Fan Mission: St Alban's Cathedral (01/11/2010)

[Sotha]

My intention was not to upset, sorry. It is still a good mission, make no mistake.

 

 

- Er, its the same voting system as is used on contest missions and I only did it so I could see what people thought of the mission.

 

Okay, I thought it would be nice to have a system which is comparable with others. I'll be nice and rate it then.

Appearance: Excellent. Standard Bikerdude stuff.

Gameplay: Good. Would have been excellent without tough clue and lack of AI. (Would have been only OK, if the city part would have not been so fun and nice.)

Story and text: Excellent. It would have been nice to have some more details in the in-game objective-list. I had to save, restart and check the briefing again to know what to do with the fake skull.

 

 

- true, but then why not have one big mission?

Due to AI limitiations?

 

 

- This comment is unfair as it isnt technically possible to have a multi-page map in tdm atm, I did ask this before releasing the mission.

 

Okay I did not know that. Separate maps in inventory, then? City map, Sewer map... Feasable and possible.

 

- again unfair, you mean the side rooms werte a disapointment! You trying building a map of this size and complexity and see if don't get burnout. It would have been kinder to say the rooms were a little plain, which I concede btw. Also I had time constraints, I wanted this map out for around Halloween time before loads of people said they wanted the cathedral/town/sewer/cave all in one map. Also fyi I have and still am currently working on 4 other maps at the same time!

 

Impressive. I recommend focusing and perfecting one mission at the time. I can imagine multiple unfinished missions can result in a burnout.

 

I repeat, this was a good mission. I just listed some of the downsides. The cathedral rooms were not very interesting because they all looked the same, therefore the use of the word 'clone.'

 

 

- I'm kinda getting tired of explaining why you cant have more than a few Ai in big open spaces with D3 - on even mid end systems D3 bogs down!!! just the two Ai in the main hall robbed the map of 15FPS, yeah you read it right!

 

That is the weird thing. I just came here from my map test, where I have a big outside area with four (!) AI's visible. And it runs smoothly. But then again, my area is nowhere near the high detail level you had in the cathedral. I keep outside scenes rather low-poly to make sure multiple AI's can be on screen. And my mission is smaller.

 

- Hah, I take you have never played this before then..? as I have played mission with much harder clues than the simple ones in this mission.

 

Well, it is the mappers job to choose the clues he places in his mission. It is, however, important to remember that this is a game and it should be fun. If the clues are too vague it will result in frustration and that is not fun. And it is a shame that a good mission gets abandoned by the player because he can't read latin and cannot make progress.

 

I felt like quitting at that stage, but I'm glad I didn't.

 

I understand that setting the clue difficulty right is really really difficult. But in essence, clues should be contained in the game world. The solution should be found in the game rather than the player picks up a dictionary in the real world. If there was a latin-english dictionary in the mission, the situation would be entirely different.

 

Thanks for the tip on the gimp alpha thing, I did wonder how to do that.

 

No problems, glad to be of service! Know also that my feedback is not intended to aggravate you, I'm more like trying to bring up points which would improve your future work drastically. At least in my opinion.

[Bikerdude]

Separate maps in inventory, then? City map, Sewer map... Feasable and possible.

Thats not possible to have multiple maps either - but maybe one way of doing it to have sheets with background images (like the on on the inventors bed) that the player can pickup. Said readables could then be added to the players inventory at game start time etc..

 

In fact, I will look at the inventors readable and see if the background image can me changed to one of my choosing.

[Tels]

- I'm kinda getting tired of explaining why you cant have more than a few Ai in big open spaces with D3 - on even mid end systems D3 bogs down!!! just the two Ai in the main hall robbed the map of 15FPS, yeah you read it right!

 

Just a comment on this: I haven't looked, but it might be entirely possible that the pathfinding around the cathedral is too complex for the AI - the rendering of two AI shouldn't take that many FPS, but their thinking can. If the AAS area is very complicated, or they constently bump into big func_statics or small moveables, that might explain it.

 

So there is hope that either the map can be optimized, or our AI canbe optimized later Just saying, I am still glad that somebody pushes the envelope

 

Now my time for tonight is over (damn bug 2417), and I haven't even played the map for 5 minutes Arg!

[Tels]

Thats not possible to have multiple maps either - but maybe one way of doing it to have sheets with background images (like the on on the inventors bed) that the player can pickup. Said readables could then be added to the players inventory at game start time etc..

 

In fact, I will look at the inventors readable and see if the background image can me changed to one of my choosing.

 

Erm, we do have a "Cycle Maps - M" entry in our menus, so I am curious why multiple maps (e.g. you have 2..3 of them) are not possible. Maybe this is a v1.02 limitation?

[Bikerdude]

Just a comment on this: I haven't looked, but it might be entirely possible that the pathfinding around the cathedral is too complex for the AI - the rendering of two AI shouldn't take that many FPS, but their thinking can. If the AAS area is very complicated, or they constently bump into big func_statics or small moveables, that might explain it.

 

Now my time for tonight is over (damn bug 2417), and I haven't even played the map for 5 minutes Arg!

 

I really want to use more Ai, so I would like tyo know what i am doing wrong! and what is bug 2417..?

 

we can cycle maps..? well I cant remember who, but I was told we couldn't have multiple maps..?

