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#176 AluminumHaste

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Posted 26 June 2017 - 11:17 AM

Yeah, Devil's Canyon is a beast, no reason for you to upgrade yet unless you need the extra cores for streaming/encoding.

Encoding seems to scale almost linearly with Cores, I'd love to have 6/8/10/18 cores lol.


I always assumed I'd taste like boot leather.

 

#177 jaxa

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Posted 09 July 2017 - 01:59 PM

The Ethereum Effect: Graphics Card Price Watch (Updated)



#178 jaxa

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Posted 27 July 2017 - 05:40 PM

The AMD Ryzen 3 1300X and Ryzen 3 1200 CPU Review: Zen on a Budget

 

Both are quad-core, but with 1 thread per core. $129 and $109 and they each come with a cooler.

 

Once you overclock them, they become a much better value than the comparable Intel chips.


Edited by jaxa, 27 July 2017 - 06:14 PM.

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#179 bobrpggamer

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Posted 02 August 2017 - 11:09 PM

Moved benchmarks


Edited by bobrpggamer, 03 August 2017 - 12:55 PM.


#180 jaxa

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Posted 02 August 2017 - 11:38 PM

http://www.anandtech...9-usd-august-31

 

First Threadripper chips available on the 10th. Threadripper has also been scaled down to an 8-core version with all of the PCIe lanes, available at the end of the month.



#181 bobrpggamer

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Posted 02 August 2017 - 11:41 PM

Sorry for the double post.


Edited by bobrpggamer, 03 August 2017 - 12:56 PM.


#182 bobrpggamer

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Posted 02 August 2017 - 11:44 PM

I had no Idea an i9 was out, I usually check every month or so at new-egg so this is something to look into and the Broadwell 6950x is a joke at the price they ask, the second Broadwell extreme edition down is around a $1000.00

 

All the X299 Mobo's are bizarre looking with its off angle cuts and anti-symmetry wired looks.

 

44 lanes now - 2 16x SLI - 2 4x M2 boot drives (press F8) and a 1x HT-Omega Sound Card.

 

Look at the speed of these M2 cards https://www.newegg.c...598&ignorebbr=1 you could boot in 5 seconds, well maybe.

 

Anyone interested in a new build, the best cases I have seen ever are Case Labs. You can mount anything in any way like an erector set, you can even mount the power supply in the case to hide it: http://www.caselabs-...e.com/pc-cases/

 

You can have a cube case with 2 motherboards and up to 32 3.5 hard drives or up to 64 SSDs with this one: http://www.caselabs-...0-customizable/


Edited by bobrpggamer, 03 August 2017 - 12:55 PM.


#183 jaxa

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Posted 10 August 2017 - 08:38 AM

http://www.anandtech...nd-1920x-review

https://arstechnica....ew-1950x-1920x/

 

Threadripper 1950X and 1920X reviewed. 16 cores for $1000, 12 cores for $800 (there is also the unannounced TR 1920 with 12 cores and lower clock that could be cheaper).



#184 Bikerdude

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Posted 10 August 2017 - 09:32 AM

Yeah, AMD are back baby!

 

I never did like Intel and to date I have never bought a brand new cpu from them, only ever second hand. But all the Ryzen hubbub has reminded people about he old facts about how Intel stiffed AMD from the beginning and used legal bollox to screw them over for over a decade.

 

Intel in a Nutshell are f**ked, they have been sitting on their collective laurels for far too long. AMD have come in and kicked them squarely in the family jewels, just like they did with the Athlon 64 series only this time AMD have got the desktop and server markets covered.

 

And the proverbial skeleton in the closet, Intel now see themselves as an Israeli company (with kickbacks to the Netanyahu regime) Yet another reason to never to ever buy anything from them period.



#185 bobrpggamer

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Posted 11 August 2017 - 02:22 AM

Yeah, AMD are back baby!

I had a K6 350 and i have to say it was garbage compared to the Pentium 3 in gaming - before I get anyone upset - I also had a 800MHZ Duron and it was a decent Celeron contender, Then I bought a AMD a 1700xp upgraded to a 2000xp i think, then to a 4000+ that I still have in my computer tool chest the the dual core AMD Athlon 64 X2 4800+.

 

I had my first pseudo dual core Intel Pentium 4 just for the hyperthreading during render time, and it was garbage.

 

Then came the Core 2 Quad and I have been an Intel slave since - my latest was a 3960X and it is a good match for my GTX 1080.

