their dream mission, one they always wished to play back in the day. Why don’t you take a crack at learning the software and fleshing out those ideas in your head? A wise man around here once said the best way to say thank you to the community is to learn DarkRadiant and give back.

I understand if it seems daunting and intimidating, I am pretty unsavvy when it comes to technology. But it really is fun to create and there’s no shortage of resources or helpful folks around here.

Time is another factor, I get that it’s never on our side. With two kids, soon to be three I am constantly faced with the predicament of what to do with my little free time: do I work on my own map, do I play somebody else’s, or do I catch up on sleep?

On the topic of S.T.A.L.K.E.R., I loved Shadow of Chernobyl and Call of Pripyat, but haven’t played them in about 3 or 4 years. What good mods would you recommend? I was super impressed with an HD graphics overhaul mod. Has anybody figured out how to add multiplayer? I was following Survarium a long time ago but forgot about it due to lack of progress. And then there was Fear the Wolves but haven’t checked on either in a while.

There are loads of decent S.T.A.L.K.E.R modes over at MODDB. My personal favorites so far are:

Wind of time - new story mod

Spatial Anomaly - new story mod

Road to the North - new story mod

Anomaly - new story mod/overhaul

Call of Pripyat Remake 2.1 - overhaul with some stunning visuals

This is really just the tip of the iceberg. There's dozens of quality mods but unfortunately, I'm not literate in Russian so I'm cut off from 80% of them! Damn! Other than that, there are a shitload of other crazy good mods. One favorite is the ACM overhaul, which completely transformed what was by all accounts a terrible game to something quality:

https://www.moddb.com/mods/templargfxs-acm-overhaul/downloads/acm-overhaul-v5-game-over-man

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Not a big fan of such settings. I rather prefer the usual, dark middle age settings that Thief missions typically represent. I think we're in serious lack of wood/pagan missions though. I know, lots of assets and stuff missing for that, but... those were the missions which were loads of fun for me in the original Thief's, and, i find the pagan stuff very interesting, and original. Wished mission makers would do more of that.

I also like dark tombs, and ancient stuff, like is featured in the Bonehoard mission in Thief 1. One of the most creepy, and interesting missions i ever played in any of the Thief's.

Edited by chakkman

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If you read the wiki page for the TDM world, you'll see we already have moors in our world, and moors are the main antagonists in the official campaign (St. Lucia, etc). I believe the character models are already in the package for use in FMs.

In the campaign I scripted (The Dark Campaign), the Middle East equivalent plays a big role. The player character, Khursand, is a Persian equivalent, although his family is like 5th generation in Bridgeport, and he grew up in the equivalent of the Arab Quarter. Maybe 1/3 of the campaign takes place in the world's Baghdad equivalent. And a lot of the backstory mirrors the politics and dynamics of relations between the Abbasid caliphate & Mediterranean Europe. I think I can get around to making the first mission at some point. But I don't know if I can get around to the whole campaign by myself. A whole campaign is a lot of work!


What do you see when you turn out the light? I can't tell you but I know that it's mine.

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Glad to see it's sort of gaining traction. Man, I wish there was a patreon for TDM! Having the mad Arab, Abdul Alhazred make an appearance would also some nice icing on the cake...

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7 minutes ago, gokudo said:

Having the mad Arab, Abdul Alhazred make an appearance would also some nice icing on the cake...

I can see how tying in C'thulu lore would make for some great horror. 

I'll check out those mods too, thanks! I remember playing Colonial Marines when it first came out and it was DISMAL, the AI was on par with a goomba from Mario Bros on NES, but I had fun with the setting and how it tied into the movies, think I only paid $5 so it was worth it for a few nights of couch co-op.

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lore wise, there is reference of moors and saracens, and a city of mages and a crystal storm city. I suppose ghouls could be added back into the game with a modified zombie aesthetic like they were when the game was a Doom 3 mod, as ghouls originate from middle eastern myth.

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This really depends on how one would approach the setting. It would be fine for some simpler initial maps based on avoiding guard routines and such, but afterwards one would have to define what characteristics would be best for this type of setting, especially if we wish to avoid 1001 nights stereotypes.

On a different note, I think spawning a different location for the TDM universe would also be an ideal chance to create an alternate character to the Garret-esque smooth voiced male that is omnipresent in TDM. This might be the right opportunity to finally have a female character join the ranks.