[woodrufus]

That means your computer is "infected" with some sort of unwanted software. My website in this case redirects you to a page that tells you how you can get rid of that software. I don't know the specifics but here is quick googling:

 

 

 

Despite the harmless description above, that means the application can monitor all your browsing with IE and it can do a lot of other things that you don't know about!

 

Try this to get rid of it:

 

http://www.lavasoft...._aware_free.php

 

Download and run that program and it should tell you a lot of warnings about things on your computer that you don't want on it.

 

Also: Please do not use Internet Explorer (it is the unsafest browser of all, use Firefox, Opera, Chrome or Safari), and even if you insist using IE, update it to the very newest version. Running an Anti-Virus program, including the Security Essentials(I think they are called that) from Microsoft including a Windows Update are in order, too.

 

 

Cheers - I used firefox to access the site - no problems:-))

[Aprilsister]

Also fyi I have and still am currently working on 4 other maps at the same time!

 

Wow that does seem a little over the top! And now you are enlisting to beta-test Sotha's mission. You are certainly headed for a burnout or sth.

 

Caan someone answer my question about the Bush memo because it really does intrest me how it came to get in this game.

[ungoliant]

Caan someone answer my question about the Bush memo because it really does intrest me how it came to get in this game.

 

screenshot or it didn't happen.

[Aprilsister]

This is the one in the inventors room

 

[Bikerdude]

Wow that does seem a little over the top! And now you are enlisting to beta-test Sotha's mission. You are certainly headed for a burnout or sth.

Already done one run through of his mission, and I dont get burnout when i can take a break etc and work on something different for a while, then i can go back to what i was doing etc.

[pmw57]

This is the one in the inventors room

 

 

Is that the same room where you're supposed to leave the fake skull?

[Bikerdude]

yup

[pmw57]

yup

 

Can you please provide directions to help us find that in our own map?

 

I enter the inventors room via the bedroom, and where to from there?

[Aprilsister]

This is getting strange B1k3rdude why won't you answer my question? Its not that big of a deal.

[LEGION]

Thats not possible to have multiple maps either - but maybe one way of doing it to have sheets with background images (like the on on the inventors bed) that the player can pickup. Said readables could then be added to the players inventory at game start time etc..

 

Stumpy´s Lord Duffords had multiple maps, but they had the mousepointer shown, otherwise they worked fine and were needed for the big mission...

[Springheel]

I seem to be stuck. I've read the clue

leading to the ceiling, and went up and turned the crank, (and read the latin that meant nothing to me), but I have no idea what it did. I also don't know where the skull/skeleton is. I've been through the crypts but the only skeletons

I found were generic. Is there some clue to the location that I'm missing? I have absolutely no idea where to go next.

[pmw57]

I seem to be stuck. I've read the clue leading to the ceiling, and went up and turned the crank, (and read the latin that meant nothing to me), but I have no idea what it did. I also don't know where the skull/skeleton is. Is there some clue to the location that I'm missing?

 

It's not exactly obvious.

 

Is there some plan that that map maker had for is to get from clue 1 to clue 2? Or are we supposed to just eventually stumble across it?

[Springheel]

It's not exactly obvious.

 

Do you know where it is? I was hoping to play more tonight, but I'm completely stuck.

[Aprilsister]

pmw57

 

I enter the inventors room via the bedroom, and where to from there

 

The inventor's room in the cathedral. You seem to be somewhere else because its only one room off the hall.

 

Springheel

 

 

 

Look at the interesting things areound the crypt

 

 

Edited November 7, 2010 by Aprilsister

[Springheel]

[spolier]

look at the interesting things areound the crypt

 

Can you be more explicit? I have no idea what that means.

 

I've found some

block of stone on the floor that I can pick up and carry, but I have no idea what it is or what

I'm supposed to do with it.

 

I'm having flashbacks to Grayman's mission here...loads of fantastic potential in the mission, but I'm stuck being frustrated because I don't know what the heck I'm supposed to do.

[pmw57]

Do you know where it is? I was hoping to play more tonight, but I'm completely stuck.

 

 

Here is what the plaque translates to:

 

with the hawks, doves will congregate

they will drop honey from the cliffs

wine will surge over the earth

the sheep will wander harmlessly with the wolf

then the wicked will rise, but to retribution

Bikerdude says:

 

explore below and ye shall be rewarded

While what was said helped to find the next clue, I still am puzzled concerning the developers plan as to how the plaque is supposed to help you find the next one.

Edited November 7, 2010 by pmw57

[Springheel]

Gah. I read that clue already, but explore below WHAT? I looked all around on the floor below the ceiling switch and I saw nothing. Is that where I'm supposed to look? Or is it the crypts? I didn't see anything special there either.

[Aprilsister]

Springheel

 

 

 

The clues are useless to me too only what you find near the last one makes any difference. I found the last one number 3 without any help from number two. The last one is above the door into the crypt beneth a stone plaque to be very explicit

 

 

[Aprilsister]

Springheel more explicit as you seem to be getting understandably frustrated.

 

 

 

The switch opens a hole inside the coffin at the far end of the crypt on the left. Impossible to hear and determine the location as its too far away to make sense.

 

[Bikerdude]

Ok as this seem to escaping most people - the first letter of each word on the second clue spells the word CRYPT.....