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Fan Mission: Living Expenses by Sonosuke (2010/01/02)


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#26 thieving-cat

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 11:52 AM

Wow, and I mean WOW. You really pulled this off. Most exciting mission to date. Like someone said earlier, very thief-like style.




#27 Nielsen74

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 12:54 PM

In all a solidt mission Posted Image through the "end room" is somewhat a bit of a future shock Posted Image (IMO)

Edited by Nielsen74, 03 January 2010 - 12:55 PM.


#28 Fidcal

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 01:18 PM

Good Mission Sonosuke. I played on Difficult and got about 1930 loot in about 2 hours 15 minutes game time - probably two and a half to three hours actual with gameloads.

Some nice effects and some interest in every room, ie, loot, readable, or just part of the story as with the nursery. The only thing I failed at where I had to look in this thread was
Spoiler


Just about playable on my old machine with FX5900 and low settings but fps dropped at worst to about 6fps. No wait, I had one big lag for a second or two in that
Spoiler
But I don't mind as it means I can put my feet up and use the big TV with a bowl of popcorn and a big mug of coffee. :)

Some ideas are similar to what I'm using in my next FM - I've not stolen them from you! I have been developing it over a year. Everybody's passing me by! :(

Amazing amount considering the time taken. Felt like a full size mission. Hope you do more! :)

You should be able to look at the voting without voting yourself - there is another button next to the vote button. I'm going there now myself! :)

#29 Tels

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 02:21 PM

Haven't finished the mission yet. Some things look really great, it is a shame that some of the rooms/settings look only half-finished, tho.

The nursery is f.i. about 3/4 empty, the guard room has a stair made of bricks (no support, it would fall down, like a lot of the other ceilings in other rooms, too), the "roof" area is... huge but empty and so on. The start area could also use some patches to roughen the terrain.

I think spending a bit more time adding support beams and more details to otherwise barren rooms would help quite a lot. Currently these areas constrast so sharply with lovely details like the music room and the hallway to it, that it is really a shame :)

Also, consider changing the metal in the ducts to stone - that much metal would be prohibitively expensive and they also look way to modern this way (like half life :) Stone, wooden support beams, spiderwebs and debris and you got a winner there :)


A few technical issues I noted:

* player lantern doesn't work in ducts - reported by someone else already: http://bugs.angua.at/view.php?id=2079
* the first air vent grate is missing a (working) visportal. The upshot of this is that the engine considers the air vent and the big room below as the same area, and this means the dynamic ambient light considers their sum as the true ambient light. So it is much brighter in this vent as when you go round the corner - even tho there is no more light at the start of the vent than later. (Generally, a few more visportals would also help sound propagation - sometimes you can hear guards three rooms further because there are no portals on the three corners you just rounded so the sound goes straight through walls instead passing through the portals and getting muted on every portal a bit)
* the doors on the hallway upstairs might not exactly fit the hole in the doorframe, you see a small black frame around them when closed. Might be an artefact on my system, tho.


I really really liked the floor mosaic you did with the tiles - nice idea! (and cool to see my work in game :wub:)
"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

#30 Fidcal

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 02:36 PM

Erm... this is a finished, released FM. I would only consider major mission-breaking problems - otherwise feedback for future FMs. That's my ten cents anyway. :) Anyway, I didn't consider this half-finished. This was a fast build project for the contest. (Poor old Tels is still in beta testing mode and can't break out of it. He's never been the same since Saint Lucia. ;))

Dang I never found the player lantern. I meant to mention that was another thing that mildly spoilt it for me - I keep reaching for my lantern and it wasn't there. Redo and re-issue this FM at once!!!!!!!! :laugh:

#31 lowenz

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 02:49 PM

(Poor old Tels is still in beta testing mode and can't break out of it. He's never been the same since Saint Lucia. ;))

:laugh:

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#32 Sonosuke

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 04:21 PM

In all a solidt mission :) through the "end room" is somewhat a bit of a future shock Posted Image (IMO)


hahaha, yeah it should be like that. You never know what foreigh creators can do -_-

Well i am a huge fan of Myst and the old Tomb Raider series so you will always see things like that in my maps. Maybe even bigger in the next map? lets see



