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roygato

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Posts posted by roygato

  1. 1 hour ago, chakkman said:

    Bethesda is not only Elder Scrolls.

    Well, I did write post-Morrowind Bethesda RPGs.

    1 hour ago, chakkman said:

    Apart from that, I think both Oblivion and Skyrim are much better in terms of combat than Morrowind ist. Morrowind is basically hack hack hack, and the character skill and luck logic of the game decides whether you hit or not, and how powerful the hit is.

    No question that Morrowind's combat is terrible, but at the same time, it isn't a very high bar to clear. I think Oblivion clears it only just, simply by removing the tabletop dice rolls. Otherwise it's still godawful. TDM, a game where the combat is more like an afterthought, has better combat than Oblivion, for example.

    1 hour ago, chakkman said:

    I also never really could get into the text based dialogues in Morrowind. And, I also think it has a much more generic world than Skyrim.

    That's fair, voiced dialogue brings a lot to the table, even if it restricts the writing. Even bad voice-acting can have a certain charm.

    1 hour ago, chakkman said:

    I don't mean this offensive, but, I always find it a bit funny when there are people doing videos about how Morrowind is so much better, and now the games got dumbed down, and stuff. While I agree that there ARE games these days which are quite dumbed down, and, I also find that some of the game mechanics have been dumbed down in Skyrim (I really think that no game should have automatic healing, for example), I can only refer to games mag's scores about the games. 

    If I'm reading this correctly, and you mean how Skyrim got high-praise from critics despite people complaining about it, personally I wouldn't put almost any weight to the press ratings as far as evaluating a game goes. It somehow doesn't surprise me that a game in a beloved-series hyped to high-heavens gets critical acclaim. Dumbing it down seems like it would make it more likely, not less, as it's even more accessible.

    1 hour ago, chakkman said:

    Anyway, the real hit series from Bethesda for me is Fallout. Those games offered one of the most fun experiences I ever had in games. Simply because the setting is nearly perfect for me. I also like Elder Scrolls, but, between those two series, I prefer the Fallout setting. Bethesda used to do pretty generic game worlds and characters (Morrowind, Oblivion, even Fallout 3 suffered a bit from that, especially the never ending subway tunnels), but, at the latest from Fallout 3, they really improved a lot on that.

    Even with Fallout, the same consensus seems to apply. New Vegas, not developed by Bethesda, is often described as the superior RPG, whereas 3 and 4 are seen as more fun to explore.

    I don't really care for Fallout's flavor of post-apocalypse, so I haven't had any inclination to play any of the games. I've watched some videos though, Fallout 76 seemed like a real riot. :awesome:

    1 hour ago, chakkman said:

    If you want to play an Elder Scrolls game, play Skyrim Special Edition. I wouldn't really play anything else now.

    I played Oblivion for dumb reasons anyway. There was a let's play of it I watched back in the day, that didn't get very far, but still somehow got me to give it a shot. Thought I could play it as an alternative Thief game; that was a terrible idea in hindsight, as there is nothing to steal. I did finish the game, all the factions and Shivering Isles, but late-game combat, dungeons and fetch quests were beyond mind-numbing.

  2. On 3/21/2021 at 1:34 PM, chakkman said:

    I much more enjoy the Bethesda RPG's.

    How do you view the post-Morrowind world of Bethesda RPGs? The common opinion I see is that they're fun to explore, but pretty not good in terms of everything else (writing & combat specifically). I've only ever played Oblivion, couple of years ago, debatable if it was worth it.

    What I do like about it, is that it produced this brilliant retrospective. If you have five hours to spare, I highly recommend it.

     

  3. 6 minutes ago, thebigh said:

    the reminders could get turned off once you've earned that little green tick for the mission.

    I thought this exact same thing the other day, so I concur. Although I wouldn't mind having any reminders come with a "Get this shit out of my face" tickbox. Depends on how they'd be implemented.

    • Like 1
  4. 4 hours ago, Obsttorte said:

    The second quote was a reaction to a generalization that I wasn't agreeing with. The more I think about it the less I see where the connection between those statements of mine are.

    The more I think about it, the less I see what you were even trying to argue for. thebigh is implying that shoving the tutorial down the player's throat is hand-holding. Whether that's true or not is a game-design decision. Mentioning how software is installed is completely irrelevant. If someone prefers the presentation of the old Thief and Deus Ex, it doesn't immediately mean they want to go back to the stone age of software. I don't know why you would even bring it up.