Edited by zergrush
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23 minutes ago, zergrush said:

This really depends on how one would approach the setting. It would be fine for some simpler initial maps based on avoiding guard routines and such, but afterwards one would have to define what characteristics would be best for this type of setting, especially if we wish to avoid 1001 nights stereotypes.

I would say that 1001 nights stereotypes are fine if done correctly. After all TDM is fairytale stereotypes all the way :)!

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On 9/19/2019 at 7:20 PM, jaxa said:

Mission 1 of T2 Dracula Reloaded has some "Moor" type guards.

It had Moor type guards, and I also heard Ghouls too. 

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If you'll fast forward to the end, you'll see where I got the idea from. Also, a massive fan of what this mob is doing...

 

 

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On 9/11/2019 at 5:58 AM, gokudo said:

Hi all,

First off let me say that TDM has renewed my faith in gaming at a time where bloated, soulless open world/multiplayer gaming seems to have taken over. There's real passion behind each level released, not a whole bunch of filler added in by devs working death-shift hours. This, the numerous S.T.A.L.K.E.R and Skyrim mods are pretty much all I play now. 

The only small suggestion I would have, if it hasn't been suggested a million times already, is perhaps getting a Moorish/Middle-Eastern setting going. The whole 1001 nights context would be an open pallette to explore. I personally can't wait to sneak around some Sultan's palace or some long forgotten tomb in the desert. Just my 2 cents. Anyways, keep up the great work all!

I am actually planning to do a North African themed mission in the future, for my series. It's just too early at this point. To me, it makes sense my protagonist could go on a one-shot adventure overseas, south of the Empire. I'd like to use those more exotic existing assets we already have, especially the Moorish NPCs. There are only so many ways you can get them involved if an FM takes place in Bridgeport or a similar European-style city or setting.

As others have said, the relative lack of model assets is currently the biggest obstacle. However, having documented the assets we already have earlier this year (still not entirely finished with the effort), I am confident that a more "barebones" version of such a more exotic environment is certainly possible. You have plenty of useful stone, adobe, mosaic and tiling textures available, and a lot of them can be used for North African style architecture without it looking too fake. A mission builder just needs to get creative with the assets available. Maybe the result won't be as sumptuous in the details as the author would like, but every FM can be eventually reworked, including adding further level of detail, new assets to the environment where they were missing before. Also, people can make custom assets for a mission and if they're good enough, they can be included in the core mod, making the whole thing easier for anyone who wants to build a future North African themed mission.

I can't stress enough how much it helps if you like and study (even on an amateur basis) historical architecture. For most of TDM, we only need to focus on European architecture and plenty of people seem to research things fairly well. It is entirely possible to do the same for North African (and even other similar-enough African architecture, from more arid/subtropical climates) to achieve similarly believable results.

I've decided to list some visual reference materials below, just for any FM builder interested in this sort of setting or theme.

----

Visual reference materials for Maghreb-style settings (or "arid Africa" style settings)

Old towns of North African cities:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Old_towns_in_Algeria

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Old_towns_in_Mali

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Old_towns_in_Mauritania

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Old_towns_in_Morocco

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Old_towns_in_Tunisia

Kasbahs / casbahs of North African cities:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Kasbahs_in_Algeria

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Kasbahs_in_Morocco

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Kasbahs_in_Tunisia

North African mosques (I'd recommend focusing on the medieval or at least centuries-old ones):

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Algeria

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Egypt

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Mali

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Mauritania

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Morocco

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Tunisia

North African, Ethiopian and Somali castles:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_in_Algeria

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_in_Egypt

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_in_Libya

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_in_Morocco

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_of_Ethiopia

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:3D_model_of_Fasilides_Castle.jpg

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_in_Somalia

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Ancient-Almnara.jpg

Other general reference materials:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Architecture_of_Maghreb

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Berber_architecture

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Algeria

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghardaïa

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Libya

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Mali

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Mauritania

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Morocco

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Tunisia

On 9/19/2019 at 1:02 PM, wesp5 said:

I would say that 1001 nights stereotypes are fine if done correctly. After all TDM is fairytale stereotypes all the way :)!

