Need ideas for my next mini FM

[Fidcal]

Having got my Harry Potter fanfic out of my system I'm looking to start a small FM to build over a few weeks or a couple of months but I'm just wondering what type. Also what are others doing? It's nice to have variety so I don't want to start say, a haunted mine if someone else is about to release a haunted mine.

 

I have considered a rooftop FM like Angelwatch but I want to keep this FM simple and low-risk plus I'd like to wait for vine arrows to be released.

 

The default is just a mansion heist but I want to avoid any large grand stairway halls.

 

What I am thinking of is a 'burrows' one where a rural community is living semi-underground in the country with a lot of inter-connected tunnels and small rooms. Should make performance easy.

 

Any other ideas? Basically I just want to have some fun with a quick simple map.

[nbohr1more]

How about something for Halloween?

 

No Revnants or Zombies, just invisible "spirits" moving objects (etc). Regular guard patrols in an old hotel with a mysterious attic (etc).

 

How about an "Secretly escape the town mission" where it's like an obstacle course of decisions and torched guards are chasing from behind right from the start?

 

How about a cave filled with Mages that you must steal a valuable Grimoire from?

Edited August 9, 2011 by nbohr1more

[Bikerdude]

Fids, I would love to help you build a rooftop mission...

[Sotha]

build a rooftop mission...

Rooftops are probably always difficult, since you need an excellent skybox that changes when you move forward. Would probably be the last thing I would do if I was doing a simple small mission.

 

Also what are others doing?

 

I'm doing a city map with an assassination mission, hitman style, but no disguises. Standard hiding mechanic.

 

Few ideas, free of charge:

• A 'terror in the sewers' -theme? Maybe put a few special AI's there to make it interesting. Introduce The Morbid faction, if Nosslak gets that mask ready in time for your map. Start on the streets, make way down in the sewers to discover a hideout. Maybe the player is looking for something there, or maybe a bunch of thugs toss the player in there and seal the manhole (pay the rent, taffer!), objective is to get out.
• River bridge. Someone showed here some time ago a picture of a large bridge, crossing a river, built full of houses. Mission about getting from the other end to the other side, undetected, before Something Awful happens. Maybe the player's pal is held hostage by a rival gang, and the player needs to get the friend out before they slit his throat. Would be even more interesting if gang AI would really go and try to kill the friend if they are sure they saw the player. Imaginative patrol routes is the key, plus having alert_only path nodes. Player would need to take out witnesses or be extra careful. Maybe there was a courier, bringing in orders to kill the friend and the player has to intercept the courier first, or face a race to liberate the friend before the courier reaches the gang boss. The map should be easy to compartmentalize if you do not allow the player to get on the rooftops. Fog would help a lot with the bridge too, eliminating the need for a kickass skybox.

[Fidcal]

Yeah the rooftop FM would be for the future. Most likely same as Angelwatch with no access to streets. I was thinking of maybe a very dark skybox for the streets with just a hint of lights here and there. I'm not sure if that would work. Then ambient_world would only reach halfway down the buildings so the base is complete lost in darkness except for the few on the skybox floor. That way everything below a certain level can be plain brush or even caulk. But I'd also put a giant damage stim down there testing every say two seconds so no problem with performance. That way if you fall down you die screaming within the dark area before you hit the skybox. This is just to prevent anyone somehow getting down there and finding it's not developed at all. The problem is that likely someone would find a way to climb down.

 

The spirits, moving objects is interesting. But it also reminds me of that Thief keeper FM where the enemy are all invisible. You could hear them and I think faintly see them at times. That was intense. I spent a lot of time watching without moving. The tension was maybe the best Thief ever I think. But that is definitely one for the stealth-lover.

 

Sewers are good. We've not had many. Biker's cathedral one had some but not extensive or complex. Oh and St. Lucia of course. There's a lot of mileage in sewers and one can put in a lot of variations as well as clone quite a lot for speed. But there are all sorts of possibilities for water, underwater, climbing, etc. all without huge performance-sapping views.