    Also, if it isn't incredibly obvious, I'm on your side in this argument. I don't see any issue with either enhancing the training mission, or adding a shortcut to it in the menu. I've already stated this multiple times. I don't think thebigh does either.

    I do take the point of people just forgetting stuff, even if they have played the training, but you can say that for any game. Some of them might have contextual hints that can be toggled off (press whatever to shoulder a body, or snuff a candle). Whether that's an appropriate solution, or even wanted, is another discussion.

  5. 17 hours ago, revelator said:

    The only gripe i had with it where the clunky controls

    This is what I tend to hear as well, when it comes to the Witcher series. I don't have an interest in it myself, but my brother-in-law was (or maybe still is) playing the third one, and was telling me how it's apparently very difficult.

  6. 8 hours ago, Obsttorte said:

    I wouldn't call telling the player how to play the game or what the rules are hand-holding. Not everyone is playing video games for 20 years already.

    The training mission exists, it's right there. Not only that, but the mission download page literally says that the player should start with it, as well as the other prepackaged ones. That said, I'm not opposed to making that notion more prominent in the game, since I realize some people may just use the in-game downloader at all times. I didn't until just recently, because when I started, it was practically unusable. Although even then, it comes with the download. Training mission = learn the game, this isn't rocket science.

    At some point this reaches a point of willful ignorance on the part of the player. If they choose to ignore the training mission, and then come complaining about something that is explained there, that is completely unacceptable, and they should be shot into the sun out of a giant cannon.

    On 3/18/2021 at 1:53 PM, Obsttorte said:

    As long as you are polite and try to back up your points with arguments, I have no objection on beeing criticized. All good :)

    I find it funny you say this to someone, when you argue your points with strawmen, like this:

    8 hours ago, Obsttorte said:

    There also people who had issues with the way tdm got installed, too, so someone made a graphical installer. Is that hand-helding just because you don't need it?

    I concede it is an argument, just not a very good one. Installing the game isn't playing the game, this is completely irrelevant. "But it's a matter of usability or something". I have no idea how the game was installed in the olden days, so I can't comment on that. But making the software itself function like it was made in the 21st century doesn't seem like a big concession. I often hear people complain about modernizing game-design; I've never once heard it about software installation processes. I reckon most everything comes with a graphical installer. It doesn't translate at all into how the game should treat the player. It isn't trying to willfully obfuscate, the training mission exists, is pretty substantial and comes with the download.

    If the mod came with no training at all, and there was no place to learn any of it, or if thebigh was trying to argue for removing the training mission, because he didn't need it, I'd give what you wrote here more of an edge, but as it is, it's just a fallacy.

  7. On 3/18/2021 at 1:53 PM, Obsttorte said:

    The only things that come to my mind are either a dedicated button in the start screen to directly start the training mission or a "First time playing the game. Wanna play the tutorial first?!" prompt.

    Yeah. When the player opens the mission selector, you could have a popup that says something like

    "Welcome to The Dark Mod. It is highly recommended you play through the training mission first, in order to familiarize yourself with the game's mechanics. The regular missions assume that you are familiar with them.

    [ ] Never show this message again."

    Or something. Don't remember the original Thief games, but wasn't the training mission for the OG Deus Ex completely skippable, and you had to specifically select it in the main menu?

  8. 3 minutes ago, tapewolf said:

    Out of sheer perversity, I...

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    ...jammed the door to the vault with a crate and was thereby able to get back to the boat with the artifact, which the mission did not take into account.

     

    Spoiler

    Now that's the spirit. :awesome: Why didn't I think of that.

     

    4 minutes ago, tapewolf said:

    Apart from that it was great.  The only other thing which left me feeling slightly disappointed was that...
     

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    ...given the masses of health potions and how tooled up you are by the end of the mission, I was expecting some kind of grand confrontation with the demonic guy who kept hassling me.  As such I felt somehow let down when I managed to escape and finish the mission with no obvious harm.

    The over-abundance of weaponry also led me to wonder if I was supposed to blow up the artifact to end its evil, but I wasn't obviously able to do that either.

