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Fresh Thief 4 cinematic


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#26 stumpy

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 05:10 AM

no the hand position would strain your elbow after a time if you tried that same shot from the video in real life. as nautrually you would grab the bow string with the hand the other way up, unless you had a deformed right arm. even in third person it would look better if the right hand was the other way up. Even if the bow was horizontal the hand position for the right hand would be the same, it should be palms facing each other to get maximum power from the bow. Even if garrett was left handed, and was holding the bow in his right hand and pulling the string with the left, his palms would be facing each other.
Either the designers have never tried using a bow, or they irked the animator and he/she did it as revenge. Unless the bones on that cgi model are borked, and no ones noticed till now.

#27 Springheel

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 10:53 AM

The only way it would make any sense is if the bow were held nearly horizontally. Then you might put your fingers on top of the bow string which would make your hand go into the position shown in the video (and early screenshot). But you could never effectively aim like that.

It looks like some dumb, anime-like flourish to me. As does the way he draws his lockpicks:

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#28 SiyahParsomen

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 12:02 PM

Posted Image + Posted Image= Posted Image
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#29 Diego

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 12:40 PM

I know what you mean.. the only moment the character resembles Garrett is when they show his smile, the rest looks like a scene from some ninja gaiden game.

#30 demagogue

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 12:48 PM

Yeah and even then the cheshire smile itself is another kind of anime flourish... Makes him look like Aphex Twin. Plus, seriously, we're talking about Garrett here. The guy is the consummate world-weary cynic, so I don't think he'd be flashing a wicked smile like that anyway, or any of these little flourishes. He does what he has to to get the job done.
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#31 jay pettitt

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 01:45 PM

It is a pricey looking necklace though. I'd allow him a small smile.

#32 GameDevGoro

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 01:55 PM

The guy is the consummate world-weary cynic, so I don't think he'd be flashing a wicked smile like that anyway

There's a thrill to doing something that pleases oneself, so yeah, I do think he'd have some kind of mental pep-talk before going for the grab. So he'd smile??? Or something? :) (I'm not sure what I'm saying here, but c'mon. Sometimes I smile for myself when something good happens... And I'm almost sure other people do as well.)
Also he does chuckle (albeit often sarcastically) throughout the games so I don't put a smile beyond him.
Furthermore, this thief may not even be Garrett. Here's one hoping it isn't, because I'd go raving mad over having them ruin a perfect character design as Garrett.

It is a pricey looking necklace though. I'd allow him a small smile.

*Nods* Exactly...

Edited by GameDevGoro, 15 June 2012 - 01:58 PM.


#33 AluminumHaste

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 03:37 PM

Meh, better if they released nothing at all, I sense another fuck-up coming. I'll wait for this forum and ttlg for a consensus before buying anything from Eidos again.

I always assumed I'd taste like boot leather.

 

#34 demagogue

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 04:19 PM

It is a pricey looking necklace though. I'd allow him a small smile.


Ok ok, a wry smirk. ;) I just didn't like the Twin Aphex cheshire look of it.
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#35 Psychomorph

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 07:15 PM

A lot of bias here, but what else to expect.

I kind of like it. The bow has such design because it is extractable and can be carried folded which makes it very practical for a sneak.
He has a tight hood, which is more practical for sneaking (less vision obstrusion like with a large hood). He has cloth covering his neck and chin, which he seemed to have pulled over his face when he was lock picking. Considering some sort of smoke came out of the hatch, he might have expected it and covered his face, in the bow drawing scene he has the cloth only covering his chin, so there is nothing ninja about it.
It looks to me like he has a long cloak (knee long, not to the feet), but it might be held by a belt around his waist.

What I don't like is how he pulls out the lockpick, looks silly, but overall I think there is a well thought out design to the character

#36 jtr7

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Posted 16 June 2012 - 09:10 AM

The only time I see archers with their drawing hand palm outward, is when using these release aid devices:
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#37 grayman

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Posted 16 June 2012 - 11:48 AM

That bow-firing method (holding the arrow with your thumb down and elbow up) is one of the dumber things I've seen in a while.


In real life, I've never seen anyone use a bow that way. I've certainly never done it, and it looks damned awkward.

#38 Professor Paul1290

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Posted 16 June 2012 - 01:10 PM

The only time I see archers with their drawing hand palm outward, is when using these release aid devices:


I was about to mention that. Drawing palm outward isn't uncommon nowadays, though it's usually with a modern compound bow and release aid:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OTAw7d3SCU
(as seen at 1:10)

Whether that would be correct in this case is something else though. I don't think "Garrett" (if he is Garrett in the video) using a release aid here and I don't think it looks quite right here.

It's possible that they saw some modern archers doing this and are applying it without the appropriate context.

Edited by Professor Paul1290, 16 June 2012 - 01:14 PM.

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#39 grayman

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Posted 16 June 2012 - 01:41 PM

Learn something new every day. Holding the string like that must be a recent development.