I'd be inclined to agree, but TDM's setting already strives for a degree of "historical accuracy" in the European-looking/alternate Europe part of the setting, so it would make sense for there to be a somewhat grounded look for the North African stuff too. We don't want the broad verisimilitude to get dented and look like something cooked up for a cheesy Hollywood film. We can do better than that. For example, one little pet peeve I tend to have is when an ostensibly realistic old Middle Eastern or Persian setting has guys running around with scimitars that look like oversized cleavers that would be impossible to lift and swordfight with adequately in real life. (It's like some Middle Eastern version of the swords-as-oversized-cricketbats thing you see in fantasy. Azeem's oversized tulwar-scimitar-thingie in Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves is a textbook offender.) If you look at real historical scimitars, they are rather elegant sabres with fairly narrow blades, and the details vary from region to region in the ME&NA. I think our AI modelling and rigging team did a good job on our Moorish NPCs, they have swords that might have a bit of fantasy flair, but aren't overdone.

On 9/11/2019 at 2:43 PM, Dragofer said:

Here are my thoughts on the 2 ideas:

1) A sultan's palace wouldn't be a problem from an architectural perspective. TDM has an incredibly large selection of stone and marble textures, and patches are very well suited for architectural details like arches and domes. The main problem may be the props: idk how convincing i.e. a sturdy wooden bed with linen bedsheets would look in the Orient. You'd also have to be creative with getting more diversity in the AIs because we only have 1 Moor, maybe by making tan skins for other AIs.

Yes. I think the current limited AI diversity - especially a lack of civilian characters in more local, North African style clothing - would be the biggest entity asset obstacle. Household servants and townsfolk in European clothing wouldn't be too convincing, even if you could fake the rest with clever asset use.

Wooden beds aren't the biggest issue, at most you could look at wood textures from Mediterranean and African woody vegetation used in the consturction of traditional buildings, and add the texture. If you think something looks like an oak wood texture that wouldn't fit the natural context, you simply make a texture-reskinned addon of an ordinary bed, with e.g. a palm wood texture. (People have historically used date palm trunks even for construction, especially in inhabited desert areas with a lack of adequate wood. Aside from the rounder shape, the palmwood beams I've seen in photos or docu footage from those regions look like any other wooden beams.)

Edited by Petike the Taffer
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Is there any way to grab assets from Assassin's Creed Origins, which is set in Cleopatra's Egypt? Or at least get inspiration from pieces in that game? Maybe close enough to the setting being asked about here.

 

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21 minutes ago, Shadow said:

 

Is there any way to grab assets from Assassin's Creed Origins, which is set in Cleopatra's Egypt? Or at least get inspiration from pieces in that game? Maybe close enough to the setting being asked about here.

You cannot use copyrighted assets from a copyrighted game. TDM is a standalone freeware game, rather than just a mod atop an existing game, and its license prohibits de facto stealing of assets from other games.

You can use the ACO in-game assets (or similar assets from other Ancient Egypt, Middle East, North Africa, etc. themed games) for purposes of inspiration, but our own assets always have to be open-sourced, home-brewn, or at least open-source compatible. If you didn't make a model or texture for TDM, you cannot put it in there from another game. Ubisoft would be crawling down our behinds with a flashlight in no time if someone noticed assets made by their dev teams.

 

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On 11/1/2019 at 10:00 PM, Petike the Taffer said:

 

I am actually planning to do a North African themed mission in the future, for my series. It's just too early at this point. To me, it makes sense my protagonist could go on a one-shot adventure overseas, south of the Empire. I'd like to use those more exotic existing assets we already have, especially the Moorish NPCs. There are only so many ways you can get them involved if an FM takes place in Bridgeport or a similar European-style city or setting.

As others have said, the relative lack of model assets is currently the biggest obstacle. However, having documented the assets we already have earlier this year (still not entirely finished with the effort), I am confident that a more "barebones" version of such a more exotic environment is certainly possible. You have plenty of useful stone, adobe, mosaic and tiling textures available, and a lot of them can be used for North African style architecture without it looking too fake. A mission builder just needs to get creative with the assets available. Maybe the result won't be as sumptuous in the details as the author would like, but every FM can be eventually reworked, including adding further level of detail, new assets to the environment where they were missing before. Also, people can make custom assets for a mission and if they're good enough, they can be included in the core mod, making the whole thing easier for anyone who wants to build a future North African themed mission.