" Just about playable on my old machine with FX5900 and low settings but fps dropped at worst to about 6fps. No wait, I had one big lag for a second or two in that "
Sorry i thought: Its good playable on my old geforce 7600gs so it should be playable for everyone else too. I will consider this for my next map.
btw, i would never think that my master would steal something from my map :)





"@Sonosuke: is this a grand xmas contest entry? "
yes it is




"Dang I never found the player lantern. I meant to mention that was another thing that mildly spoilt it for me - I keep reaching for my lantern and it wasn't there. Redo and re-issue this FM at once!!!!!!!! :laugh: "
did you even take a look in the shack? ^_^




" (Poor old Tels is still in beta testing mode and can't break out of it. He's never been the same since Saint Lucia. ;))"

:D

Edited by Sonosuke, 03 January 2010 - 04:51 PM.

Ich konnte mich nicht erinnern Teleportation gezaubert zu haben und doch stand ich da... alleine und nackt.

#33 Sonosuke

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 04:47 PM

Still couldn't find that darn objective


ok

Spoiler

Ich konnte mich nicht erinnern Teleportation gezaubert zu haben und doch stand ich da... alleine und nackt.

#34 STiFU

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 06:39 PM

Ah sweet. That secret was nice... You really seem to love levers and buttons! ;)

#35 Ladro

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 08:06 PM

Amazing mission.

It's incredible that this is a mod with another engine!
My congratulation to you, Sonosuke! :D

#36 aidakeeley

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 08:22 PM

Rookie Phenom!

You know it.
"A Rhapsody Of Feigned And Ill-Invented Nonsense" - Thomas Aikenhead, On Theology, ca. 1696

#37 Ladro

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 08:52 PM

I'm re-playing the mission (i like it a lot!) and i've noticed that there is a great music mission atmosphere!

There problem is that, i don't know if it's a bug (of my configuration - i'm with Linux -, the mission, or TDM), that some times the music is't not working in some rooms (it do not start when i enter in some rooms so i ear only normal sounds).

I noticed also some really good visual with lights:
Spoiler

Or

Spoiler


Bravo Sonosuke! :D

#38 Sonosuke

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 08:59 PM

Ah sweet. That secret was nice... You really seem to love levers and buttons! ;)


hahaha, yes i love them.



Thanks guys for you kind words, that really gives me the confidence to start another map.
Ich konnte mich nicht erinnern Teleportation gezaubert zu haben und doch stand ich da... alleine und nackt.

#39 Sonosuke

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 09:03 PM

Thanks Ladro but that light in the nursery was like that, the credits should go to the creator of the lamp. (sadly i dont know who it is)
Glad you liked it

Edited by Sonosuke, 03 January 2010 - 09:04 PM.

Ich konnte mich nicht erinnern Teleportation gezaubert zu haben und doch stand ich da... alleine und nackt.

#40 Ladro

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 09:23 PM

Thanks Ladro but that light in the nursery was like that, the credits should go to the creator of the lamp. (sadly i dont know who it is)
Glad you liked it

Posted Image

Posted Image

:D

A thing that I don't understand it's the use of:

Spoiler

Edited by Ladro, 03 January 2010 - 09:32 PM.


#41 stgatilov

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 05:15 AM

How could a Master Thief finish like this? He sold his sword, lantern, compass, ... and even BLACKJACK!:huh:  Seems like the economic crysis happened in the city: there are too few rich people to steal from.:laugh:

The issues:
Spoiler

These are all minor issues of course.

I should have chosen "medium" diffuculty instead of "difficult" I think. There are a lot of very well hidden secrets in the mission to search. I like searching the place up when all the guards are KOed  :D. But when the guards are in place it is much more tiresome to do the third-fifth patrol through...

About secrets/objectives/loot and etc:
Spoiler


I noticed the guards with swords can throw a bottle or the like at you if they cannot reach you. I saw how one of the two alerted guards threw a bottle at the obstacle that was too close to them and hit another guard. As the result they started fighting each other. The duel was quite spectacular... After some fencing the guards who lose started running away  :D But eventually he was caught and executed.

Overally, The mission is very thief-like. And very challengeful!

#42 STiFU

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 06:16 AM

4. In several rooms: when I turn the light off using a button the illumination is gone but the light source itself (lamp) is still very bright.