Since compound bows were invented in 1966, Thief4 must take place later than that. ;)

#40 Tels

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Posted 17 June 2012 - 04:05 AM

There are quite a few very interesting archery videos on youtube. Here is one of some traditional bowmaking (It's in korean I believe, but just watching it is very interesing):


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#41 Springheel

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Posted 17 June 2012 - 03:51 PM

On the subject of impressive archery videos, check this out. Apparently what Legolas does is not beyond human ability:

http://www.videobash...shooting-239049
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#42 Psychomorph

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Posted 17 June 2012 - 04:45 PM

On the subject of impressive archery videos, check this out. Apparently what Legolas does is not beyond human ability:

http://www.videobash...shooting-239049


Noticed the position of her right hand?

#43 7upMan

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Posted 17 June 2012 - 05:11 PM

So guys, what did we learn from this? Less bitching, more researching and making informed statements, maybe? ;)


P.S.: I'm sooooooo in love with the elf girl! ;)

Edited by 7upMan, 17 June 2012 - 05:14 PM.

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#44 Springheel

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Posted 17 June 2012 - 07:42 PM

Those examples don't seem quite the same as what's in the video, but there's clearly a precedent for that kind of arm position that I was unaware of. I wonder where that style of shooting came from?
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#45 Midnight

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Posted 18 June 2012 - 02:16 AM

That's a really impressive find, would be interesting if there's a historical record of the palm facing outward with this type of bow. I paused the thief video at the point you see the palm positioning and it does appear he's using a release aid similar to those posted by jtr7. I can see why a more mechanical looking bow would be used if they're wanting to emphasise the steampunk element of thief, but I don't see why you'd then use an existing and purely modern design over designing your own. I would have much rather seen a recurve bow if I'm honest.

I actually like the video, especially the music. I do think the way he takes out the lockpicks looks a little silly but in general I like the style, the wry smile seems most Garrett-like. Really, the most disappointing thing about the video is the length. Looks like a purposely leaked video to me, I just wish they'd officially released something longer.

Of course it could be that this video is from a demo reel and doesn't actually represent the actual game at all, has there been any official confirmation of the currentness of the video?

Edited by Midnight, 18 June 2012 - 02:21 AM.


#46 Psychomorph

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Posted 18 June 2012 - 03:36 AM

I actually like the video, especially the music. I do think the way he takes out the lockpicks looks a little silly but in general I like the style, the wry smile seems most Garrett-like. Really, the most disappointing thing about the video is the length. Looks like a purposely leaked video to me, I just wish they'd officially released something longer.


Same sentiments here.


As for the hand position. It really seems to be a modern archery sports development, but why is that a pronlem for Thief4? Old fans always complained about how Thief 3 has a dominant middle ages flair to it, while the originals had a strong mix of themes. A modern bow grip is not much of a contradiction, I think, but adds to the strong mix of themes and timelines, which is part of the Steampunk genre.

#47 Midnight

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Posted 18 June 2012 - 06:18 AM

Well Thief has always been kinda "Steampunk Lite". I think the reaction to the compound bow is (rightly) the concern that they've introduced a purely and recognisable modern design into a generally medieval themed game, at least that's my concern.

#48 elwing

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Posted 18 June 2012 - 02:43 PM

Well Thief has always been kinda "Steampunk Lite". I think the reaction to the compound bow is (rightly) the concern that they've introduced a purely and recognisable modern design into a generally medieval themed game, at least that's my concern.


hum...

..Glue some gear on it and call it steampunk...

#49 wrichards

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Posted 21 June 2012 - 07:20 PM

makes me sick every time I think of the fall of TTLG, ALL DUE TO J. Romeros crap Dikatana.... I remember the day I woke up and read the TTLG forums stating what had happened... I have not "bought" a game from Edios since, forgive me for my outrage its still very depressing how TTLG for F#%@ed all becouse Romero studio needed to survive.... I laughed in Romeros face when he showed that peice of $@&T at E3, laughed right in his face. Specter - dont EVEN get me started about him. Thief 3? holy F^%$ what a piece... and now to rape the series its like indiana jones crystal skull time... F-THAT!!! what you guys have done here is amazing, its a true tribute to what/where this seris should have gone. I was there at the begining of real game companies, I knew/know the players. to watch the industry over the years become what it has and crap such utter CR@# down our thraots over and over and people ask for more and more.... as it is now I havent bought a game on release day for many years all becouse I know 99% of them are barley worth the bargin bin price theyll be in in 6 months. so much hype to capture money on release becouse they know in three weeks theyll have to drop the price. I love the $59 (us) cr@& they set for us. just hold the gun to my head why dont you. Thief 4... enough, it will be pretty and CONSOLE! and mostlikely NOW 3/4 view point like modern warfare... VERY VERY VERY sad..... ill pass thank you and Warren Specter?? go F-yourself hard.... again forgive my outrage. Specter knows who I am, let him come and tell me to my face Im wrong...

#50 nbohr1more

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Posted 21 June 2012 - 09:44 PM

I think that's pretty much the sentiment around these forums, though some are more forgiving about Thief 3 than others.

Seems like you've got a bigger beef with Specter than most of the pundits, did you work with him on something?

I presume you wont be purchasing "Epic Mickey 2" then :D ...
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