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dmap killing TDM after faceBsp


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#1 dmw88

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 06:46 AM

I have been trying to dmap this FM I'm working on and every time after the faceBsp phase it seems to hang. After about 30seconds the screen goes black, any sound from TDM stops, and the mouse is frozen in the middle of the screen. At this point I am forced to hard restart. Has anyone encountered this before? Please tell me my FM is not corrupted!

Edited by dmw88, 10 February 2019 - 06:51 AM.


#2 stumpy

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 05:12 PM

can take up to 5 minutes of no on screen activity to dmap huge maps, cpu goes to 100% fps goes to 0 (had fraps running once and noticed its capture rate zeroed out for 4 minutes).



#3 dmw88

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Posted 11 February 2019 - 08:29 PM

The screen goes black and the menu music stops after 30 seconds of no activity. Is this normal?

#4 dmw88

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Posted 12 February 2019 - 01:25 AM

I updated to 2.07 last night.  I just tried to dmap this same map again, first time since updating, and at the same point in the process TDM froze.  However, instead of the screen going black and freezing indefinitely, it did so only for about 10 seconds, then went to the Windows login screen, almost as if the whole machine had restarted.  Subsequent attempts to dmap went back to forcing a hard restart. I do not have this issue with any other maps.  Can anyone help?  This FM was really far into development and it is going to kill me if it's totally corrupted.

Update: I went through copying the map to a new file chunk by chunk and as soon as I get to the top floor of the main building, every room I copy over makes dmap take exponentially longer to run, until after I add a couple rooms (doesnt matter which ones) dmap locks up and I have to hard restart. Is there a brush limit? Why might this be happening?

Another update - it was when I copied over 1 of 2 hallways. I rebuilt them and theyre fine. Now Im having another issue. I built a spiral staircase and Im trying to make sure the distance between the top of the stairs and the bottom of the ones above them is enough. I put the spawn in at the bottom of the stairwell with some lights. When I spawn in everything around me is black and I slide along the floor. If I drop an object from my inventory it falls down into an endless void. What is going on??? It looks fine and is fully textured in DR. Should I just scrap this FM completely?

Edited by dmw88, 12 February 2019 - 03:36 AM.


#5 Obsttorte

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Posted 12 February 2019 - 03:19 AM

My assumption would be that you've build a lot of things out of brushes and patches including small details without converting them into func_static or exporting especially critical ones as models using the latter instead. This can lead to a very high amount of intersections splitting up those brushes and patches that does indeed has the potential to grow exponential. As all of this needs to be stored temporary you probably hit a certain limit within the source code the dmap algorithm doesn't want you to exceed.

 

So my advice would be that you go through your map and start converting detailed geometry into func_static and see what happens if you try to dmap after that.


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#6 dmw88

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Posted 12 February 2019 - 03:37 AM

Its not a big map, thats what is crazy. Only 3000 brushes. I will start changing stuff to func_static though. My understanding was that func_static doesnt cast shadows though - is this true? Also can you advise on the spiral stair issue I just mentioned above?

Edit: another issue, Im seeing a lot of phantom black rectangles through walls. I dont get why this FM is giving me all kinds of headaches that previous FMs have not

Edited by dmw88, 12 February 2019 - 04:01 AM.


#7 Judith

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Posted 12 February 2019 - 03:52 AM

My understanding was that func_static doesnt cast shadows though - is this true?

 

It's not true. It's just a class for models (static mesh is another term). In general, BSP is mostly to block out airtight spaces and to provide surfaces for AI to navigate. Other map geometry should be models.



#8 OrbWeaver

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Posted 12 February 2019 - 05:42 AM

Both out of memory issues and strange missing or black triangles suggest problems with too-complex brushwork. Converting things to models as Obsttorte suggested ought to help with this.

 

The ability to selectively disable shadows for func_statics is an additional bonus (for performance), but func_statics will cast shadows by default unless you set the noshadows property.



#9 dmw88

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Posted 12 February 2019 - 06:35 AM

I changed a lot of stuff not func_static and things are way better. I really appreciate the help and advice I get here. I hope the entertainment my FMs may provide will serve as payment

#10 Obsttorte

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Posted 12 February 2019 - 02:55 PM

We hope so, too. ;)

 

Glad we could help.


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#11 HMart

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 03:33 PM

I changed a lot of stuff not func_static and things are way better. I really appreciate the help and advice I get here. I hope the entertainment my FMs may provide will serve as payment

 

Just to reinforce or complement what has been said. Func_statics are lightheight entities that should be used for static geometry only, anything that doesn't move, anything that does move, using script code, should be a func_mover. Don't confuse with func_movable, that is for dynamic physics objects.

 

Is totally possible, to do a entire func_static/entity made level, ala Unreal Engine or Unity, kitbashing system, but know that func_statics (or any other entity class but the  "worldspawn" ) don't close the vacuum, if used for outside walls, floor, etc, the AI also don't use them to calculate navigation, nor portals take them into account, so like judith said, if you make a floor peace, func_static (even ones made from brushes converted into func_statics) you need to put a normal brush behind or below them, so it, one, closes the vacuum, two, the AI can navigate and three, you can use portals to optimize performance and audio, no need to make the brush near the func_static.

So if you for example, make a T shaped corridor, made of func_static walls, you need to make a T shaped brush shell around it.  Some inexperienced level designers tried to solve the problem by making a huge brush "room" around the entire func_static/entity made level, don't do that, it solves leaks and more or less the AI navigation but removes the ability to use portals and that is very very bad for performance and audio "navigation". 


Edited by HMart, 13 February 2019 - 03:35 PM.


#12 dmw88

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Posted Today, 03:05 AM

Thanks. I didnt know fs entities didnt block sound so Ill make sure and put brushes into my walls.

#13 Springheel

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Posted Today, 08:53 AM

Thanks. I didnt know fs entities didnt block sound so Ill make sure and put brushes into my walls.

 

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