Jump to content


Photo

Vulkan


  • Please log in to reply
35 replies to this topic

#1 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 16 February 2016 - 07:55 PM

In Talos Principle the Vulkan beta renderer (available via beta channel) is on par with OpenGL one, testing with beta AMD Catalyst suite ( http://support.amd.com/en-us/kb-articles/Pages/Radeon-Vulkan-Beta.aspx ).Good start! (Win 7 64 + Radeon 7850 system)

 

I'll wait next official NV drivers for Win10+GeForce 750 Ti tests.

 


Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#2 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 16 February 2016 - 08:33 PM

Some benchmarks (Fury X vs 980 Ti)

 

http://www.computerb...alos-principle/


Edited by lowenz, 16 February 2016 - 08:34 PM.

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#3 bedhead

bedhead

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 57 posts

Posted 17 February 2016 - 04:58 AM

Vulkan loses to dx11? :mellow:



#4 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 17 February 2016 - 05:35 AM

Vulkan loses to dx11? :mellow:

Beta driver with beta renderer vs established technology.


Edited by lowenz, 17 February 2016 - 05:36 AM.

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#5 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 17 February 2016 - 09:34 AM

About Talos Beta renderer.....it's really a beta but well performing in this state

 

engine design for Vulkan is basically consited of three major parts:\

1)
Port. Make it work as fast as possible just by wrapping current engine design around Vulkan. Avoid all pitfalls and bottlenecks. This is what we did by now and released as patch for Talos.

2)
Use Vulkan for multi-threaded rendering. Our engine is designed really well for multi-threaded rendering, but we have only our wrapper for it - calls to graphics API (like Vulkan) are not multi-threaded. Yet.
That being said, this is the next step what we'll do. And probably release that also as patch for Talos. I tried to do that with Direct3D 11 long time ago (support for its deffered contexts), but it was too much pain and too little or even no gain. frown.gif That's just one of reasons why we decided to stick with our own approach for MT renderer for that long. :/

3)
Redesign engine for Vulkan. This is the biggest step and can be split in two:

3a)
Precache all rendering states (which mostly mean materials in game) up front. This will make rendering calls much simplier and faster. So, instead of deciding at rendering time what is needed for a material to be rendered via Vulkan, do this at loading time and then when material needs to be rendered just give it to Vulkan, via one or two simple function calls.

3b)
Precache all geometry, material, textures, everything that is needed for rendering an object up front. This basically creates so called command buffer ready for Vulkan, and nothing extra needs to be set or created at render time.

3rd part of port is, obviously, the most complex one, and it'll take time to change engine design for it, step-by-step.

Hope I explained this well. smile.gif
DEN


Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#6 jaxa

jaxa

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1154 posts

Posted 17 February 2016 - 06:13 PM

Vulkan loses to dx11? :mellow:

 

http://www.anandtech...talos-principle

 

To be very clear here this is an early look at Vulkan performance;  Croteam admits from the get-go that their current implementation is very early, and is not as fast as their now highly tuned DirectX 11 implementation. Furthermore The Talos Principle is not a title that’s designed to exploit the CPU utilization and draw call improvements that are central to Vulkan (unlike say Star Swarm when we first looked at DX12). So with that in mind, it’s important to set reasonable expectations of what’s to come.

Edited by jaxa, 17 February 2016 - 06:14 PM.


#7 MoroseTroll

MoroseTroll

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 279 posts

Posted 18 February 2016 - 03:38 PM

It's sad that Apple chose to ignore Vulkan :(.



#8 Spooks

Spooks

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 301 posts

Posted 19 February 2016 - 05:33 PM

My GPU cannot into Vulkan  -_- but yay for open source standards! Valve have been talking about Vulkan in Dota 2 this and that, but it's funny that it's a Serious Engine game to be the first one to utilize it. That and Croteam mentioning SS4 will have photometry makes Serious Engine sound ever more interesting. 


My FMs: The King of Diamonds (2016)

 

Visit my Mapbook thread sometimes!


#9 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 19 February 2016 - 08:28 PM

Last Serious Engine incarnation (Talos Principle) is simply amazing.


Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#10 MoroseTroll

MoroseTroll

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 279 posts

Posted 20 February 2016 - 05:23 AM

Spooks: I suppose Valve is currently working on the Vulkan version of DotA 2 especially for SteamOS.

 

lowenz: Yes, the engine is very fast and looks pretty.



#11 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 22 September 2016 - 04:36 PM

Last benchmarks with my overclocked Radeon 7850 (1 GB), Crimson 16.9.2 and Talos :D

 

Gap is closing with High/Ultra settings!

 

Vulkan: 79.2

D3D11: 85.6


Edited by lowenz, 22 September 2016 - 04:37 PM.

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#12 MoroseTroll

MoroseTroll

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 279 posts

Posted 23 September 2016 - 09:41 AM

What about Doom 2016?



#13 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 23 September 2016 - 11:07 AM

Don't own it, but the demo runs very well :D


Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#14 AluminumHaste

AluminumHaste

    Darkmod Contributor

  • Development Role
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 5547 posts

Posted 23 September 2016 - 11:09 AM

It's sad that Apple chose to ignore Vulkan :(.

Why? Since when is Apple and Gaming ever mentioned in the same sentence lol.


I always assumed I'd taste like boot leather.

