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islipaway 3d modeler application


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Hey cheers for setting this up! I am interested in contributing fairly small stuff (at least at first). I have been using 3d packages for a few years on an on-and-off basis and would love to help you guys out with your awesome project and develop my own skills to a more professional level. At the moment I can model, UV, texture (diffuse, specular) and rig. I understand how normal mapping works but have not actually implemented it with more than the nvida filter, so that's one area I am a bit behind!

 

I am sure you guys will have a list or a general idea of all the props and such you need but I have been thinking up some stuff myself and if it's not been tackled already...

One level area that sticks in my mind from I think thief two was a city top green house, so basically gardening tools, potted plants, sprinkler system would be something I'd like to contribute if there's a choice and I make it through your art test!

 

EDIT: Just thought I would add in a couple of images.

 

ab2xz8.jpg

ab7bu5.jpg

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Interesting.

 

We could always use more plants :-D

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happycheeze.deviantart.com

 

Moddb

 

Gamers Outreach, a nonprofit that uses videogames to raise money for chairty.

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Hehe, cheers Baddcog. It wasn't supposed to be a proper track bike in the sense of velodrome, more a street fixed gear for a courier type character I am 'working' on so no need for it to all be NJS certified! Short straight bars are great for in between cars, clips just look cool to me and I don't think quill stems look right on non lugged frames.

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Hi Islip. Couple questions:

 

1. What modeling software do you use? TDM can accept models in either .lwo or .ase format, though I prefer .lwo.

 

2. We need modelers to be able to texture their own work (including normalmaps) though we have a huge bank of textures that can be used (and we actually prefer to use existing textures where possible, to keep the over look of the mod similar. I assume you textured those examples yourself?

 

Anyway, we usually start prospective modellers out with a contributor task so we can get a feel for your strengths (and it also helps weed out those who can't stick with projects very long).

 

Here are a few things you could try, with pics for inspiration (not necessarily to be copied exactly):

 

 

Medievalish shop signs:

http://www.daytripstoeurope.co.uk/Pictures...le/shopsign.JPG

http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview...s_shop_sign.jpg

 

Medieval chairs:

http://www.library.yale.edu/Walpole/BAC/im...hic_chair-Z.jpg

http://www.contentparadise.com/getdetailim...7/0/M/17767.jpg

http://www.marbleslawn.com/chair2.jpg

 

If Fidcal wanted to post a crown pic or two that could also work.

 

You can check out our current models (give or take a few) here to see what kind of look to aim for: http://www.tjoff.com/jens/darkmod/gallery/...m.php?albumID=3

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Hey, I normally use XSI which I know can export in to *.lwo but it's not a function I have ever made use of, also have access to Maya and 3ds but i prefer XSI.

 

I did texture the examples myself yeah, like I said earlier normal maps is something I need to learn and there's no time like the present! So I shall give that a go.

 

Cheers!

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Also, we could use some more levers and buttons I think. We have very few. In the Outpost the lever and buttons were made out of brushes :) .

 

Well you can pull off brush buttons and levers. TDM is versatile that way. But models can look better.

|=-=------=-=|

happycheeze.deviantart.com

 

Moddb

 

Gamers Outreach, a nonprofit that uses videogames to raise money for chairty.

|=-=------=-=|

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Hi, I thought a crown would be a good thing for me to try given the normal mapping-need-to-learn stuff, so had started modelling one before you suggested it. Will complete then move on to one of the other things you suggested. I googled medieval crown and made a quick high & low poly based on one of the results.

 

Here's my progress:

 

crownnormaltestwc2.jpg

 

Ambient Occlusion map as diffuse and normal map applied. Not sure what sort of poly you would want for a prop like this but it is over 500 at the moment. Could be less round and cut down easily, but then it's not like there would ever be a lot of them about.

 

Basically a post to show you I am working, shall be optimised!

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That looks fine islipaway but if you can add maybe ten small arrowhead ornamentation pointing upward all the way round it would I think make it more distinctive - more recognizable as a crown. I don't know about model polys - one of our modellers could probably advise better if it is too detailed.

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Would it be appropriate to put builder insignia on it in a similar way that real crowns often featured crosses?