     

     

    Spoiler

    Classic misdirection. Although like you, I was fully expecting the place to be absolutely overrun, after retrieving the artifact.

     

  9. 31 minutes ago, chakkman said:

    While I would agree on some games on your list (and I don't know about half of them, because I simply didn't play them :)), I'd also say, with the exception of the Arkane Studios games, there are some games on the list which fit at least partly into the "professionally produced game for the mass" category.

    Let's take the two Deus Ex games for example: While I definitely enjoyed playing them (a lot actually), I have no illussions that the first Deus Ex was another league, in terms of creativity and game design. Thief, Deus Ex, System Shock, those were games where you literally can feel that the developers have been turned loose, in terms of creativity. That's also something Ken Levine, who mainly designed the first Thief, System Shock 2, and the Bioshock's, always said about how he thinks development should be like: To animate the people involved to develop ideas. If I take a look at the Deus Ex reboots, I can see rudiments of the first Deus Ex, but, I also can say a lot of things which I rather connect to modern games. Long cinematics, the focus on design and good graphics, or the pretty penetrant political correctness story scheme of Mankind Divided. You know, the gameplay of the games was good, but, there are also quite a few things I didn't like so well about the games. Won't complain though, as I thoroughly enjoyed both Human Revolution and Mankind Divided. Even though they ARE modern games indeed.

    That's fair. Personally, I'm young enough that I didn't play the likes of Deus Ex, Thief and System Shock 2 when they were new; like I noted in my summary of Human Revolution, it's pretty much that game alone to thank that I started branching out and got into some of these other ones. HR was a completely new world for me.

    I'd be hard pressed to choose between the first Deus Ex and HR. Both are excellent. Mankind Divided was a disappointment, the story just didn't go anywhere and it's maybe too similar to HR in terms of everything else. Not to mention the idiotic micro-transactions.

    31 minutes ago, chakkman said:

    IMO, the time of Thief, System Shock and Deus Ex kind of marked a peak time of games for me. A point where games really got great. Nowadays, there's always a focus on professionality, meaning that the game has to be tailored towards the mass, with a certain budget. Game development these days rather seems to me like they sat together in a meeting room, and said to each other "Well, guys... let's have a brain storm, what are your ideas?" "Mh, Ok, here is my idea: [...]" "Mmmh... that's a great idea, but, the audience wants to see this and that, so let's change it a bit. What's next then?" "Ok, here's another idea: [...]" "Mmmh... sounds nice, but... we gotta make money with the game, because the budget is $100 million, so, let's rather do it like this." And so on. All safe play, compared to "unleashing the creative beast", like they did in the past. And that's basically what made the games so good IMO. People having great and crazy ideas. If you take a look at Thief or System Shock, there are some things which are outright nuts in these games, and yet they work, opposed to many things in games these days. In one word: Nowadays games' simply bore me, for the most part, as they're so predictable. Take the Ubisoft games, for example, they all play and feel the same.

    Sure, when the budgets are high and there is the never-ending race to top the latest best-seller, it's a tough sell for AAA studios to innovate.

    31 minutes ago, chakkman said:

    Anyway, you definitely didn't choose the boring AAA games for your list, and, as I said, there are some good ones.

    There's a reason for that: I don't really play AAA games. :awesome: All the AAA games I played from the last decade are on the list, at least mentioned, save for Halo 4. As my list shows, I'm a huge fan of certain types of games (atmospheric puzzle, stealth, immersive sim, good stories), and AAA studios rarely deliver on that front.

    31 minutes ago, chakkman said:

    Oh... and last but not least, what I also always notice about nowadays' games is how little they make you think.

    You say that, but the last room in HR took me like three hours. :awesome:

    But I get what you mean. Certainly in the world of AAA, it's a bigger issue. I get a lot of thinking from all the puzzle games, lol.

    • Like 1
  10. Yeah, no argument about the difficulty. They did try at least, by offering the status effects and weapon degradation and whatnot, but the same thing happened as with every other game of its kind, I finish with an inventory absolutely full.

    45 minutes ago, chakkman said:

    Don't want to say anything bad about Prey though, it's been one of the very few good games of the last decade.

    I'd be curious to hear what others you might have in mind. I think the last decade was awesome; I whipped up a top 20 list to discuss with some people. and it was pretty effortless. Even with lumping some franchises together, since I couldn't choose.

