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TDM 2.05 official introductory missions


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#26 Gast

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Posted 16 February 2017 - 02:58 PM

Nice mission, these architectural modules are looking sharp!



#27 Sotha

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Posted 16 February 2017 - 03:06 PM

Fun mission. Short, straightforward and sweet. 

 

There was a critical bug, unfortunately:

Spoiler

 

Got I am such a climbing noob: I was just fumbling around and gradually losing health to small falling accidents. Like a drunkard parkourer. hehe. Speaking of drunkards.. I also made a huge commotion in the bar, because I wanted to move the candle so that I could rob the cash box in darkness. I tossed the tankards at it, but the candle just moved to a better position on the table. Then the barmaid came to the rescue and pushed the candle to the floor. Good times!

 

Thanks for the mission.


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#28 Springheel

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Posted 16 February 2017 - 03:36 PM

Looks like the entity that makes stuff unfrobable was reversed somehow.

 

 

You may have missed the references on the previous page, but we tried in vain to track this down.  It happened twice in three months and could not be reproduced.  Now that we've released it, of course, everyone and his uncle has it happen.  Disheartening, to say the least.



#29 Pritchard

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Posted 16 February 2017 - 05:39 PM

I wonder if it's an issue with the sequence of events. How dangerous would it be to have them be always frobable? I suppose that would allow them to be grabbed without opening the chest, but if it makes it work 100% of the time it may be worth it.



#30 stumpy

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Posted 16 February 2017 - 06:06 PM

you could script it with a trigger on open to a setFrobbed at each of the items as long as they're named.


Edited by stumpy, 16 February 2017 - 06:06 PM.


#31 The Dark One

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Posted 16 February 2017 - 11:29 PM

For what it's worth I could frob the journal fine. Probably the ring too, if I had seen it. :P However, I have a far more serious bug to report: I start the new St. Lucia, and it freezes on the loading screen (or it was just taking forever to load and I jumped the gun, but I gave it time and it never budged). This might just have been my computer though.


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#32 Cambridge Spy

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 12:30 AM

Here's a playthrough of both introductory missions:

 

 

One thing that's bothering me is, can AIs now suspect your presence when you're up close to them from the front even when the light gem is dark? I know you recoded how the light gem works, but I noticed that I tried to hide from the maid in A New Job by hugging the kitchen corner, and yet she still suspects you while she stands there, up close. Is this the result of the new light gem mechanics?


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#33 Sotha

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 01:27 AM

You may have missed the references on the previous page, but we tried in vain to track this down.  It happened twice in three months and could not be reproduced.  Now that we've released it, of course, everyone and his uncle has it happen.  Disheartening, to say the least.


I know how it feels, been there myself, too. ;)

If the baby&wife let me, I'll have a look at it today or weekend.. The desk is probably the standard prefab desk, right? That should be configured correctly out of the box. I suspect the book touches the desk door and that causes it. At least I clearly saw the book move when the desk first opened.

Perhaps the book interrupts the desk door at low opening percentage and causes it to cycle quickly between closed and open state. This triggers the no-frob entity and puts the thing out-of-sync. Moving the book inside the desk, so that it is absolutely clear of the desk door collision area would probably fix it.
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#34 wesp5

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 03:30 AM

While Sotha is looking into the desk problems, I want to repeat the issues I had with the other guy and the names. Maybe he can fix these as well! I attached a screenshot which clearly shows that his purse looks at if it can be frobbed, but it can't. Is this a similar bug to the desk one or just a graphical problem with the purse looking much brighter than the rest of his model? Also as I wrote his name should be changed from "Lord Something" to "Body" or "Guest" and the real lord should get the lord name.

 

Last not least, what do you think about renaming the introduction missions to 1. Mission and 2. Mission to always make them stay on the top of the mission list?

Attached Files


Edited by wesp5, 17 February 2017 - 03:35 AM.


#35 grayman

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 09:09 AM

That's a mandrasola purse, which isn't frobable.



#36 Springheel

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 09:51 AM

I don't know of any easy way to update these missions without requiring a new mod update.

 

Renaming the missions isn't an option at this point as it would leave multiple copies for those that have already downloaded them. 



#37 Sotha

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 09:56 AM

I don't know of any easy way to update these missions without requiring a new mod update.

 

Renaming the missions isn't an option at this point as it would leave multiple copies for those that have already downloaded them. 

 

Can't the mission downloader bring a mission update?

 

YWpsp9V.png

 

I inspected the desk settings and they seemed to be correct.

 

See the picture? The books clip with the desk door. Books and desk door are selected in this picture.

 

This is the reason for the failure.

 

If you would use the small book model (models/darkmod/readables/book_red1_small.lwo) instead of the big tome, the books would not clip with the desk door.