 

#15 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 24 September 2016 - 07:49 AM

Last benchmarks with my overclocked Radeon 7850 (1 GB), Crimson 16.9.2 and Talos :D

 

Gap is closing with High/Ultra settings!

 

Vulkan: 79.2

D3D11: 85.6

And with the GeForce 750 Ti, same settings (but another processor):

 

Vulkan: 65

D3D11: 69

 

Really really close.....nice to see for a new API set :D


Edited by lowenz, 24 September 2016 - 07:50 AM.

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#16 MoroseTroll

MoroseTroll

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 279 posts

Posted 24 September 2016 - 11:47 AM

Why? Since when is Apple and Gaming ever mentioned in the same sentence lol.

Look at Steam games - a lot of them have Mac versions (actually 8231). Which means that Mac is a relatively popular game platform. If so, it would be nice if this platform adopts an industrial standard APIs, like Vulkan, instead of a proprietary ones, like Metal. I think the less difficulties game developers have during porting their products to Mac, the better.


Edited by MoroseTroll, 24 September 2016 - 11:48 AM.


#17 AluminumHaste

AluminumHaste

    Darkmod Contributor

  • Development Role
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 5547 posts

Posted 24 September 2016 - 12:08 PM

Sure there are lots, no one seems to be using them though.

If you look at the steam hardware breakdown you see:

 

Windows 95.71%
OSX 3.34%
Linux 0.83%

 

Sure people play on Macs, but not enough to really matter.

 

Of course it would be great for Apple to adopt Vulkan for the mobile side, which would speed acceptance.


I always assumed I'd taste like boot leather.

 

#18 MoroseTroll

MoroseTroll

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 279 posts

Posted 24 September 2016 - 01:47 PM

Also, it's well-known that an average Mac user is way more richer than an average PC user. If this rule is correct in case of games, then probably 3.34% of OS X users own a share more than 3.34% ;).



#19 AluminumHaste

AluminumHaste

    Darkmod Contributor

  • Development Role
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 5547 posts

Posted 24 September 2016 - 01:55 PM

Huh? That percentage is of the people who USE macs to play games on Steam. What does it matter if Mac owners buy 500 games and never play them?


I always assumed I'd taste like boot leather.

 

#20 MoroseTroll

MoroseTroll

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 279 posts

Posted 24 September 2016 - 02:10 PM

From the point of view of game developer or publisher, it doesn't matter whether the consumer plays the games (s)he bought or not :).



#21 AluminumHaste

AluminumHaste

    Darkmod Contributor

  • Development Role
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 5547 posts

Posted 24 September 2016 - 02:14 PM

I suppose.


I always assumed I'd taste like boot leather.

 

#22 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 26 November 2016 - 04:36 PM

Picked DOOM in the lastest Black Friday sales just to test how much a AAA Vulkan renderer implementation can be awesome :|

 

Not only I can play DOOM @Ultra Quality with an old 7850 getting 40 FPS @1920x1080 (no AA and MB) but the GPU temperature is much lower than my typical 60-70 thresold!


Edited by lowenz, 26 November 2016 - 04:37 PM.

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#23 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 06 December 2016 - 05:44 PM

Intel Vulkan-ready (tested with DOOM and Talos Principle) drivers: http://www.geeks3d.c...pic,4778.0.html

 

It's awesome, with the Skylake HD 530 I got 35 FPS in Talos Principle @1920x1080+full details.....Intel GPUs are really killed by RAM bandwidth (dual channel 64 bit). With Vulkan & dedicated RAM (IRIS) they show all their power.

DOOM runs really well @Ultra (!) @1280x720. Yes, on the Intel GPU.


Edited by lowenz, 06 December 2016 - 05:46 PM.

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.


#24 MoroseTroll

MoroseTroll

    Member

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 279 posts

Posted 07 December 2016 - 02:39 AM

I wonder why Arkane is still using DX11 in its Void Engine, whereas they can call a few guys from id Software (say, Axel Gneiting and Tiago Sousa) for help to implement Vulkan? Both companies are now parts of Bethesda, so what's the problem? According to VGChartz and SteamSpy, Dishonored 1 is more a PC game (3,75 mln), than a console game (3,76 mln on four platforms: 360 + PS3 + XBO + PS4), so I think Bethesda & Arkane both should undestand how important the PC version of Dishonored 2 is, because this time, there are only two console platfroms (XBO + PS4).



#25 lowenz

lowenz

    Advanced Member

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1473 posts

Posted 07 January 2017 - 08:45 AM



Intel Vulkan-ready (tested with DOOM and Talos Principle) drivers: http://www.geeks3d.c...pic,4778.0.html

 

It's awesome, with the Skylake HD 530 I got 35 FPS in Talos Principle @1920x1080+full details.....Intel GPUs are really killed by RAM bandwidth (dual channel 64 bit). With Vulkan & dedicated RAM (IRIS) they show all their power.

DOOM runs really well @Ultra (!) @1280x720. Yes, on the Intel GPU.

There was a fluke. You got to disable the main GPU otherwise DoomVK will run on that no matter you set as active GPU+monitor.

 

With the main GPU disabled in device manager these are the results (with the lastest VK ready Intel drivers, from Dell: http://www.geeks3d.com/forums/index.php/topic,4829.0.html )

 

image.jpg

 

Not bad!(1280x720 + High preset)


Edited by lowenz, 07 January 2017 - 08:46 AM.

Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users