    Just for fun, this was my list I wrote in December of 2019. It's a rather long post, but it was fun coming up with it. I've since finished games that would probably make their way in there, such as Nier Automata, Kindred Spirits on the Roof, and maybe Return of the Obra Dinn.

    Spoiler

    #20: SUPERHOT (2016)

    This consideration is like 99% for the VR version of the game. I've been to the local VR-game business a couple of times with my brother-in-law and this game is the king every time. While the core gameplay is fun enough on a desktop setting, having to use your whole body is just a revelation. If I actually owned the VR version, I could probably have placed it higher, but needless to say, if you ever get the chance to try VR, this is the game to go for.

    #19: Doki Doki Literature Club (2017)

    Cute, horrifying, concise, meta. It's definitely an experience and shows what a creative mind can muster in the world of visual novels. It's not for everyone due to its imagery and content, but for me, it was a total surprise and utterly unforgettable.

    #18. Gunpoint (2013)

    Side-scrolling stealth game. Kind of arcadey in its design, as in, the levels are typically single-screen, but there is still a satisfying complexity to the gameplay. Avoid guards, hack doors, use gadgets, just fun stuff. It's short, but so much fun that I've played it a couple of times now.

    #17. The Last of Us (2013)

    Rare PS exclusive to make its way to my list. Not that I own one, but my brother-in-law does, so this was a co-op playthrough, despite being a single player game. While it was fun, being such a story-driven and cinematic experience, it would've certainly left a bigger impression if played alone. Also, while I still don't much like the controller, the gun-play is satisfying. Weapons have that meaty weight to them. Graphically gorgeously vibrant, the city overrun with greenery makes for a great setting.

    #16. The Room Trilogy (2014/2016/2018)

    Atmospheric point-and-click puzzle games at their best. A constant sense of discovery as your dwell deeper into the narrative. The first game just has the one room and the mysterious box, while the second and third stretch over multiple locations. Occasionally you click the screen in frustration, but not very often.

    #15. Bioshock 2 / Bioshock Infinite (2010/2013)

    To this day I'm not sure which Bioshock game is my favorite. The original from 2007 still holds up and I imagine that is the favorite for most people, simply because entering Rapture for the first time is a powerful moment. In the sequel, that same magic is obviously gone, but I reckon most everything else is just as good if not better. Gameplay-wise the ability to dual-wield weapons and abilities is a welcome change and the story at least tries to be original, instead of essentially retelling the story of System Shock 2. Bioshock 2 also has the added bonus of Minerva's Den DLC, which is a neat little mini Bioshock experience.

    As for Infinite, I very much enjoyed the switch from the gloomy Rapture to the utopian Columbia. The gameplay is still fun, albeit downscaled, and Elizabeth makes for a lovely companion. The level design is disappointing, though, being much too linear. The story gets real crazy and the Dishonored-esque DLC brings something new to the old formula.

    Regardless, a fun franchise of games and I'm sure I'll keep returning to them in the future.

    #14. Dishonored / Dishonored 2 (2012/2016)

    When it comes to modern stealth games, Dishonored is at the top of the line. While the gameplay can be too easy when going full ghost, it's still fun. Additionally, the world design is excellent. Like Bioshock, I'm really not sure which one of these I prefer. The first one has a way better story, while the second might have slightly better gameplay and level design. Add in the sizeable DLC for both games and over the course of everything, you get to play as four different characters, giving a new look into the world and different stories to experience.

    #13. Qbeh-1: The Atlas Cube (2014)

    A serene first-person puzzle game about block manipulation. The core gameplay is stimulating enough, but I love the added secretive elements that reward you with more gameplay. I'd love to try this in VR just to admire the scenery.

    #12. Rocket League (2015)

    It's soccer with cars. I don't game a lot with other people these days, but the majority of the 600 hours I put into Rocket League was spent with some family members. While I don't have a lot of interest in it anymore, it was quality time regardless.