 

Funny thing I played the first 2 Thief's with that AMD 350 and I would get a slide show on certain part of the Shipping and Receiving mission, of course i had a crappy video card probably the Diamond Stealth III S530 S3 Savage 4 Pro PCI, I don't quite remember but it was PCI and had S3 Texture compression



#186 jaxa

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Posted 11 August 2017 - 07:40 AM

Funny thing I played the first 2 Thief's with that AMD 350 and I would get a slide show on certain part of the Shipping and Receiving mission, of course i had a crappy video card probably the Diamond Stealth III S530 S3 Savage 4 Pro PCI, I don't quite remember but it was PCI and had S3 Texture compression

 

You could probably get vanilla Thief running on a smartwatch these days (although that's actually a RasPi). Not sure about NewDark missions with quintillions of potential polygons.

 

Intel in a Nutshell are f**ked, they have been sitting on their collective laurels for far too long. AMD have come in and kicked them squarely in the family jewels, just like they did with the Athlon 64 series only this time AMD have got the desktop and server markets covered.

 

Intel fans are probably still willing to pay a premium for Intel chips. They are partially justified since AMD still lags in single-threaded performance and single-threaded IPC is still the most important performance factor for most users. They may just pick up an i5-7640X (4 cores, 4 threads) and call it a day.

 

Success for AMD doesn't mean getting a majority of the desktop/HEDT/SHED market. They are probably counting on hitting just 20%. They may have succeeded at doing that. But 50% would be an astonishing win for AMD and the company doesn't believe it will happen.

 

Threadripper is a niche product for consumers at a great price per core but still priced out of many builds (don't forget to add a costly motherboard). Businesses and labs may have more success with it, using it as a cheap non-Epyc alternative to Xeons. But wait, the prices for those 16-core Epyc chips are very reasonable... $650 for the 16-core Epyc 7281, WOW. The clock speeds are lower, but still...

 

AMD may have 7nm chips coming as soon as say, 2019. They are going to skip the 10nm node just like they skipped 20/22nm, but this time GloFo and others are supposedly going to get there much faster, and maybe ASML will finally have EUV lithography ready to make it easier. What happens between now and then will determine whether AMD can keep this up. Intel has delayed 10nm for a long time but is getting there soon, and Intel's nodes are said to be denser than competitors'. Intel 14nm Coffee Lake will have a 6-core i5-8400 for pretty cheap. To be announced August 21.

 

Ryzen has been a desktop-first launch so we have yet to get our hands on the laptop chips (codenamed Raven Ridge). Unfortunately, it seems that AMD has no plans to put 6 or 8 cores into laptop APUs anytime soon (Raven Ridge this year, Gray Hawk in 2019), which I would lay down some money for. There are rumors that Coffee Lake laptop chips could have up to 6 cores in 2018 which would be disappointing if AMD takes 2-3 years to match that (based on the roadmaps I linked).



#187 bobrpggamer

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Posted 16 August 2017 - 04:42 PM

 

You could probably get vanilla Thief running on a smartwatch these days (although that's actually a RasPi). Not sure about NewDark missions with quintillions of potential polygons

Yeah, I give some time to look at the smartwatch, I think I will stick with AMD k6 350 for as long as god will continue to pay my rent for me for the next 10 years (gosh I hope so), then I may look into an AMD xp 2100,and then I will be cooking with gas.

 

I think that god has better solutions for health care and a nice 1266 dollars strait from the heavens, it's usually a better solution compared to welfare and stuff.

 

Guys if you don't like me just ban me, i am not going to make a big deal about it.


Edited by bobrpggamer, 17 August 2017 - 11:30 PM.


#188 Bikerdude

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 06:09 PM

Not news per'se, but as I haven't seen many people testing the following 3 platforms against each other I figured I post something in this thread...

 

Old system:

  • Core i7 4790k / Z97
  • 16GB DDR3 1600 dual channel
  • Samsung 960 pro
  • nVidia GTX1070
  • SoundBlaster Xfi pci

Alt system 1:

  • Core i7 6850k / X99
  • 16GB DDR4 2400 quad channel
  • Samsung 960 pro
  • nVidia GTX1070
  • SoundBlaster Z pcie

Alt system 2:

  • Ryzen 5 1600x / X370 (and if I keep this system, will change that to Ryzen 7 1800x)
  • 8GB DDR4 2400 dual channel (and if I keep this system, will change that to 16GB DDR4 3200 dual channel)
  • Samsung 960 pro
  • nVidia GTX1070
  • SoundBlaster Z pcie

The 6850k system is installed atm, and the Ryzen kit arriving tomoz, the Ryzen/4790 setup's will be run out of the box. Is there anything TDM or otherwise (within reason) people would like me to test? And if so would people like me to start a separate thread..?

 

I have already done a bunch of testing on the 4790k (as I have had that for a while), the 6850k system is a week old and I have done a number of tests to compare that to the 4790k. There are several things I have noticed between the 4790 & 6850 based systems both of which were running windows 7 x64, and I will be testing the Ryzen system with win7 also. 