I can't stress enough how much it helps if you like and study (even on an amateur basis) historical architecture. For most of TDM, we only need to focus on European architecture and plenty of people seem to research things fairly well. It is entirely possible to do the same for North African (and even other similar-enough African architecture, from more arid/subtropical climates) to achieve similarly believable results.

I've decided to list some visual reference materials below, just for any FM builder interested in this sort of setting or theme.

----

Visual reference materials for Maghreb-style settings (or "arid Africa" style settings)

Old towns of North African cities:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Old_towns_in_Algeria

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Old_towns_in_Mali

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Old_towns_in_Mauritania

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Old_towns_in_Morocco

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Old_towns_in_Tunisia

Kasbahs / casbahs of North African cities:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Kasbahs_in_Algeria

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Kasbahs_in_Morocco

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Kasbahs_in_Tunisia

North African mosques (I'd recommend focusing on the medieval or at least centuries-old ones):

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Algeria

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Egypt

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Mali

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Mauritania

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Morocco

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mosques_in_Tunisia

North African, Ethiopian and Somali castles:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_in_Algeria

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_in_Egypt

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_in_Libya

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_in_Morocco

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_of_Ethiopia

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:3D_model_of_Fasilides_Castle.jpg

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Castles_in_Somalia

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Ancient-Almnara.jpg

Other general reference materials:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Architecture_of_Maghreb

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Berber_architecture

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Algeria

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghardaïa

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Libya

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Mali

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Mauritania

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Morocco

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:World_Heritage_Sites_in_Tunisia

I'd be inclined to agree, but TDM's setting already strives for a degree of "historical accuracy" in the European-looking/alternate Europe part of the setting, so it would make sense for there to be a somewhat grounded look for the North African stuff too. We don't want the broad verisimilitude to get dented and look like something cooked up for a cheesy Hollywood film. We can do better than that. For example, one little pet peeve I tend to have is when an ostensibly realistic old Middle Eastern or Persian setting has guys running around with scimitars that look like oversized cleavers that would be impossible to lift and swordfight with adequately in real life. (It's like some Middle Eastern version of the swords-as-oversized-cricketbats thing you see in fantasy. Azeem's oversized tulwar-scimitar-thingie in Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves is a textbook offender.) If you look at real historical scimitars, they are rather elegant sabres with fairly narrow blades, and the details vary from region to region in the ME&NA. I think our AI modelling and rigging team did a good job on our Moorish NPCs, they have swords that might have a bit of fantasy flair, but aren't overdone.

Yes. I think the current limited AI diversity - especially a lack of civilian characters in more local, North African style clothing - would be the biggest entity asset obstacle. Household servants and townsfolk in European clothing wouldn't be too convincing, even if you could fake the rest with clever asset use.

Wooden beds aren't the biggest issue, at most you could look at wood textures from Mediterranean and African woody vegetation used in the consturction of traditional buildings, and add the texture. If you think something looks like an oak wood texture that wouldn't fit the natural context, you simply make a texture-reskinned addon of an ordinary bed, with e.g. a palm wood texture. (People have historically used date palm trunks even for construction, especially in inhabited desert areas with a lack of adequate wood. Aside from the rounder shape, the palmwood beams I've seen in photos or docu footage from those regions look like any other wooden beams.)

Wow, I'm staggered at the amount of research that's been put in. The amount of passion this community has is truly phenomenal. Just to add some more fuel to the fire, I believe this collection of short stories could provide some more ideas around concept, if we were to go with a much darker theme than say a Prince of Persia:

https://www.amazon.com/Tales-Alhazred-Donald-Tyson-ebook/dp/B01LXPANK1/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=tales+of+alhazred&qid=1572849560&sr=8-1

I also feel that Andalusian architecture could provide a happy balance between European and Middle Eastern. Anyways, this is turning into a very interesting discussion!

 

 

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6 hours ago, gokudo said:

Wow, I'm staggered at the amount of research that's been put in. The amount of passion this community has is truly phenomenal. Just to add some more fuel to the fire, I believe this collection of short stories could provide some more ideas around concept, if we were to go with a much darker theme than say a Prince of Persia:

https://www.amazon.com/Tales-Alhazred-Donald-Tyson-ebook/dp/B01LXPANK1/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=tales+of+alhazred&qid=1572849560&sr=8-1

I also feel that Andalusian architecture could provide a happy balance between European and Middle Eastern. Anyways, this is turning into a very interesting discussion!