    #11. Prey (2017)

    While System Shock remake and SS3 are on their way, Arkane Studios (Dishonored devs) decided to take a crack at making a System Shock -experience for the modern audience, by re-imagining 2006's Prey. It's not a remake or a reboot, though. As far as I know, they share the name and that's about it. Both are FPS's with horror elements, I suppose. Anyway, the resulting Prey 2017 is a beautiful rendition of the SS setting. A massive non-linear space station, lots of weapons and powers, alien scum and hours and hours of fun. It has it all. My biggest issue is the enemy design, as coming from the disturbing mutated crew of SS2, the black goopy tendril monsters of Prey don't have that same level of dread or charm. Still fun to shoot at, though. I also appreciated their attempt at adding some old-school hardcore gameplay elements, like weapon degradation and lingering status effects. As a veteran of FPS games, I love a challenge.

    #10. The Swapper (2013)

    Made by a couple of Finnish students, this is a small, but brilliant example of one my favorite game combinations: puzzles and atmosphere. While its 4 hours don't hold a lot of the former, it's oozing with the latter. The sound design is excellent and the hand-crafted backgrounds make for an amazingly desolate deep space experience. One of the finest showcases of indie game development.

    #9. Ori and the Blind Forest (2016)

    I'm not really a side-scroller fan, but Ori won me over with its gorgeous visuals and top-notch music. The gameplay is fun too, as you get to explore the sizeable forest finding new upgrades and powers. Metroidvania-style I believe, although it's probably not as claustrophobic. Add to that the moving story and it's potentially surprisingly emotional experience.

    #8. League of Legends (2009)

    Release years be damned, this was one of those decade-defining games, both globally and for me personally. After having Halo be my competitive fixture for years, it was fun to find another long-lasting one early on in this decade. It drives me insane, but I just can't stop. The Esports side of it is also sometimes more fun than actually playing the game.

    #7. The Dark Mod (standalone release 2013)

    A little history lesson to start. The Dark Mod officially released in 2009, as a total conversion mod of Doom 3; essentially, it's a Thief game made with the Doom 3 engine. In 2013, however, they made the jump to an independent release, meaning they replaced all Doom assets and most importantly, made it so that you don't need Doom to play it anymore.

    I caught on to Dark Mod a little late, as I only found out about it a couple of years ago, but that suits me, since I had a boatload of missions waiting for me. Essentially, it's good old fashioned Thief-gameplay; no RPG-elements, no bullshit, just your basic thieving tools and your wits. It's the sequel to Thief 2 (or Thief 3) we should've gotten. While being a fan project means the mission design varies greatly in quality and content, they've still fostered a creative community where it doesn't feel like any work is out of place (well aside from that one that was garbage). To this day I check their site and forums almost daily to see if new missions are out; maybe I'll try creating one myself some day. Seeing as the Thief franchise may be dead after the Thief 2014 reboot failure, The Dark Mod is the best we've got (other than fan missions for the classic Thiefs, which I also play). And you know what, I'm fine with that. If the big studios won't make what the fans want to play, might as well do it ourselves.

    #6. The Witness (2016)

    It's clear at this point that I love puzzles and atmosphere, but if you add in an expansive, non-linear environment, then we're really in business. The Witness gives you essentially nothing, as you're thrust into the strange island filled with puzzles. You just gotta figure it all out, while occasionally listening to philosophical musings, or watching strange video clips; perhaps a little Richard Feynman or obscure art film this time. Add to that the fact that there's no music to distract you and it's really a one-of-a-kind experience.

    #5. Antichamber (2013)

    Oh boy, more puzzles. Antichamber is bizarre and that's why I love it. You never know exactly what kind of mind-fuckery they throw at your way next. Anything from platforming to non-Euclidian geometry goes. Like The Witness, the setting is very abstract, and visually much more so. Similarly, it has little to no music and offers philosophical motivational messages as you progress. Additionally, it might have the best map system of any game, super easy to get around if you get stuck with a puzzle. It is non-linear, after all. It's also much shorter, so it's easier to replay.

    #4. Portal 2 (2011)

    Back when Valve made video games, they made one called Portal, which was pretty fun. Then they upped the ante on basically everything, added new mechanics and characters and made Portal 2, which is a masterpiece. Unlike the other puzzle games on this list, it's not about atmosphere or philosophy, but gameplay and comedy. And man if it isn't fun and funny. Wheatley is one of the best characters of all time. Extremely replayable too, since experiencing the story multiple times is good enough fun. Add in the excellent co-op multiplayer, and you get a whole other dimension to the gameplay.

