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Let's bring Stephen Russell to The Dark Mod!

stephen russell voice voice acting

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#1 Dinosorceror

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 10:56 AM

Okay, I'm not much of a forum poster. Heck, I run a few, and I hardly post! But I do feel guilty that I haven't posted to thank everyone for all their hard work on The Dark Mod. I loved playing all the current content, and...let's just say I already liked it a ton, but fell in love with it when I first saw a guard relight a torch. Damn. :)

But to keep this post on topic, I read something very disturbing in The Escapist yesterday:

http://www.escapistm...Actor-For-Thief

Not only is the new Thief game looking like some kind of alternate universe reboot that just takes elements from the old games and mashes them into something new, but now we find out they got some BS reason for not hiring Stephen Russell to do voice acting for it -- he needs to do his voice acting during motion capture, so he needs to be able to do his own stunts. As if Tom Cruise can't have a stuntman in his movies or CG because it "just wouldn't be real enough?" C'mon.

We all know that Mr. Russell is a very, very large part of why we loved the original series. Even in the lackluster third entry, it was his presence that made that game acceptable and welcomed.

The Escapist article has a link to a petition someone started to bring him back, but I say the heck with that. That new Thief reboot is looking more and more like a lackluster lost cause.

Er...however, I know that some folks here actually work in the games industry. In signing up for the forum, I noticed a comment about a contributor here doing a level in Dishonored -- also a very Thief-y game I enjoyed. And maybe I don't necessarily want to take a dump on the new Thief reboot, especially if people who are "just doing what they can" from here may be working on it, but...

...c'mon. We all loved Thief in a large part due to Stephen's awesome acting. Can we get a Kickstarter going to not only finish up the stand-alone implementation of The Dark Mod, and finish up the mission storyline being developed, but also hire Stephen Russell to do voice acting for it, too?

...pretty please?

#2 zergrush

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:15 AM

There's only a limited amount of assets left for TDM to be finished, which doesn't justifies a kickstarter by itself in no way. The only plausible cause one could use to create a kickstarter would be the creation of a major official campaign and maybe, only then, MAYBE consider hiring Stephen Russel. And frankly I don't see that becoming a reality either.

Although, to be fair, a successful Kickstarter could bring a lot attention to TDM and a whole crowd of new players to help keep the community alive over the years.

Edited by zergrush, 04 April 2013 - 11:16 AM.


#3 Springheel

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:21 AM

First of all, thanks for the kind words. :)

Can we get a Kickstarter going to not only finish up the stand-alone implementation of The Dark Mod, and finish up the mission storyline being developed, but also hire Stephen Russell to do voice acting for it, too?



Bringing money into things would likely cause more harm than good.

We're continuing to work on making TDM standalone...I've been adding dozens of new assets over the last few weeks myself. The distant glow of a distant light is starting to make itself seen down the tunnel.

As for using SR in TDM, I'm not sure what the point would be. He couldn't do Garrett's voice for copyright reasons.

#4 zergrush

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:46 AM

We could star him as an original character though. Plenty of room for more thieves on the TDM universe. And I admit that as farfetched as this possibility sounds, it does seem quite alluring.

Edited by zergrush, 04 April 2013 - 11:52 AM.


#5 Sotha

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 12:13 PM

*
POPULAR

Yup. Why people want to throw their money around? Why not "kickstart" with another form of currency - TIME!

(My, not the TDM team's official) message to those people who would want to give their money to TDM without a blink of an eye:

There is currently no possibility of giving money to team. Even if you could give money, it would be difficult to choose who in the team would get how much. Problematic. Considering the Fundamental Spirit of the Human Nature, someone would get pissed off at the unfair division. Money's effect on TDM would be damaging. Since there currently is no possibility of doing monetary contributions, why not spend your TIME on TDM instead of your money?