This is a general TDM issue that has already been discussed a couple of times. I actually reported this myself once. I guess this will be dealt with in the next update of TDM.

About secrets/objectives/loot and etc:

Spoiler

Spoiler

Edited by STiFU, 04 January 2010 - 06:21 AM.


#43 Berny

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 06:34 AM

Oh man I love this map!!




The objectives didn't seem to be challenging. But the whole map is great. I expected such a quality of a map in abou one year since TDM 1.0 - for me you are the winner of the contest. Don't believe that this map can be beaten.



#44 Sonosuke

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 08:19 AM

"4.
Spoiler
"

No there is nothing up there, but good guess, i did think of placing some loot there but in the end i did not.




"I noticed the guards with swords can throw a bottle or the like at you if they cannot reach you. I saw how one of the two alerted guards threw a bottle at the obstacle that was too close to them and hit another guard. As the result they started fighting each other. The duel was quite spectacular... After some fencing the guards who lose started running away :D But eventually he was caught and executed."

Haha, nice!




"This is a general TDM issue that has already been discussed a couple of times. I actually reported this myself once. I guess this will be dealt with in the next update of TDM."

I can't wait for the next update :)

Edited by Sonosuke, 04 January 2010 - 08:42 AM.

Ich konnte mich nicht erinnern Teleportation gezaubert zu haben und doch stand ich da... alleine und nackt.

#45 SneakyJack

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 10:57 AM

Really great mission overall - one of the most fun thus far. Thank you! Review here for anyone interested.

#46 Ladro

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 11:53 AM

Really great mission overall - one of the most fun thus far. Thank you! Review here for anyone interested.


I like your review, i agree!

The best passage, IMHO:

mission that brings us ever closer to silencing the critics of The Dark Mod and showing once again what is possible with those that embrace it


It's absolutely TRUE! :D

#47 Tels

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 02:39 PM

View PostFidcal, on 03 January 2010 - 02:36 PM, said:
(Poor old Tels is still in beta testing mode and can't break out of it. He's never been the same since Saint Lucia. ;))

:laugh:


:D lol

Yeah, true, I have a habit of turning on portals and tris - and sorry, if I had a chance to tell you earlier I would have done.

In any event, if you ever feel you need to fix the map for some reason, you might as well take care of the issues I mentioned :)
"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

#48 Tels

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 02:41 PM

I'm re-playing the mission (i like it a lot!) and i've noticed that there is a great music mission atmosphere!

There problem is that, i don't know if it's a bug (of my configuration - i'm with Linux -, the mission, or TDM), that some times the music is't not working in some rooms (it do not start when i enter in some rooms so i ear only normal sounds).


Same here, and the music is very loud, but if I adjust the "ambient music" in the menu, it is suddenly all quiet and only later restarts (then again too loud).

Also using linux. Probably a bug in the location based settings entity?
"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

#49 stgatilov

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 02:45 PM

I replayed the mission on easy without loading at all (like Diablo 2 hardcore). It was a bloody mess... 4 guards killed, 5 KOed. Hungry thief fell into RAGE! Though two of the guards were killed just for archery training  :unsure:

Only the third attempt was successful.

The first attempt failed: I was caught in the dining room. A cook alerted two guards and they started searching the area. When they were done they tried to return to their duties. And they got stuck between dining room and library. I threw some junk at them, they got realerted but they didn't come away. This problem (several guards get stuck in a narrow passage) should be dealt with. Don't know how though...

The second attempt failed because I tried to blackjack a sleeping guard. Don't know the purpose of doing that  :). Always did it in original thief with no problem. But here I failed.

Spoiler


#50 Tels

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 02:45 PM

Btw I encountered another bug in the mission I did forget:

In the guard area, the sleeping guard and the archer were both offset by about 5m to the left, so that the sleeping guard was sleeping _at the foot end of his bed in plain air_ and the archer sat _inside_ the bed (and changed positions to sit on on top of the trunk at the foot end of the bed.

When I did sneak upstairs I woke the hovering guard, possible because his legs embedded into the stair collided with me going upstairs.

Not sure how this bug came to be as others didn't have it.
"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax




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