 

I did do several searches for reviews of Ryzen/Win7 but the info is sparse and inaccurate in some cases, as senior engineer I don't take too much stock in the scaremongering and circle-jerk that you see online. I am very much of the mindset of, if you want something done then do it yourself. There are already Win7 drivers on the mobo website and I will be applying (if required) the 3rd party patch for getting around M$ bullshit windows update bollox.

 

The idea behind the 6850/X99 7 Ryzen/X370 system if that will offer future proffing for when I am forced to upgrade my OS, but for the time being I want if at all possible to stay on Win7. The first non-OS issue I have seen with X99 is boot times, on the Z97 chipset I can boot from cold to desktop in under 15-20 seconds. On the X99 this various from 35-43 seconds, which while not the end of the world is a bit irksome. I have seen a few places showing the Ryzen/X370 being as slow to post as the X99 but I will see for myself tomoz.


Edited by Bikerdude, 19 August 2017 - 06:15 PM.


#189 duzenko

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 01:28 PM

Maybe test the "com_smp 1" performance gain in svn exe?



#190 Bikerdude

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 02:16 PM

Maybe test the "com_smp 1" performance gain in svn exe?

I have no idea what that is, I dont code or understand how do. So how would I test the above..?



#191 duzenko

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 02:34 PM

it's a new console command to allow the tdm engine to run on two cpu cores



#192 Bikerdude

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 03:27 PM

it's a new console command to allow the tdm engine to run on two cpu cores

Ah ok, well that command will have the same amount of perf on all 3 of the above systems and Im sure there and a number of people on here with dual or quad core CPu's in thier rigs.

 

On the testing front with the Ryzen setup this evening I have observed the following -

  • On the shipped bios and booting from a Win7 USB stick the machine BSOD'd. So did a bios update and that fixed that.
  • Cold to desktop on the Ryzen system is almost as fast as my 4790k/Z97 system. 20-30 versus 15-20, both of which are better than the X99 @ 45.


#193 MoroseTroll

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Posted 21 August 2017 - 05:48 AM

According to my own tests, Zen works with 128-bit SIMD code (at least SSE1-4, I haven't tested AVX1-2 yet) faster than even Skylake by 1.1-1.5 times. I suppose this is because of Zen's 4-way SIMD unit, comparing to 3-way SIMD unit in Skylake (and in its predecessors, Haswell & Broadwell, and even in its successors, Kaby Lake, Kaby Lake refresh, Coffee Lake, and probably even Cannon Lake). Of course, Zen will lose if you run 256-bit (4 ways * 128 bits < 3 ways * 256 bits) or 512-bit AVX-code, but as long as you guys don't do it, Zen is probably the best choice for TDM, IMHO.



#194 Bikerdude

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Posted 21 August 2017 - 10:41 AM

Whats the best way benchmark that?



#195 MoroseTroll

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Posted 21 August 2017 - 12:04 PM

Um... What about a pre-recorded fly-by, or perhaps, dmap some big mission?



#196 Bikerdude

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Posted 21 August 2017 - 01:22 PM

dmap some big mission?

That I can do, but I didnt think SIMD was for in-game only..?



#197 MoroseTroll

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Posted 21 August 2017 - 02:56 PM

Crap, I forgot that! Still, I think it's good to know how fast/slow is Zen in this very tough operation.



#198 Bikerdude

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Posted 22 August 2017 - 04:28 AM

Didnt have much time last night, but managed to do a comparison 3Dmark run between the 4790k@4.5Ghz, 6850k@4.2Ghz and the 1600x@ 3.8Ghz

  • 4790k - 15460
  • 6850k - 16290
  • 1600x - 16300

Whats impressive is the 1600x was running at stock!, and  as I will be swapping the 1600 for a 1700 or 1800 if I can find one that score will only improve. Another plus point fpor the ryzen system is the boot times - 

 

  • 4790k - 15-20 seconds
  • 6850k - 35-45 s
  • 1600x - 25-35 s

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#199 Bikerdude

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Posted 28 August 2017 - 06:14 AM

Alt system 1:
  • Core i7 6850k / X99
  • 16GB DDR4 2400 quad channel
  • Samsung 960 pro
  • nVidia GTX1070
  • SoundBlaster Z pcie

Alt system 2:

  • Ryzen 5 1600x / X370 (and if I keep this system, will change that to Ryzen 7 1800x)
  • 8GB DDR4 2400 dual channel (and if I keep this system, will change that to 16GB DDR4 3200 dual channel)
  • Samsung 960 pro
  • nVidia GTX1070
  • SoundBlaster Z pcie