 

The bridge idea I also like. Needs quite some thought though. I very much would like to see the whole bridge all the way across the river and all the crooked houses but that would need some inventive mapping to get decent performance. It might be possible by duplicating the whole thing when finished and simplifying it down into simple models just for the view.

 

I need to get fired up again. I'm just coming down from getting fired up over my fanfic but now it's posted there's no way of telling if anyone is reading it! Stats tell me about 150 visitors in the first 24 hours but I don't know if they are actually reading it through so it's a bit of a downer. At nearly 60,000 words it would make the mother of all readables in an FM though!

 

Once I get going in DR again I'll get cooking again I'm sure.

[Aprilsister]

Well, now that you've expressed your penchant for writing...

 

And Sotha brings up the excellent new work by Nosslack...

 

And there has been a steady call-out for some back story...

 

And the bridge thing sounds intriguing and just the thing to get us there...

 

Why not treat us players to a bit of a toe-dipping into The Plague Ward?

 

About two decades ago, a deadly plague erupted in a district in the north on the opposite side of the river.

 

As a player I would love to play this mission -- venturing across the bridge/tenement, with plenty of readables about what exactly (or vaguely) is on the other side...

 

dot dot dot

[Sotha]

The bridge idea I also like. Needs quite some thought though. I very much would like to see the whole bridge all the way across the river and all the crooked houses but that would need some inventive mapping to get decent performance. It might be possible by duplicating the whole thing when finished and simplifying it down into simple models just for the view.

 

Well, you could easily make a few vista-points, where protruding building block the view. You could have simple compartmentalization with decent views like this:

 

 

This also applies for the rooftops: maybe the middlemost buildings simply are so tall that the player cannot see above them. But the rooftop access to ground level must be corridor-like so a small simple visportal can do its magic there.

 

If the skybox camera can be teleported around your skybox, you could create the illusion of the player making progress over the bridge. Each time he approaches a new vista-point, the cam gets teleported a bit further in the skybox, bringing it closer to the other side of the bridge. I'm not sure it can be teleported, though.. If it can, then all sorts of cool things are possible!

 

(oops, I'm getting excited over here..)

[lost_soul]

Ya know what would be great? a haunted house! I'm thinking of something similar to Thief 1's "Shunned" FM. TDM has had plenty of haunted missions, but I don't think any of them have taken place in a house. The cool thing about haunted house FMs is that you *think* you have an idea of what things will be like before you start playing the mission, but surprises often occur. See Shunned for T1 and "Bloodmist Tower" for T2.

[grayman]

Plague Ward.

 

Plague Ward.

 

Plague Ward.

 

A story about how the Plague Ward came to be.

 

Retrieving someone/something from the Plague Ward.

 

Waking up in the Plague Ward with no memory of how you got there. Get out.

 

 

As for myself, I'm working on a campaign:

 

1 - An abbey that's been converted into a mansion.

 

2 - Rooftop mission and Citywatch station.

 

3 - City streets, a tunnel/sewer system, and a prison.

 

4 - Various buildings in the Flood Ward.

 

5 - Revisit the Citywatch station from mission 2.

 

6 - City Council chambers in the Old Quarter.

 

7 - Builders' complex and ancient burial site.

 

8 - Mansion on a cliff.

 

1 & 8 are outside Bridgeport. The others are in the city.

 

[ECHELON]

If I can give advice, I like a lot missions in castles and on the roofs. but on the roofs reclaim enough time.: /

Edited August 9, 2011 by ECHELON

[Midnight]

I would have thought that a FM introducing the Plague Ward would need to be quite large and require a lot of work.

 

 

Regarding the bridges idea, from time to time I like to save images that provide inspiration for FM ideas, this is one of them:

 

 

[Fidcal]

Looks good - and do-able. Gives me vibes for a Venice-type FM.