    #3. Mass Effect 2 (2010)

    Back when Bioware made good games, they made a series called Mass Effect, which has then gone on to the dumpster. But back in the day, it was the shit and they really nailed it with the second part of the original trilogy. While the gameplay is greatly streamlined in terms of RPG-mechanics, the fun of shooting at people isn't. More importantly, it has the best story of the three games, spearheaded by your immensely memorable and lovable crew of misfits you are tasked to hire. Add in the several fun DLC and you've got a thrilling space opera at your disposal.

    What comes to the third game in the trilogy, that too is really good; it's mostly the ending that kind of falls on its face, especially when you delve into it in feature-length YouTube videos. But additionally, it too has a bunch of DLC I would like to play to fully evaluate the experience, and I haven't even bought those yet.

    #2. The Talos Principle (2014)

    First-person. Atmosphere. Puzzles. Add in a hefty dose of philosophical themes, player freedom, secrets, beautiful environments and music, and you've got the absolute masterwork of puzzle games and the highest benchmark I'll be judging others by for the coming years. How do you even make a puzzle game that takes 40 hours to beat and doesn't get boring at any point? And then release a brilliant 20-hour long DLC to boot. It's hard to even believe this game exists, but I'm so glad it does. Can't wait to play through it in VR, just so that I can take in the environments as if I was actually there.

    #1. Deus Ex: Human Revolution (2011)

    There was a time when I mostly cared about Halo and only sparsely ventured into other games. Then came 2011 when I, somewhat impulsively, bought Human Revolution, based on a couple of promotional videos. And man if it didn't turn out to be a revolutionary (hue) experience. It's entirely thanks to this game that I ever got to many of the other games I've mentioned and raved about.

    Human Revolution is a mix of FPS and stealth with heavy RPG-based progression mechanics, as you gain new augmentations as a transhuman super agent. The story in the near future cyberpunk world has it all, from shady megacorps, to massive class inequality issues and before you're done, you've been around the world and back again. The gameplay is extremely satisfying, no matter the style, and the world design is stylized in a way that makes it hold up visually years later. Finally, the soundtrack is an absolute masterpiece, up there with the best of the best of all time. In terms of fun, atmosphere and emotional resonance, it doesn't get any better than this. That last room was like the hardest choice I ever had to make in my life.

    Who knows what awaits this franchise in the next decade. Mankind Divided didn't do too well, which seems to be a theme with Deus Ex games (original - masterpiece, sequel - sucked, HR - masterpiece, sequel - ehhhh). It wasn't a bad game, just too similar mechanically, didn't do much with its story, and tried to nickel and dime fans with idiotic microtransactions. Maybe the series will once again lay dormant for a while before a new studio will raise it from the dead.

     

  11. 6 hours ago, chakkman said:

    It also doesn't feature auto healing, and all that modern casual crap, of course, which is a huge plus too. Now imagine they'd do games like that in current graphics. Heaven. :) Well, one can dream... the reality is that they do extreme super graphics with 100 GB of texture data, and the gameplay is something I'd wipe my ass with. Silly season forever.

    Well, there is Prey 2017, which was pretty baller.

    It's been maybe five years since I played SS2, so I'm pretty hazy on the details. Don't remember it being that hard, other than before you got a gun. I'd like to think I played it on the hardest difficulty.

    But since you reminded me of it, I played the Marathon trilogy over the course of the past 8 years and man, those games were ruthless. Never was I as happy to pick up ammo in a shooter. Or reach a save/health station.

    As far as new games go, finished Ori & The Will of the Wisps the other week. They sure gameyfied it a lot compared to the first one, but it's still really good. About twice as a long too.

  12. 11 hours ago, ddaazzaa said:

     

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    Surprisingly when I was tweaking the sound, the whispers tended to be the most quiet for me. That's odd.

    I monster clipped the majority of the map. So dropping 1 to 2 dozen guards around the map, a bit of AI pathing and it's almost there :).

     

    Spoiler

    It may just be my setup too, it's not the first mission where I have sound mixing issues. Have to check some older missions with the protagonist talking, to compare.

     

  13. 10 hours ago, ddaazzaa said:

     

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    Was it all the voices that were lower? There are 3 types of voices: potagonist, whispers and demonic.