Pick up the A-Z tutorial, it is easy to follow. Make a small, interesting and original TDM FM. REWARD the TDM team by contributing a map to the mod. Overall you will help TDM a lot as the amount of available missions is important in gauging our success. The team, who works hard on all kinds of improvements and features, would love to be treated with a decent extra FM made by you. Some of you might contribute only one mission of average quality. That would be great! Some others of you might get hooked into the beautiful creative process that is map building and contribute many Masterpieces. That would be most excellent!

In a project like this, TIME CONTRIBUTION is more important than MONEY. If you want to pay for TDM, why not spend some your TIME to help us?
  • Springheel, AluminumHaste, Melan and 2 others like this
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#6 zergrush

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 12:22 PM

Well said Sotha. But frankly I've yet to gather the courage to read Fidcal's A - Z tutorial. Maybe someday.

But hey, one could still try to contact Stephen to see if he would be willing to voice an FM for free.

Edited by zergrush, 04 April 2013 - 12:24 PM.


#7 Sotha

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 01:00 PM

Well said Sotha. But frankly I've yet to gather the courage to read Fidcal's A - Z tutorial. Maybe someday.


Just out of curiosity... What is the thing you need to gather the courage for? Do you expect it to be technically overwhelming? It isn't. Or is it just about not having enough time to spare to learn it?

I'd say anyone who is able to
a ) play TDM
b ) learn to use common office suite programs
is well equipped and have all it takes to learn TDM mapping. It isn't exactly rocket science, but it takes some time to learn the editor, just like learning any other software or language. This is even further mitigated by the excellent tutorial made by Fidcal and this forum where mapper veterans are always ready to help with possible mapper questions.
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#8 zergrush

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 01:13 PM

Patience, mostly. Learning how to use the tools is the easiest part. Learning to do proper mapping that looks and most importantly plays good is the most time-consuming one.

#9 Melan

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 02:42 PM

What Sotha wrote. Also,

Patience, mostly. Learning how to use the tools is the easiest part. Learning to do proper mapping that looks and most importantly plays good is the most time-consuming one.

That's why I made this thread which shows how you can create a small but completely functional mission in under a few weeks after completing the A-Z tutorial, and using a simplified building process. :)

Remember: you do not have to create an all-bells-and-whistles mega-campaign as your first project! In fact, we would all love to play a range of small and sweet missions - like The Builder Roads, which was built in only two weeks, or like The Outpost, Thieves, Too Late, The Parcel or others like it.

You need trust in yourself, and - well, you need a little time and effort too. But probably much less than you would think.
Come the time of peril, did the ground gape, and did the dead rest unquiet 'gainst us. Our bands of iron and hammers of stone prevailed not, and some did doubt the Builder's plan. But the seals held strong, and the few did triumph, and the doubters were lain into the foundations of the new sanctum. -- Collected letters of the Smith-in-Exile, Civitas Approved

#10 skacky

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 03:05 PM

As much as the idea of having Stephen Russell voice someone in TDM is beautiful, there's no way it can be done currently. I think Sotha is spot-on. When I'm done with my dromed circle I might return to TDM and do something.

#11 Obsttorte

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 03:14 PM

my dromed circle

I'm not sure what that means but it sounds quite funny when I think back on how blocky the dark engine looks. :laugh:

Patience, mostly.

You know that addiction can overcome the lack of patience. Take a weekend of and just start it, I'll bet you'll stay with it. ;)
FM's: Builder Roads, Old Habits, Old Habits Rebuild
WIP's: Several. Although after playing Thief 4 I really wanna make a city mission.
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#12 New Horizon

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 03:43 PM

Bringing Stephen Russell to TDM would certainly not be impossible, but it would require a LOT of effort. The logistics would be pretty crazy.

A kickstarter would have to cover the following costs:

1. Compensating Mister Russell for his time.
2. Food and drink: The vocal talent must be cared for.
3. Rental of a studio space, or at least rental of mobile recording equipment if the person doing it doesn't already own their own.
4. Potential travel and lodging costs for the person venturing out to record Mr. Russell at a location convenient to Stephen.

...and I'm sure there would be a few more expenses.