 

Hmm, it would probably have to be for the builder "Pope" or someone of similar position.

|=-=------=-=|

happycheeze.deviantart.com

 

Moddb

 

Gamers Outreach, a nonprofit that uses videogames to raise money for chairty.

|=-=------=-=|

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The Builder religion is deeply intertwined with the politics of the empire and has been for centuries, so it would make perfect sense to have Builder symbology in crowns.

 

I agree with the Fidcal that the model (even though it matches the concept image well) wouldn't immediately register to most people as a crown. Adding spines like those below would help.

 

http://www.pewterreplicas.co.uk/second%20s...val%20crown.jpg

http://www.parrishrelics.com/images/Medcrown.gif

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No specific shape or number; they seem to range from about 4 to 14! I just image-googled medieval crowns and saw crowns like these...

 

http://www.tiarasandcrowns.co.uk/catalogue.html

http://www.pewterreplicas.co.uk/medieval%20crown.htm

http://www.turbosquid.com/FullPreview/Index.cfm/ID/173614

 

Looking more closely they are not so much arrow heads as diamond shapes or fleur-de-lys but basically they are pointy decorations on the top! You might take the opportunity to produce two variations of the crown - sort of two for the price of one effort - one slightly smaller with no extra decoration, maybe vary the colour, silver and gold. No, do not put builder insignia on (unless someone else wants another variant - no harm in variations if it is not too much extra work.)

 

This is not for anyone's headgear (though someone might do a King of the Zombies mission I guess.) No, I need some royal loot for my Manor Royale mission where a threatened king of a far off realm has entrusted his jewels to a close friend to store in his manor house.

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Looks good. While I think I'd recognize it as a crown some spikeys would probably make it more distinct.

 

500 is probably fine for a crown. Like you said there won't be alot of them around. I tend to think the fancy objects like this should have more detail (although I wouldn't go much above 500 for that) as they are likely to be quest items.

 

There's no set limits on poly counts. I think an overall judgement is that stuff should look nice and not like T2 (which was still a pretty low poly game) but not have excessively wasted polys. Try to use normals for that.

 

Would be good to see wireframes of this stuff too so it's easier to judge your models (so we can point you in the right direction). Personally I think the models you've shown show that you have the talent to be a member. Probably bigger concerns to the team are dedication (this is something I shouldn't bring up :( - I haven't done anything lately).

But we'll help you get them in game so you learn the workflow.

 

Things to be aware of right off the bat that all models need:

 

Collision models: easy enough. make a simmple convex shape that fits the model as good as possible. For that crown a 7 or 8 sided cylinder would do - that's about as complex as it can be. put the collision material on it. the Wiki has a list of tdm collision materials you can use. Basically they give it the correct sound. ie:metal, wood...

 

Needs to be used on any object that moves mainly. Moving objects have a collision poly max of about 16. Sometimes you can fudge a more complex shape but simple is best.

If you want a bottle to bounce around, get knocked around it needs a simple collision mesh.

 

If it's large like a table it can be more complex as it wont move. It can be concave. It can also have different materials. (wood collision legs, glass collision top). However if its a table the shape is already basic, no need for collision mesh.

if it's a machine with a bunch of bolts and shapes make a basic collision mesh.

 

This helps with performance if the player shoots arrows at it, throws bottles at it, etc...

 

 

Shadow meshes: somewhat same as above. A lower poly vers of the model. Probably not needed for stuff under 350 poly range.

HAS to be fully inside the model, other wise it can leave weird black spots on the model.

the material is either

shadow : casts shadows on other things AND itself

shadow2 : doesn't cast shadows on itself.

 

That crown could be a simple ring of polys (front and backsides). could probably end up being less than 80 trinagles used.

 

Lights/shadows can have a HUGE impact on performance in game. Much more so than poly count. So having the crown cast an 80 tri shadow is huge compared to a 500 tri shadow and it probably wouldn't even be noticeable when looking at it.