 

Plague ward - yes, probably too much to do it justice in a small quick FM. To be honest I don't know what story is there other than presumably plague broke out and access is restricted in and out of the area. Assuming there was something there worth risking the pox for I wonder what you'd see. Empty streets ('cos everybody is sick in bed) and unguarded mansions (because all the guards are sick. I guess one could do a non-Thief type of FM "deliver health potions to the doctor" or "get blood samples for analysis using leeches."

 

@Sotha: Yes that's a good diagram of how to do the bridge once you are on it but what I was saying is that in addition, when finished, the whole lot is copied and converted to a simplified set of solid func_statics or models to be viewed from either bank so you can see the whole bridge.

[Springheel]

To be honest I don't know what story is there other than presumably plague broke out and access is restricted in and out of the area.

 

I think that kind of mission would likely be a necromancer/undead story. No normal person is going to be alive inside the walls.

 

The Plague Ward: About two decades ago, a deadly plague erupted in a district in the north on the opposite side of the river. In a panic, the city council quarrentined the entire district, barring the great gates and walling up the exits. People moved away from homes close to the walls, leaving them abandoned. To this day the district remains walled up. It took a decade for anyone to even consider opening the gates again, but the fear of releasing the plague once more--not to mention the stories of damned spirits seeking vengence--have kept that from happening. The area surrounding the district continues to be virtually abandoned as well, lived in only by the desperate or those seeking sinister privacy. There are rumours that necromancers have found a way into the ward through underground passages, and that they have turned the corpses of the plague victims into a dark and loathesome army.

[Shadowhide]

i'd like to see rooftop mission,but unfortunately,TDM editing abuts to FPS counter

[Komag]

I like your original "burrows" idea best, plus that would be the easiest and quickest thing to build too, plus it's open to some variety

[Baddcog]

Rooftops are probably always difficult, since you need an excellent skybox that changes when you move forward. Would probably be the last thing I would do if I was doing a simple small mission.

 

 

 

You just need to build in hallways just like a regular mission. Divide up areas by having the roofs in the edges not accessable. But make them func_static spanning areas so they always render.

 

I've been meaning to get the demo done, but i have shown images to some people showing how it works. I just can't show the general public those specific pics.

 

And of course just like anglewatch, too tall to reach the ground without death, even though some ai can patrol there for life.

 

------

The only issue is you won't see objects from other areas. So things like a super tall clocktower, the face could be visible, but not hands (if they are objects/moving.)

 

Or gargoyles.

 

But LOD options could be used. ie: static clock hands (that might 'jump' time when player came into view with moving hands).

 

gargoyle... You could have a fairly simple shape of worldspawn in similar color inside the object. The object wouldn't be seen from other areas, but a vague blob of shape color would be (low poly lod). Then when you get into the same 'area' the real model would show instead.

[Baddcog]

i'd like to see rooftop mission,but unfortunately,TDM editing abuts to FPS counter

 

Again, see my above post. There is a way to do it, you just have to be creative.

[Baddcog]

Yeah the rooftop FM would be for the future. Most likely same as Angelwatch with no access to streets. I was thinking of maybe a very dark skybox for the streets with just a hint of lights here and there. I'm not sure if that would work. Then ambient_world would only reach halfway down the buildings so the base is complete lost in darkness except for the few on the skybox floor. That way everything below a certain level can be plain brush or even caulk. But I'd also put a giant damage stim down there testing every say two seconds so no problem with performance. That way if you fall down you die screaming within the dark area before you hit the skybox. This is just to prevent anyone somehow getting down there and finding it's not developed at all. The problem is that likely someone would find a way to climb down.

 

The spirits, moving objects is interesting. But it also reminds me of that Thief keeper FM where the enemy are all invisible. You could hear them and I think faintly see them at times. That was intense. I spent a lot of time watching without moving. The tension was maybe the best Thief ever I think. But that is definitely one for the stealth-lover.