Now, the trick for all this to work for TDM would be that the money could only be used to cover expenses, not to actually pay anyone. We're a volunteer group after all. I would have no issue with that.
Any leftover money could be used to pay for server expenses, or donated to a charity of Mr. Russells choice for that matter. I don't know, just brain storming.

As for Mr. Russell's character. Well, I would want him to play the lead...although it couldn't be Garrett. I would suspect the character would have more of a british accent, though still be gruff and cynical. For Mr. Russell to even consider it, I'm sure he would want to be assured that we weren't simply looking for a Garrett knockoff. The character would require a complete history and fleshing out.

Could it be made a reality? Crazier things have happened. I would certainly be open to it, especially now that Eidos Montreal have kicked him to the curb for a local Canadian actor who kind of looks like Jeremy Irons.

#13 SeriousToni

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 03:49 PM

Just to throw it in: Why doing a kickstarter? Making a pot via paypal in which everyone can donor and presenting this to Stephen Russel with the explanation that this was bestowed by a community of free people and asking him if he would do the main character on the TDM campaign would be a quick idea. So the people that think it's important can spend the money and see if it's enough for the job and those who don't care wouldn't be bothered. But as I said - just a quick and silly idea with no thinking of the consequences and problems ^_^

Anyhow - why the hell does a voice actor need to make stunts anyways? :blink:
"Einen giftigen Trank aus Kräutern und Wurzeln für die närrischen Städter wollen wir brauen." - Text aus einem verlassenen Heidenlager

#14 Springheel

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 03:53 PM

For Mr. Russell to even consider it, I'm sure he would want to be assured that we weren't simply looking for a Garrett knockoff.


That's the whole issue I have with it. If he's not doing Garrett--and we both agree he couldn't--then what's the point of putting up all kinds of time, effort and money to get him in particular? Just to give a "Fuck You" to Eidos?

#15 New Horizon

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 03:56 PM

Just to give a "Fuck You" to Eidos?


If there was ever a question that didn't require asking Spring. lol Impractical as hell, but wouldn't it feel goooooood. haha

#16 zergrush

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 03:57 PM

That's the whole issue I have with it. If he's not doing Garrett--and we both agree he couldn't--then what's the point of putting up all kinds of time, effort and money to get him in particular? Just to give a "Fuck You" to Eidos?


And promote TDM, while gifting the community with a little bit of Thief nostalgia. But like I said before, we would need an FM that would truly be worth the effort. Althoguh I agree with SeriousToni's idea. a PayPal pot would probably be a better choice.

#17 New Horizon

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 05:24 PM

And promote TDM, while gifting the community with a little bit of Thief nostalgia. But like I said before, we would need an FM that would truly be worth the effort. Althoguh I agree with SeriousToni's idea. a PayPal pot would probably be a better choice.


An FM? The campaign would be my choice. I have a feeling many in the community would be chomping at the bit to work on any project Stephen Russell had also been involved in.

#18 zergrush

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 05:26 PM

You mean Crucible or a future "official" campaign?

#19 demagogue

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 06:09 PM

Not just one person in our community were mappers for Dishonored, but TWO -- Digital Nightfall (maker of the Cosas FMs) and Purah (maker of the Calendra's FMs).

Regarding conributions, others have said it already, Sotha in particular as usual, but I'll put my spin.

Want to contribute? The most awesome thing people could do to help us is contribute to the community -- make a sound folio, make a map, make fan art, write a fan fic, or just stick around and *post*, give your thoughts on what's happening. We need feedback. There's so much you could do, and all of it is worth a lot more to us than money.

As for Stephen Russel, another member of our community SlyFoxx has already become the unofficial SR stand-in for FMs... So we could use his voice if anyone's, although again we couldn't call him Garrett for obvious reasons.

Lol at the 'screw you' to EM that a Stephen voice-set in Dark Mod would represent though. It's not a realistic goal, but it's funny to think about.
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#20 jaxa

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 06:22 PM

You can also buy coder time with Kickbucks, like VLC did in December.

