Fan Mission: Patently Dangerous (2009/10/31)

[Spock RC]

Just finished the mission earlier tonight and really enjoyed it. It ran fine on my 8600 GT. There was a weird lag at the end of the mission but nothing to really complain about. There was a small oddity with a puddle or two. They just had way to much rippling in it. I think you can turn that down some way. Good job overall.

[id3839315]

Very nice mission.

By the way:

 

The name of the mission should be PATIENTLY DANGEROUS. Savegame has a size of 300 MB. Either it takes 3 minutes to load (Patiently) or you get a C++ Runtime Error (Dangerous).

 

 

Edited November 3, 2009 by id3839315

[Fidcal]

I can't help thinking these gamesave errors are lack of memory. 300MB is quite a proportion of say 2GB RAM if say, you have 0.5 used before launching Dark Mod then maybe Dark Mod plus this FM is up to 1.5 (just guessing.) If the gamesave loads into separate RAM then it does seem tight. What supports this idea is if the quicksave does load after relaunching Dark Mod and loading the gamesave from the menu without the original FM running (and using up RAM.) In the same way, perhaps when Quicksave is initiated in-game then possibly the relevant data is first copied to a RAM buffer before saving. If true then it suggests maybe 4GB is minimum to play FMs. Yet strangely, when I look at a gamesave from my Heart FM which is a much bigger FM, the save is only 48MB. Not many AI in yet which might make a difference I guess. Mmm... If I look at my Patently Dangerous gamesave it is only 22MB. So, new theory - somehow the gamesave is getting bloated if the player performs some action.

[kaldor]

My savegames are also in the range of 20 to 30 MB. And it loads very fast - less than 10 seconds I guess. I have 2GB of RAM.

 

 

One thing I forgot:

I tried to finish that Harlan-thing. Pulled him across the city, just to fail at half way of the stairs in his own house! I could not get him upstairs, the body would always be stuck somehow. After 20 times trying, I gave up - very frustrated. Thats not a problem with the map, but with DM itself. I don´t know how old this discussion is, but what was wrong with carrying someone over the shoulder?! I am glad you made it optional in the map..

 

[STiFU]

I don´t know how old this discussion is, but what was wrong with carrying someone over the shoulder?! I am glad you made it optional in the map..

Press "use" while dragging someone and you will shoulder him. FAQ FTW!

[kaldor]

yeah, I am just reading this right now and wanted to edit my post so no one sees it - but you quoted it first. Damn Okay, I was wrong, sorry FAQ FTW!

 

So maybe I can be proud of pulling him so far?

Edited November 3, 2009 by kaldor

[STiFU]

Hehe funny. I actually tried it right now and you can even get him up the stairs without shouldering. You drag a body by the bodypart you frobed, e.g. the hand or a leg. Furthermore you can build up a lot more power by pushing than by pulling, since you don't lose the target out of reach so often. Pushing the body up the stairs by his *uhum* "private/belt area" worked splendidly...

 

And Demagogue, I also noticed that you can "rescue" the guy, when he is already dead...

[fkkoko]

Awesome mission!

 

I liked every minute! I see that some people say that it is too linear but in my opinion it helps with building the right atmosphere (it was very creepy!) and the story (which was awesome by the way). I also did not encounter any bugs.

 

 

I player on Expert (so I had optional objective of not killing anyone) but I couldn't help myself when I knocked out the inventor and the murderer I dragged them both to the room with gas and mushrooms in the lab so they both die the death they deserve. (yes, I dragged the murderer all way from the warehouse just to kill him [at least I hope they'll die])

 

[Fidcal]

Now *that's* what I call immersion!

[demagogue]

Nice.

 

Thanks for the great comments, guys.

 

So maybe I can be proud of pulling him so far?

 

Yeah, holy crap that must have been some feat to literally *drag* him that whole way!

 

And Demagogue, I also noticed that you can "rescue" the guy, when he is already dead...

 

The objective is supposed to fail if he dies, but objective logic can get sort of hairy in practice, so if it more or less works okay then that's a good thing.

 

I see that some people say that it is too linear but in my opinion it helps with building the right atmosphere (it was very creepy!) and the story (which was awesome by the way).

 

It's true that telling a story through the space of the FM became part of the design, and I realized it might have a nice impact if I could build expectations and play with them in the way this kind of design allows. Anyway, it is what it is, and I'm happy with how it turned out and happy that other people can appreciate that part of it.

 

BTW, some more of my thinking on this since people seem to enjoy talking about it...

 

It occured to me there are basically two ways to break-up the game-necessary-space (which you can mix up). The "sequential" way is 'dependence', access to area-B, where you need to go, depends on getting into area-A first (for a key or some other form of access-ability to B ). The "open" way is basically having a MacGuffin for each area, and you need all the pieces to make progress (and you can get them in any order ... e.g., Rowena's Curse's 4 elemental things, Equilibrium's 4 keys, Rose Cottage just did it with its 5 ghosts, etc). The way I designed this was actually doing *both*. You have to get into Benson's to get to Harlan's and the roof, but then it branches with two MacGuffins (the journal and its pages; well, it's a small mission), which you can get in either order.

 

If you go to Soren's first, then the big climax at the end is the confrontation with Crattick and the chilling confirmation of Corrine's fate (the coffin). If you go to Damuddy's/the warehouse first, then the climax at the end is the chilling revelation of Emmy's fate. And I put readables in Soren's lab and Damuddy's office that allowed you to do it in either order and maintain a coheasive story-progression, as if that had been the 'right' way to go all along. I was actually a little happy how that turned out, allowing a branching plot, and I wasn't sure if many would notice. (Thanks go to Fidcal for actually getting into Damuddy's first so I could take it into account.)

