FM's using Vine Arrow

[Oldjim]

I was just checking the settings now I have upgraded to 2.04 and noticed that a Vine Arrow is listed in the weapon short cut keys but I don't remember any FM using one - is there one

[nbohr1more]

Vine arrows have been available since v1.07:

 

http://www.moddb.com/mods/the-dark-mod/news/the-dark-mod-v107-is-out

 

but I don't recall any missions that featured them other than the "In the Black" beta.

[grayman]

I don't recall any missions using them (I haven't done so).

 

Rope arrows present problems for map builders when they put wood high up on a building, but they don't want the player going up there. So they usually end up using stone high up.

 

Vine arrows, however, create vines that stick to stone, and cause the same problem, so they're prolly not put into maps by mappers.

[brethren]

The idea of a vine sticking to stone seems odd - In T2 it made a bit more sense when a vine would wrap around a vent or grill structure.

[New Horizon]

They're like creeping vine patches you see in real life. I've used them in test missions and they're really cool. They're not huge patches so you have to plan placement for vertical or horizontal movement. A water arrow will let them grow a little bit more.

[New Horizon]

[grayman]

The idea of a vine sticking to stone seems odd - In T2 it made a bit more sense when a vine would wrap around a vent or grill structure.

 

[Melan]

That's a lot of water arrows.

[ERH+]

So if no one have use it we can still change rules. And such multiplication of entities is for what reason other than alliance with Victoria? It is upgraded rope arrow, so game logic suggest that player at one stage is restricted to smaller number of areas and get a buff as a game progress - like in Thief3 when he can't reach arrow spawn points until he get climbing gloves. IMO gloves gives more diversity than wine arrows, rope/wine arrow just don't seem to affect imagination so people don't consider it a real choose.

[brethren]

Grayman - Ha, I was thinking more of something that would stick instantly, not over the course of 10 years.

 

Wait, so, a vine arrow doesn't actually deploy any kind of rope/vine that you can climb up? Just creates a climbable surface? Man, you could have a lot of fun with that.

[nbohr1more]

Yeah, you could rename them to Ivy Arrow based on how they look and function.

[grayman]

yeah, they're more ivy arrows than vine arrows, but the name and function were chosen long before i worked on them.

 

i think the coolest aspect is you can make the patches grow in any direction using water arrows, even sideways (window to window) or down (out a window and down if you have no rope arrows or you do but there's no wood above you)

[New Horizon]

So if no one have use it we can still change rules.

 

I don't think that would be a fair thing to do at this point. There was a ton of thought, planning, and programming behind how they function. Having used them in test maps, and spawned them into some existing maps, I can tell you that they offer a different type of versatility than rope arrows. The mapper could definitely have some fun planning some additional entrances into locations, or otherwise hard to reach areas. I don't think we've ever fully promoted them, which may be the reason for them not being used.

 

You can find two Vine Arrows in the training mission. Go to the archery section, and at the far end past the target range you can go up into the tower. You'll find the two Vine Arrows in there. You'll have to get your hands on some water arrows as well to help them expand.

[grayman]

 

Are they included in the tutorial mission? If not, that might not be a bad idea. lol

 

I don't think so. We should add them and release the changed tut with 2.05.

[Destined]

The arrows look really nice. However, I would not use them, if I have to use more than one or two additional water arrows in order to make it grow to the height I need. I would suggest to increase the amount of growth along this direction, although I do not know, if this possible.

[New Horizon]

The arrows look really nice. However, I would not use them, if I have to use more than one or two additional water arrows in order to make it grow to the height I need. I would suggest to increase the amount of growth along this direction, although I do not know, if this possible.

 

A mission designed with them in mind would likely ensure the player had enough water arrows nearby to grow the vine arrows. It's also a matter of item management for the player though. You make a choice. Perhaps the mapper gives you vine arrows to avoid a bunch of guards and gain easier access to a mansion, but you then expend some resources in return for that reduction in risk. It's all about balance.

[New Horizon]

 

I don't think so. We should add them and release the changed tut with 2.05.

 

There are two vine arrows hidden in the tower in the archery section, but there's no popup explaining how they work.

[grayman]

 

There are two vine arrows hidden in the tower in the archery section, but there's no popup explaining how they work.

 

I added a tracker issue to add some practice help using the 2 arrows in the tower.

[Oldjim]

Just had a go with them and the area is quite small but you can go from one to the next even with a reasonable gap

[rich_is_bored]

What triggers the growth behind the scenes? Is it a water stim? Could a map author create a "path" for vines to grow on?

[grayman]

What triggers the growth behind the scenes? Is it a water stim? Could a map author create a "path" for vines to grow on?

 

The script "tdm_weapon_vinearrow_result.script" manages the planting and growth of the vine.

 

Each piece of vine reacts to a water stim. I suppose if you placed a trail of invisible entities across a wall, gave them water stims, and turned the stims off initially, you could turn them on in some timed sequence later to simulate growth of the vine.

[kingsal]

I'm actually using the vine arrows pretty extensively in my next FM. I think they're pretty awesome

 

However, I've noticed that using lots of them in one area can get pretty heavy on the draw calls, I'm not entirely sure why. Maybe its worth investigating?

 

I'm going to look into making the effected area much larger as well as a test. Currently, its so small I have to give the player loads of vine arrows or water arrows which makes them underwhelming and a little cumbersome.

 

 

Anyways, It would be awesome to see Vine arrows improved on and used in more FMs.