    The whispers are supposed to be rather quiet. I did try and tweak the volume of the ambient music and the different voices. Everyone has different headphones and speakers so it can be difficult to get it right for everyone.

    All the speakers are setup with no spawn args or entities to differentiate between the types of sounds, so that's probably why adjusting those sliders doesn't do anything. If there's an easy way to add a spawn arg to certain voices I could maybe change it. I know there is a spawn arg for ambient music (s_music). The voice seems like you have to use a atdm and a few voice triggers. I haven't researched it further to see what's possible.

     

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    It was just the protagonist that was rather quiet for me. The other stuff was fine.

    Also

    10 hours ago, ddaazzaa said:

     

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    If someone did want to experiment with repurposing the mansion into a more traditional thief style mission they have my blessing.

     

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    Oh nice, a free map, don't have to make my own. :awesome:

    But yeah, a very generous offer, kinda hoping someone takes you up on it. It really is such a well put together environment.

     

  14. 9 minutes ago, Bienie said:

     

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    Similar to roygato I found myself thinking "man I wish this mansion was populated!" It was a really nice place you built, but I feel it was almost wasted by it being abandoned. Once I turned the lights on it was at least prettier and the tension lightened slightly.

     

    Definitely.

    As for bugs, I didn't come across any at all, which is rather impressive.

  15. Just finished this, after about 90 minutes.

    Spoiler

    Loved the mansion, wish it had people in it. :awesome:

    But yeah, while it's definitely not my preferred style of mission, I do appreciate that it was more concerned with atmosphere, rather than having to avoid the always annoying undead. I did go full yolo, though, just running around swinging my sword at nothing, to make myself feel better. I did read your list of influences, and having Cradle in there, I figured that there would, most likely, be nothing to actually worry about. Other than the occasional jumpscare, which thankfully weren't too bad. Cradle did scare you with nothing for the first part, after all. Considering how much equipment you had, I was expecting the place to be overrun after going in the basement, but can't say I'm opposed to how it ended.

    Despite being basically being all loot/keyhunt, I didn't really mind. It was basically running through a haunted house (no shit right);  just the tension of seeing what would be around the next corner, or behind the next door.

    It's hard to write anything without giving something away, but I really enjoyed the environment, the mansion itself clearly had a lot of effort put into it. The atmosphere was quite palpable, even though my preferences lie elsewhere. Still, for what it is, I would consider it a strong showing, and for a first mission nonetheless.

  16. This is explained in the Training mission. You hold the candle with your frob/interact key and pinch it out with the use key. In my case, that would be MB2 + F. Presumably your use key is enter.

    On occasion, you'll find candles that can't be moved, but instead only extinguished with the frob key, but those are much rarer.

  17. I don't exactly get what noises you're referring to, but I checked it out anyway out of curiosity. The only thing I'd agree to be on the loud side is the ambient music that plays in the side rooms, but turning down the ambient volume fixes that. My sound settings for SFX and ambient music are equal, between the third and second highest lines in the volume bar, before any adjustments.

    As far as performance goes, I can concur that it does indeed suffer a bit at certain points, namely when looking at the mansion at mission start.

  18. 1 hour ago, stgatilov said:

    Cameras are not important enough for the story to talk to player about them.

    I don't think this is the issue; you can easily make a mission that is tailored around cameras and you use the briefing/a readable in inventory to explain them.

    What I could foresee is the first thing you mention, the fact that practically no missions exist with cameras currently, so there literally is no way for the player to know what the "standard" behavior even is, other than projecting their Thief knowledge.

    Picture this: A bank heist. A briefing includes all the usual stuff and also mentions how the building is equipped with these awesome cameras, but it just happens they break if you throw a pebble at them. Then give the player some pebbles and maybe a note from the informant or whoever that re-affirms that you should indeed use these pebbles to take out the cameras.

    Now that's fine, and should work for that mission, but then another author releases a mission with cameras. They look the same as the cameras in that other guy's mission, but only this time there is no mention of pebbles. So the player scours the map looking for pebbles, doesn't find any, gets mad, and comes to the forums to rain down divine punishment. Or even worse, he finds pebbles, but they just don't do anything this time.

    In Thief 2, I know how a standard Watcher works, so any FM that adds/subtracts from that is not a big deal, if it's explained (although to your point, I don't think that has ever happened, and I've played about a billion fan missions). But I gained that knowledge through the campaign; TDM doesn't have one, and the current missions that come prepackaged understandably don't include cameras.