 

[id3839315]

 

So, I put the corpse in front of his door. With that, the murderer would lose its pathfinding and started running in circles in his tiny room. I stole the key and sneaked out

 

I killed him with an arrow in his room but the door closed when I tried to get his key and you can't open it.

[digaphobia]

I can't help thinking these gamesave errors are lack of memory.

I have 3GB of RAM and my quick save was 296MB. I was able to quick save and quick load without issue for a while, but at some point something happened which inflated the quick save and broke the game when trying to quick load it.

After a crash I could load the mission (...slowly) and then perform additional quick saves (with a 5-10 second freeze while saving). But I couldn't re-load the quick save once it has been loaded once (ie: when I died, a quick load would crash the game).

 

I don't know how useful that is, but there you go.

[Tels]

I have 3GB of RAM and my quick save was 296MB. I was able to quick save and quick load without issue for a while, but at some point something happened which inflated the quick save and broke the game when trying to quick load it.

After a crash I could load the mission (...slowly) and then perform additional quick saves (with a 5-10 second freeze while saving). But I couldn't re-load the quick save once it has been loaded once (ie: when I died, a quick load would crash the game).

 

I don't know how useful that is, but there you go.

 

Do you still have such a broken quicksave? Nearly 300Mbyte quicksave is HUGE, that smells like some sort of bug. Did you know what might have triggered the inflation?

[Fidcal]

This is already on bugtracker with another gamesave but wouldn't hurt to save this gamesave also as extra evidence if needed.

[STiFU]

The objective is supposed to fail if he dies, but objective logic can get sort of hairy in practice, so if it more or less works okay then that's a good thing.

I should mention that I rescued him, then killed him with an arrow to the head and then rescued him again. (No I am no weird gunman, I was just bored ) But the point is, that you can complete the objective multiple times by carrying him out of and into the bed zone, no matter whether the subject is alive or not. This is not really an issue though. I just found it funny enough to be reported!!

[ported]

Are you supposed to be able to open the ground level door to Fressard's? There's a brick wall behind it, and I don't even think it's frobable. But somehow, I got it open and initially climbed it to reach all the roofs via Soren's. I didn't even know you could get into Benson's until after I completed the quest and read it here.

Edited November 4, 2009 by ported

[Fidcal]

No, that door should not open. I think sometimes the guards might open that door perhaps if they've been alerted and searched there.

[digaphobia]

Do you still have such a broken quicksave? Nearly 300Mbyte quicksave is HUGE, that smells like some sort of bug. Did you know what might have triggered the inflation?

Posted.

I have no idea what triggered it, but I played through from the beginning twice and had it happen both times. It was perhaps 75% through the level the second time, no idea on the first because I saved only just before completing, in case I missed loot. I still want to know what the max loot was....

Edited November 4, 2009 by digaphobia

[digaphobia]

But the point is, that you can complete the objective multiple times by carrying him out of and into the bed zone, no matter whether the subject is alive or not. This is not really an issue though.

 

Reminds me of the bugs in Deus Ex where one could be rewarded over and over by having a full inventory. At least there is no reason to exploit it in this situation.

[digaphobia]

I've been experimenting with the crash/save corruption.. I had a hard crash and a broken save (as in, the save will crash the game every time I try to load it) after having knocked out Harlan, carrying him through Benson's house. It crashed while I was carrying him, as I tried to quick save. I was able to play through the level and finally see the statistics, only took four tries. I missed 160 loot... I wonder where I didn't look?

[demagogue]

I missed 160 loot... I wonder where I didn't look?

 

Did you find

the hidden safe in Damuddy's office? Look for a small button.

 

[digaphobia]

Did you find

the hidden safe in Damuddy's office? Look for a small button.

 

Ah, no. I guess I'm used to the standard Thief red ball lever.

 

Oh, I meant to say, the globe falls out of the level when it is frobbed. Don't know if someone mentioned that previously.

[Johnny-Natrium]

Wow, this had never happened to me in ANY game I played. Didn't startle at F.E.A.R.. Silent Hill never got to me.. Well those are nothing, but name ANY horror game..

 

When that psycho killer came running out the door I jumped and uncontrollably screamed "NOOOOO" in an apparently horrifying, vocal-cords-breaking voice, as my GF came running, scared shitless. And she's used to some stuff I tell ya. I don't know why, maybe it was the unsettling and awesome build up, with the readables, and then the warehouse... What also helped was, I had just never expected something scripted like that would happen in a mod like this. Shows what you can do with it, and this is only the beginning of the stream of missions. Damn, I tell you, this never happens, and I played some f*cking scary games. Oh, BTW, awesome with the snail in the coffin.

 

Anyway, all in all I feel like this was one of the best missions I ever played. One with true emotional interaction. The 1.03 hour flied by, once I got into it (which happened really quickly).

Just....Thanks for your contribution. I devote my first post to this (!). Hey, fair chance I'll even be doing some voices that'll be in it.

[BrokenArts]

Hah, nice shock moment there. The kind you don't forget. Welcome to the forum.

[digaphobia]

"NOOOOO" in an apparently horrifying, vocal-cords-breaking voice, as my GF came running, scared shitless.

 

That is hilarious.