Dark is the sway that mows like a harvest

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Cheers for that Baddcog. Not had a chance to work on the crown much, tried a few spike layouts but none of them really felt right to me so going to step back a bit and try and get a stronger concept in mind instead of fudging on the spikes like I have been :)

 

I noticed on the wiki you can use seperate files for occlusion like normal maps in D3, is this used? I don't see any use for with the crown as I can put it in the diffuse, but for furniture using generic wood textures a lowish res AO might add a lot of depth?

 

As for the chairs, you said I wouldn't have to follow those photos posted exactly, I am quite fond of Charles Rennie Macintosh chairs and think they would fit in quite well for well off town houses or manors. Would that be appropriate? Here are some examples (sorry huge images!):

 

Charles_Rennie_Mackintosh_-_Chair_-_1903.jpg

charles_rennie_mackintosh_argyle_chair_1py.jpg

Charles_Rennie_Mackintosh_-_Chair_-_1917.jpg

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I noticed on the wiki you can use seperate files for occlusion like normal maps in D3, is this used? I don't see any use for with the crown as I can put it in the diffuse, but for furniture using generic wood textures a lowish res AO might add a lot of depth?

Yes, you should know how to make normal maps. They can often be made with a high polygon model, which is projected on a low polygon model.

 

As for the chairs, you said I wouldn't have to follow those photos posted exactly, I am quite fond of Charles Rennie Macintosh chairs and think they would fit in quite well for well off town houses or manors. Would that be appropriate? Here are some examples (sorry huge images!):

The 'styles' in TDM are the same as in the original thief games: medieval (Gothic), Victorian and steam punk. But Springheel can decide what is appropriate and what not. Personally I'd go for a more Victorian look for furniture in manors.

 

btw, how maintains the model site? It seems it is not up to date.

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Thanks for the response, I guess I wasn't that clear on the occlusion map issue. I realise that I have to create normal maps what I was asking is do you also use occlusion maps as is listed as an option in the wiki? As I think this would be useful for items where you use a generic overall texture like some furniture.

 

Charles Rennie Mackintosh was at the end of the Victorian era, I thought thief 2 had a bit of an Art Nouveau style to it in bits which is why I thought it might fit in.

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Thanks for the response, I guess I wasn't that clear on the occlusion map issue. I realise that I have to create normal maps what I was asking is do you also use occlusion maps as is listed as an option in the wiki? As I think this would be useful for items where you use a generic overall texture like some furniture.

Your question was clear, I just read it wrong, sorry. I did a search on the occlusion maps and could find only one in the whole mod, for AI hands. Feel free to experiment with it if you want though, you can get some generic wood textures for furniture with the saint lucia download.

 

Charles Rennie Mackintosh was at the end of the Victorian era, I thought thief 2 had a bit of an Art Nouveau style to it in bits which is why I thought it might fit in.

O, I didn't know. I'm not an export on that :) . I thought Victorian is more decorated.

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I know T2 used an art deco style, but we're steering clear of that and focusing more on a late tudor/early victorian look. Those chairs are not ideal but are probably usable with a few tweaks (like removing the wicker).

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As for the AO. I wasn't actually aware that we could add an Ao layer.

 

But I think baking an AO is always a good base for diffuse.

 

It's probably up to you. If you get something nice out of it I may have to try it for some of my stuff.

 

There are alot of options you can use with the texture system. It actually makes it a little annoying sometimes IMO.

 

You can also use color overlays (we are using them for candles) so you can have a wide variety of colored objects through the use of skins and rgb colors. I think this is best with more basic things like candles that have an AO type tex. (fairly greyscale).

 

Spring's the best one to listen to on styles for sure. My opinion of the chairs was the first one is good, I think the wicker looks old school, but maybe too many slats up top.

The second one to me looks good for a base for an inventors chair, maybe a little less art-deco though, we haven't really defined a style for the inventors visually yet. But as they are comparable to mechanists we should not get too close to art deco.

Dark is the sway that mows like a harvest

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Progress: Probably doesn't look like much but: proper UVs, better jewels inset and settled on a fairly simple but hopefully effective spike layout.

 

crownqz7.jpg

 

Any comments? The fabric inside the crown is going to be sculpted hopefully, which is why it isn't present at the moment. Never really got a grips wit z brush, such a strange interface but think it's time I gave it another shot.

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