 

Sewers are good. We've not had many. Biker's cathedral one had some but not extensive or complex. Oh and St. Lucia of course. There's a lot of mileage in sewers and one can put in a lot of variations as well as clone quite a lot for speed. But there are all sorts of possibilities for water, underwater, climbing, etc. all without huge performance-sapping views.

 

The bridge idea I also like. Needs quite some thought though. I very much would like to see the whole bridge all the way across the river and all the crooked houses but that would need some inventive mapping to get decent performance. It might be possible by duplicating the whole thing when finished and simplifying it down into simple models just for the view.

 

I need to get fired up again. I'm just coming down from getting fired up over my fanfic but now it's posted there's no way of telling if anyone is reading it! Stats tell me about 150 visitors in the first 24 hours but I don't know if they are actually reading it through so it's a bit of a downer. At nearly 60,000 words it would make the mother of all readables in an FM though!

 

Once I get going in DR again I'll get cooking again I'm sure.

 

 

I've got a black texture in models. It's like 2x2 pixels. Everything at the bottom could use that instead of caulk or a larger texture.

 

Caulk might give weird skybox/hall of mirrors effects.

 

And if you had lights in certian areas you could just use pathces of texture large enough to go to the edges of the light.

 

Then you wouldn't even need damage checks, it would just fade to black and the player would splat.

 

Finding a way to climb down is harder than finding a way to mantle up.

 

Equilibrium is Still my favorite T2FM. The invisible keepers who could swap to bow or sword was genius when it came out. Silent Sleep is awesome, too bad he didn't do more. He helped me get the full stim set-up almost working for Left4Dead but i don't know, I think a crash wiped it out and I gave up redoing it.

[nbohr1more]

I will act like a broken record here:

 

A roof-top mission would be the perfect place to test using a LOD skybox room for the distant buildings with "remote render map" or multiple portal sky setup.

[Baddcog]

I will act like broken record here....

 

I have made a test map before with a seperate skybox . It works BUT our head bob script breaks the illusion and makes the skybox camera head bob too.

 

However, oh just read my last post<_<

[nbohr1more]

I will act like broken record here....

 

I have made a test map before with a seperate skybox . It works BUT our head bob script breaks the illusion and makes the skybox camera head bob too.

 

However, oh just read my last post<_<

 

I got it, you would need to use remoteRenderMap with a custom camera setup rather than the default Portal Sky and that is the crux of the issue, Portal Sky should have code support for this purpose rather than requiring mappers to make their own camera scripting.

Edited August 9, 2011 by nbohr1more

[demagogue]

Go with your first gut feeling and make a burrows FM.

Have an underground city like that old tv show Beauty & the Beast, or like Derinkuyu.

[Fidcal]

Yeah I definitely like the rooftop idea but it's too ambitious to do it justice in a quick FM. For a start I would need to experiment with the streets to see what looks good.

 

A burrows one can be small but fun.

 

Thanks for ideas. I've still not decided. I need a kickstart (or a kick up the arse) then I'll get going.

[Fidcal]

My current thinking is for a claustrophobic mini-city. This would be a series of small dwellings, shops, etc. The streets would be extremely narrow and overhung so you can barely see a glimpse of sky above. Much of it would be covered over arcades, archways, tiny courtyards. Streets would be very short. So essentially the whole thing would be an interconnected series of small rooms - but some of them would be public thoroughfares.

 

I've done an alert test map and I've got the city watch to treat the player on the streets just as an innocent passer-by but if you attack one and cause a high alert then nowhere will be safe after that. In addition if you get into someone's house and a commoner sees you then if they run out and alert the city watch that too will mean they will permanently attack you on sight. In short, any city watch alert will change them from neutral to kill on sight. KO-ing a city watch will only cause this change if you are seen doing it. If another city watch just finds the body but doesn't know who did it then they will continue to ignore the player because they won't know you did it.

[grayman]

... you would need to use remoteRenderMap with a custom camera setup rather than the default Portal Sky ...

 

Is there a thread that discusses how this is accomplished?