Send the X99/6850k system back for a refund due to the slow and irregular boot time issue, and have been testing the ryzen based setup. Long story short I have been getting a BSOD when booting from either my Samsung evo SSD or the windows 7 USB install stick when I have my m.2 to PCIe adapter with my Samsung 960 pro installed in the second PCIe 3.0 slot on the X370 motherboard -

 

So I bought another m.2 PCIe adapter and borrowed a friends m.2 PCIe adapter along with his Samsung Sm951, so now I have 3x m.2 PCIe adapters (my original generic adapter, my friends generic adapter and the KryoM.2 adapter),  and 2x NVMe SSD's (Samsubng 960 pro 1TB, Samsung Sm951 256GB) to test with -

 

My generic m.2 PCIe adapter -

  • 960 - BSOD
  • 951 - Boots to desktop

Friends generic m.2 PCIe adapter -

  • 960 - Boots to desktop
  • 951 - Boots to desktop

Kryo m.2 PCIe adapter -

  • 960 - Boots to desktop
  • 951 - Boots to desktop

The 'Msi x370 sli plus' for some reason does not like my generic m.2 PCIe adapter with the 960 installed, which is extremely specific kind of incompatibility. My Generic m.2 PCIe adapter with the 960 boots fine in my 'Msi Z97 Krait' and 'Msi Z97-G43' motherboards.

 

With my friends generic m.2 PCIe adapter and his Sm951 I did a factory reset on the 951 and reinstalled windows 7. Unfortunately either the mother bios or the AMD motherboard driver are not mature as I am seeing random irregularities -

  1. I will do a simple restart of the motherboard and it will take longer to get to windows 7 desktop than if I were to boot from cold (an extra 5 seconds or so) and this dosent make sense.
  2. I will do a simple restart of the motherboard and the motherboard will do a double boot, where is gets to the BIOS post screen then does a full reboot and eventually gets to windows 7 desktop.
  3. I will do a simple restart of the motherboard and it will spin the CPU fan to 100% and just sit there not posting  and not booting into windows.

For 2/3 I just turn the system off, wait 5 seconds then power on and the motherboard boots normally. The motherboard needs to boot reliably 90% of the time, atm this figure is 33-50% of the time - this kind of behaviour is a show stopper for me...!!!

 

I then tried to install the AMD system drivers, but the install fails with a COM surrogate error, which I learn is because there is a required windowsupdate patch. So I run windows update, doing the first round of updates before it requests a reboot. I reboot and run windows update again and then get the windows popup that displays the "you have a new CPU error code 8024003 popup" ... which as we all now is just Micro$soft bull$hit -

  1. Upto this point the motherboard starting from cold, takes 13 second to bios post screen then 30-33 seconds to windows desktop (which is still 10 seconds slower than my Z97/4790k)
  2. I then install the 3rd party patch (Zeffy) to get around the above M$ Bull$hit and install the remaining dozen or so remaining windowsupdates.
  3. Now from cold the motherboard takes upto 15 seconds to bios post and then upto 45 seconds to windows desktop.

The system as it stands is as slow to boot to the windows 7 desktop as the 'Msi x99 Sli plus' and 6850k I tested, so I am trying to find a program to log windows boot so I can try and see What the F**! its doing for those extra 12-15 seconds.

 

I am doing some remaining tests around the regular tasks I do, compiling TDM maps, archiving & gaming. If the system is slower on 2 out of 3 of those, that along with the above issues will mean the motherboard and Ryzen will go back to amazon for a refund.



#200 Bikerdude

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Posted 28 August 2017 - 06:25 AM

I am doing some remaining tests around the regular tasks I do, compiling TDM maps, archiving & gaming. If the system is slower on 2 out of 3 of those, that along with the above issues will mean the motherboard and Ryzen will go back to amazon for a refund.

So did a DMAP compare of a large city map I am working on atm -

 

Ryzen 5 1600x @ 4.0Ghz - 2m 44s

Core i7 4790k @4.2Ghz - 1m 51s

 

So straight off the bat my TDM workflow is impacted, its almost a minute slower just on that task alone. Now I know single thread perf on my 4790 as going to better but I wasn't expecting the 1600x to be this slow. For anyone upgrading from a lower spec system than me, it would be a killer system and worth the cash due to the multi-core perf. I really really wanted to give AMD some money, but its gonna have to wait till both Bios's drivers mature and AMD's single thread perf matches or improves on what I currently have.

 

For giggles I will do a compression/decompression with 7zip using LMZA2 to see how the 1600 compares to the 4790.







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: amd, nvidia, intel, cpu, gpu, zen, pascal, kaby lake, skylake, vega

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