    • Like 2
  19. One of the few things Deadly Shadows has over the first two games, holy water is actually satisfying to use. None of that water arrow shit, just chuck the whole bottle at them. And flash bombs against whatever those other guys were.

    But as far as the cameras go, I agree with Dragofer. How they are damaged and disabled is definitely something I'd expect to have a game-wide standard, and any deviation should be made incredibly obvious. 

  20. 1 minute ago, VanishedOne said:

    It warms my heart to know that while half the world's hobby communities are engulfed in culture wars, there are still places where the high drama erupts over GUI design.

    See, this is why I joined this forum. Fuck the mod, it's the forum drama I was lacking in my life, after the previous place I inhabited slowly died out. That time it was music enthusiasts, now programming nerds apparently.

  21. 6 hours ago, Destined said:

    For big robots you needed two shots, because on was not sufficient to douse the fire completely and it could build up heat after a while.

    Sure, I get that. But I'd also be willing to suspend disbelief that you'd need a certain amount of water to fry them.

    Looking at the wiki links posted above, I'd be fine with the Thief 2 route too for electric cameras. Fire arrows are the loud, permanent option. Flash bombs are a silent, temporary solution. And the control panel is the sophisticated option. Can just say they're fortified with Gore-Tex for ultimate waterproofness.

    18 hours ago, VanishedOne said:

    Going a little offtopic here, but since you mentioned it: it seems from its script that holy water is less effective than you'd expect against multiple targets.

    
    // greebo: TODO: This won't cut it for holy stims damaging multiple undead
    	if (stimSource.getIntKey("stim_already_fired") == 1)
    	{
    		//sys.println("Ignoring stim coming from " + stimSource.getName());
    		return;
    	}

     

    I feel like they barely do anything against single targets either. Went back to test on a mission I was recently playing and you need three to kill one zombie??? That's heinous.

  22. 4 hours ago, chakkman said:

    I can't remember at all how it was in Thief... could you destroy the security camers there?

    I actually liked the idea of Dragofer, to require 3 water arrows to destroy the camer, making them spark on the first hit. At least that would make sense to me. Drown such an electronic device in water, and it will stop working at some point.

    Fire arrows should be sparse, like in the original Thief's, and, one shot should be enough to destroy a camera. They're loud and noticeable anyway.

    BTW, mission makers should give more water arrows to the player in general. I remember in almost every mission in the original Thief's you had plenty. In TDM, even in the missions with undead and holy water, you rarely get enough to be able to kill all the undead... most missions are quite unbalanced, in terms of equipment.

    I believe a single (direct) fire arrow hit does destroy the cameras in Thief. Think I learned that while playing some random fan mission, just decided to try it for whatever reason. As you mention, they're insanely loud anyway, so it's more or less the final solution.

    I also wouldn't mind water arrows having some form of effect on the cameras, at least electric ones. If you dump enough of them on one, it wouldn't be too out of reach to expect a reward. Just like you can disable the hulking security bots in Thief 2 with some water.

    That said, I find the classic Thief 2 "disable everything via a control panel" approach to be the most fun, as far as gameplay goes.

    As for your final point, I feel like it's a combination of not having many water arrows and holy water being so weak. It's pretty much always a completely wasted piece of equipment on any level, only good for informing me that there will be undead around, if that wasn't readily obvious. Therefore, I tend to just use the arrows on light sources and melee the undead.

    • Thanks 1
  23. On 2/26/2021 at 7:43 PM, V-Man339 said:

    20210226114215_1.thumb.jpg.02b78499b9c6e42d9cb7ae40ad3af39b.jpg

    Apologies for the resurrection of a thread for whom the author is banned, but I'm seeing absolutely no means of access to this loot and I can't find any rope arrows in the mission.

    Are there any solutions?

     

    As well, are there any water arrows for use

      Reveal hidden contents

    in the inn

    ?

    Just replayed this to check it out, I assume the loot in question is the white outline. You can get to where the archer is standing by

    Spoiler

    climbing the banner that's hanging off the wall.

    As for water arrows, I didn't come across any, but then again, the letter did advise keeping your hands off. I didn't find all the loot anyway, about 300 short.

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