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#38 grayman

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 10:09 AM

 

See the picture? The books clip with the desk door. Books and desk door are selected in this picture.

 

This is the reason for the failure.

 

 

How did you arrive at that conclusion?



#39 Sotha

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 10:28 AM

@grayman,
1) the desk settings are okay and not to blame.
2) the book bounced in the desk when I opened it and the frobbing was impeded. Thus the desk door ceetainly had an interaction with the book and with the problem.
3) the only visible issue is the book clipping.
4) if the book moved on problematic opening of the desk door and there is confirmed interaction between the book and the door, the book clipping with the door is the most likely cause.
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#40 grayman

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 10:32 AM

I've always had the book jump when opening the door, yet I've never seen the frobbing problem.

 

I've had debugging statements on the turning on and off of frobability for both the ring and the book, and have never seen improper behavior.

 

I'm not convinced that moving the book back into the desk will solve the problem. Perhaps someone who sees the problem can move the book and see what happens.



#41 Springheel

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 10:38 AM

4) if the book moved on problematic opening of the desk door and there is confirmed interaction between the book and the door, the book clipping with the door is the most likely cause.

 

 

The book has always moved for me, but I have never seen the frobbing problem. 

 

The first report of the problem was that the ring could not be frobbed, but there was no problem with the book. 

 

The only other person to have the frobbing problem (with both book and ring) also could not frob a body after dropping it, which might point to a wider issue (or may be completely unrelated).

 

I'm not convinced it's an issue related to the desk.  But since I can't get it to happen, I can't test whether moving the book would help or not.



#42 grayman

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 10:43 AM

I reiterate: If someone can get me a savegame that always leads to ring/book frobbing failure, I might be able to find the cause.

 

That's how I found the solution to the "can't frob the elevator switch" problem.



#43 wesp5

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 10:43 AM

I can state that I couldn't frob the ring inside that desk and it did not move and did not connect with the door.



#44 wesp5

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 12:52 PM

Renaming the missions isn't an option at this point as it would leave multiple copies for those that have already downloaded them. 

Wasn't something like this done with the updater when campaign missions were renamed to have the same name?



#45 Judith

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 05:35 AM

One more thing: this POV in-game cutscene at the end, it's a very useful narrative/gameplay device. You should make a step-by-step tutorial on how to use this and put it on wiki, if it isn't there already.

 

Nevermind, found it ;)


Edited by Judith, 18 February 2017 - 06:14 AM.


#46 Anderson

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 11:49 AM

Some impressions on the first mission: before going full speed in Steam when TDM gets greenlit - the mission needs to have some ambient music.

Not necessarily beefy custom ambient. Default ones will do, but the emptyness has to be filled with something properly dignified!


 "I really perceive that vanity about which most men merely prate — the vanity of the human or temporal life. I live continually in a reverie of the future. I have no faith in human perfectibility. I think that human exertion will have no appreciable effect upon humanity. Man is now only more active — not more happy — nor more wise, than he was 6000 years ago. The result will never vary — and to suppose that it will, is to suppose that the foregone man has lived in vain — that the foregone time is but the rudiment of the future — that the myriads who have perished have not been upon equal footing with ourselves — nor are we with our posterity. I cannot agree to lose sight of man the individual, in man the mass."...

 

 

- 2 July 1844 letter to James Russell Lowell from Edgar Allan Poe.

 


#47 Oldjim

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 12:15 PM

I hate ambient music as it distracts from listening for guards etc. footsteps



#48 Bikerdude

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 12:21 PM

I hate ambient music as it distracts from listening for guards etc. footsteps

Not if its done right and at the proper volume...


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#49 Anderson

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 12:35 PM

Not if its done right and at the proper volume...

100% behind that. Simply well balanced music does the job. 

As the first mission seeks to take example from Thief Deadly Shadows, there's that naturally for inspiration. It wasn't loud or obnoxious. It was minimalistic and casual for a casual night:

 


Edited by Anderson, 18 February 2017 - 12:35 PM.

 "I really perceive that vanity about which most men merely prate — the vanity of the human or temporal life. I live continually in a reverie of the future. I have no faith in human perfectibility. I think that human exertion will have no appreciable effect upon humanity. Man is now only more active — not more happy — nor more wise, than he was 6000 years ago. The result will never vary — and to suppose that it will, is to suppose that the foregone man has lived in vain — that the foregone time is but the rudiment of the future — that the myriads who have perished have not been upon equal footing with ourselves — nor are we with our posterity. I cannot agree to lose sight of man the individual, in man the mass."...

 

 

- 2 July 1844 letter to James Russell Lowell from Edgar Allan Poe.

 


#50 Oldjim

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 12:38 PM

In many games it isn't unobtrusive and unfortunately darkmod doesn't have a specific ambient music volune control






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