Of course. I wanted to touch upon Spanish Islamic and Moorish architecture too, but it felt like I'd be stretching the topic too much, so I focused on Africa only. As someone who's worked on developing a believable, historically-inspired fantasy Africa for a certain RPG project of mine, I have a bit of a soft spot for this topic. Concerning Spanish Islamic architecture from Andalusia, Cordoba, etc., there is a vast wealth of inspiration there, and is well worth looking into. All the more that even religious architecture had often carried on with a blending of styles even after certain churches became mosques, then churches again, and so on and so forth. A blending of medieval Christian church architecture and Islamic religious architecture can create really unique, one-of-a-kind, fancy-but-humble interiors. Andalusian architecture had some splendid public buildings and urban planning too.

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On 9/19/2019 at 12:38 PM, zergrush said:

On a different note, I think spawning a different location for the TDM universe would also be an ideal chance to create an alternate character to the Garret-esque smooth voiced male that is omnipresent in TDM. This might be the right opportunity to finally have a female character join the ranks.

One of our female members (Lavender, I think ?) had an almost finished female vocal set for the player character, but she left. I don't think she ever completely finished it and shared it, which is a massive pity (all the more that it must have taken her a good deal of work to do the raw recordings for every little player vocal).

In my planned series, I actually want to use one of its main female characters as the POV figure, i.e. the player character, in a mission or two. It's mostly going to be FMs with a male protag, but a female associate of his is a major recurring NPC and I want to give her some missions of her own. (Hence why the series' title is Partners in Crime - I consider it a bit of an experiment, about a duo of thieves, rather than another loner hero.)

Never thought of a North African lady protag for an FM, but that could certainly be doable. Again, it comes down to lacking assets - in this case, we still don't have any vocal set for a female PC. As soon as we'd have that issue resolved, you can just about come up with any female protagonist you like, regardless of place of origin.

Edited by Petike the Taffer

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9 hours ago, Petike the Taffer said:

One of our female members (Lavender, I think ?) had an almost finished female vocal set for the player character, but she left. I don't think she ever completely finished it and shared it, which is a massive pity (all the more that it must have taken her a good deal of work to do the raw recordings for every little player vocal).

In my planned series, I actually want to use one of its main female characters as the POV figure, i.e. the player character, in a mission or two. It's mostly going to be FMs with a male protag, but a female associate of his is a major recurring NPC and I want to give her some missions of her own. (Hence why the series' title is Partners in Crime - I consider it a bit of an experiment, about a duo of thieves, rather than another loner hero.)

Never thought of a North African lady protag for an FM, but that could certainly be doable. Again, it comes down to lacking assets - in this case, we still don't have any vocal set for a female PC. As soon as we'd have that issue resolved, you can just about come up with any female protagonist you like, regardless of place of origin.

Funnily enough I did play T2 - Shadows of the Metal Age HD remaster and that sounds exactly like what you're trying to achieve. Hell, the main character was from Northern Africa! This was made ages ago and I'm not sure what happened to the devs, but maybe it's worth dropping them a line or two? Man, I would've happily paid good money for that game. 

That being said, I have been burned on kickstarter with the System Shock remaster, which'll be done roughly when I hit retirement at this stage....

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7 hours ago, gokudo said:

Funnily enough I did play T2 - Shadows of the Metal Age HD remaster and that sounds exactly like what you're trying to achieve. Hell, the main character was from Northern Africa! This was made ages ago and I'm not sure what happened to the devs, but maybe it's worth dropping them a line or two? Man, I would've happily paid good money for that game. 

That being said, I have been burned on kickstarter with the System Shock remaster, which'll be done roughly when I hit retirement at this stage....

I know Zaya is from a North African style land. Hell, I thought the idea to include Moors and more southern, non-European cultures was loosely inspired by Shadows of the Metal Age. :) We do have a few female voice actors here on the forums, or similar contacts within the wider Thief fan community (RedLeaf from TTLG.com did a lot of the more middle-aged female voices for TDM). If we find someone willing to do the female player vocal set, I think it should be someone who can affect a voice that sounds neither too youthful or too old. That's, IMHO, key. The player character's male vocal set already sounds like it could belong to any deeper-voiced guy between 20 and 50. I think I'll start a new thread on finally organising an effort to create a female vocal set. That's one of the few stumbling blocks left for more original protag creation, IMHO.

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