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TDM 2.04 updater and XP


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#51 nbohr1more

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Posted 13 March 2017 - 10:31 PM

Hmm.

 

I can't reproduce that.

 

If I fly behind that wall, there's only one glare close enough to possibly pop-through.

 

Maybe one of the mirrors still has an old version?

 

Try:

 

1) Delete the FM again

2) Set this mirror to 10

 

[Mirror darkmod.taaaki.za.net]
url = http://darkmod.taaaki.za.net/release/
weight = 10

 

in tdm_mirrors.txt

 

3) set all other mirrors to 0

 

4) run tdm_updater with the option to "keep mirrors"

 

If problem persists, I will suggest there may be a driver issue?

 

What GPU again?


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#52 SneaksieDave

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 08:28 AM

Doesn't appear to be about the mission.  As for the gpu, brace yourself:  GF7950GT.  Yes it's old, but all drivers are at max (302.something) and it does the job well for almost* everything I need.

 

It is something I can live with, but I'm left wondering if something can't be done to fix it easy.  Idtech4 shaders always seem so ridiculously flexible and powerful, able to do things I wouldn't even have wished at.  Seems like a simple issue of... stuff I don't know enough about to guess.  Z-orders and buffer crap and whatever-other-majicks-and-mysteries.  Any idea what SteveL's fix was?  I see he hasn't been active for a while.

 

 

*I'd like to be able to run SpaceEngine, but no dice.



#53 nbohr1more

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 08:40 AM

Try disabling soft particles:

 

seta r_useSoftParticles "0"

 

It didn't change anything for me but I know that some folks have had problems with the new shaders with Depth Capture fixes.


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#54 SneaksieDave

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 08:46 AM

Now we're onto it!  r_useSoftParticles 0 addressed it.

 

I guess the question now becomes:

1.  why?  what is it about soft particles that does this?  where/how are they defined?  Can it be 'fixed' to not cause this side-effect?

2.  what does a user lose by disabling them (obviously soft particles, but what all does that include and ultimately mean)?

 

Also just to confirm (though it's already clear;  I took this pic as you replied) it's not about the training map specifically:

stlucia_2017_03_14_09_39_24.jpg

 

That smoke is from the chimney a few surfaces behind where it's showing through the building.



#55 nbohr1more

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 09:03 AM

Soft Particles were introduced in 2.03

 

 

They use branching in the ARB shader to check against the Depth Buffer and see if a particle pixel should be in front of

a the scene. Interestingly, your cards should have full support for that but somehow it's failing.

 

Does the Water Shader fix (which also uses Depth Capture) also fail on your card?

 

If so, I guess you should also just disable Depth based shaders altogether:

 

seta r_skipDepthCapture "1"


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#56 SneaksieDave

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 10:27 AM

The water shader fix appears to work fine.  In fact, enabling r_skipDepthCapture seems to cause a different, worse side effect -- some triangles of the water 'freeze' (pic 1).  They simply stop animation the distortion effect.  Turn r_skipDepthCapture back off and they begin animating again, and the front geometry stops distorting with the water. (pic 2)

 

stlucia_1.jpg

stlucia_2.jpg

 

 

Oddly, r_useSoftParticles seems to behave the same with the fog in the st. lucia sewer regardless of whether I turn it on or off.  I can upload pics if you wish to see but they're not very exciting (all showing same thing basically).  However, when I toggled the value on/off in the training mission, at a spot near the canal where a stairwell to a door is lit with some soft particles, I actually experienced the particle 'edges' with r_useSoftParticles ON, and didn't get it with the fix turned OFF.  I triple checked to make sure I wasn't goofing something up, but it happened each time.  WTH?

 

This one shows the banding:

shot3.jpg

 

And here is after turning off soft particles (no banding, or greatly reduced):

shot4.jpg

 

Just a bonus pic to show how jarring/extreme the whole thing can be.  Using skipDepth or not doesn't change the image.

shot1.jpg

 

 

Edit:  So currently, my best results -- I think -- are to keep r_skipDepthCapture off (to benefit water) and r_useSoftParticles also off (to avoid particles showing through surfaces and creating edges... which, if I understand correctly, it was supposed to fix, not cause...)  :huh:



#57 nbohr1more

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 10:56 AM

Thanks for that.

 

So the water shader is properly using Depth but soft particles aren't. Interesting.

 

Seems like something is messing with the Depth values passed to the shader.

 

Is your driver set to allow negative LOD bias?


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#58 SneaksieDave

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 11:19 AM

The setting in my control panel is "Use global setting (Allow)"



#59 nbohr1more

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 11:29 AM

Hmm, maybe we should get a screenshot of your Nvidia settings page.

 

I presume that Triple Buffering is disabled?


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#60 SneaksieDave

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 11:47 AM

Here you are, and yup.

 

shot1.jpg

shot2.jpg



#61 nbohr1more

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 11:58 AM

Doom 3?

 

To be clear, you moved your Darkmod install out from under your Doom 3 install correct?

 

I would create a new profile pointed at your TheDarkMod.exe file.

 

I have anisotropic filtering optimization enabled but I doubt that would have any affect.

 

The multi-display setting has caused unexpected issues. I would suggest you set that to Single Performance.


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#62 SneaksieDave

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 12:27 PM

Yep, Doom3 is the only idtech4 offered.  My current install is actually fresh (not our working folders from over the years) and Doom3 is uninstalled.

 

I created a new thedarkmod.exe entry.  Doesn't allow the same "NVIDIA Recommended" setting for thread optimization, so I set it to auto.  Now to try the other suggestions...

 

Nope, neither seemed to change anything I could see.  :-/  Do you happen to know any problem caused by the multi setting?  That must've been leftover to years ago when I used two monitors.  Hm, I wonder if I gain performance from this change.



#63 nbohr1more

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 01:25 PM

Thread Optimization should probably be off. It has a history of causing OpenGL to stutter.

 

I think Mutli-Display is the default value but it's also both a performance pest and we've seen it cause similar

problems to DPI scaling issues in Dark Radiant.

 

With all this eliminated, I think we are at a driver bug. I don't suppose you'd be willing to try either or both

a newer or older driver version?


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#64 SneaksieDave

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 02:05 PM

Trying the threaded change.  (Note that I do have multiple CPUs it asks for, though.)

 

Re: drivers.  I am at the newest (307.83 -- I gave the wrong number above when I said 302.something), so that's covered, at least.  As for rolling back... As this is currently my only system, I'm very reluctant to start messing around with that. :mellow:

 

I do have the disabling of soft particles to fall back on, but it doesn't solve the issue, I know.  Guh.

 

Edit:  Ouch!  The threaded change dropped my FPS from ~60 to ~45.  Switching that sucker back (with a note to watch for problems).

 

Edit2:  Heh.. just noticed the arms on the clock tower go backwards.


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