#21 Dinosorceror

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:43 PM

Wow, it hasn't even been a full day, and these are just awesome responses, especially from key players...I'm actually kind of overwhelmed! Great constructive responses too. To address a few...obviously it wouldn't be Garrett, just like The Dark Mod is not Thief 4 and tries to be "[eerily similar], but [...] legally distinct" (as Futurama put it once) from the Thief universe. And I won't go into Thi4f bashing, but I do have quite a few negative opinions about the new one, and my impulse in my original message was just as much a "fuck you" to Eidos as it was standing up for the iconic voice of the character. That man can act, and the diversity...Garrett, Bennie and Karras? That's just awesome. I'm no professional critic, but I really enjoy superb voice acting, and there's only a handful of people I know who I'd use the term 'superb' with, and he's one of them.

I think the points about compensation, logistics, "just a copy" of Garrett are all valid. And I have to admit, my keeping up with this community amounted to (1) hearing about Dark Mod, (2) downloading Dark Mod and 3) seeing if a new version was out :), I'm excited to hear so much active development and "light at the end of the tunnel" talk. :) However, I think the best counter-suggestion I heard so far is something along the lines of at least saying a "Thank you!" to Mr. Russell by asking him to do a single mission. Maybe call it "For Old Time's Sake." Just as with The Dark Mod, you're not saying it's Garrett, it's not him by name, and it's not a ripoff -- it's a tip of the hat to the guy who we feel got a bad deal from Eidos for...heck, they may even be valid reasons, but _we_ think he was a critical component in the mythos. And I would like to think that Mr. Russell is a nice guy and would appreciate the sentiment and wouldn't need payment for some lines he'd just record at home, but money does speak louder than words in some cases, a PayPal bouquet of bills is an awful nice thanks, too, or as was also suggested, donated to a charity of his choosing in his honor.

I mean...c'mon. This whole thing is just...a really bad taste in the mouth, and...well, I'd just like Mr. Russell to know that there's a bunch of people who don't think it's Garrett without him.

Finally, the point about donating effort and time...man, I have to say, you guys make it sound easy. I think I will be inspired to try and create some mission content for The Dark Mod as a result of this thread.

...maybe "For Old Time's Sake." ;)

#22 someTaff

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 02:11 AM

Why cant Mr Russel mumble a few lines in skype))
Thus recorded they could be implemented in TDM

If there would be 100 lines, i think such deed subject to some form of compensation
Kickstarter "Help us fund Mr Russel for 100 lines" sounds weird, but there is things ever weirder, so why not to try))
Acctually, how much would it take for 100 lines?
Contact his agent and ask?

Or even "Help us fund for Eric Brosious quick-15-seconds-and-looped-intro for TDM menu screen"
It would attract some media attention imho
thus TDM would appear the bearer of true Thief-series spirit, and new Thief-game would be compared against, thus media coverage))

this is essence of thief-series http://www.youtube.c.../?v=cHyPS6b4thQ

Edited by someTaff, 05 April 2013 - 03:23 AM.

What excuse do we have not to sculpt, and sculpt, and sculpt, until the job is done?

#23 Summer

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 05:09 AM

That article from the Escapist: Is that for real? I mean... The news came out on April Fool's Day. Voice actors doing their own stunts? WTF?! Stephen too old to use his voice to grunt or whatever?! *scoff*

It would be a hoot to have Stephen in for TDM. God, the mere thought sends shivers down my spine! But obviously it's unlikely to happen. Still.... It's a pleasant fantasy to entertain. :wub:

#24 GameDevGoro

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 07:28 AM

I'm not really aware of how much voice actors actually make in a gig, but if Stephen had like a TON of cash then maybe he'd be able to do something for free just to help out or you know... Tribute?

But uhm...

#25 New Horizon

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 08:32 AM

I'm not really aware of how much voice actors actually make in a gig, but if Stephen had like a TON of cash then maybe he'd be able to do something for free just to help out or you know... Tribute?

But uhm...


Well, pretty sure he would be a member of some actors union and they likely wouldn't allow that.





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