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nbohr1more

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nbohr did the right thing, nothing was going to happen if someone didn't take action and start narrowing down the themes.

 

If it could be arranged, it would be cool if the contest winner for this contest could get some reward like..

 

I can tell from personal experience that winning a contest is a really big reward in itself: to see your work enjoyed by the community and be preferred over some really good and worthy FM contestants. So no need to have extra-perks, I think. But I wouldn't complain if winning brought a new sports car to my collection and a few top model personal assistants among my existing ones. ;)

 

But I did have some real questions too:

Looks like Dark Secret is winning. I'd like to know about the contest rules. Will only FM's which building has begun after the contest has been announced, be accepted as contest entries? I mean, I've been working quite a while on a new map. Can I enter the contest with a map, which has been under building before the contest was announced?

 

One might argue that it would be unfair towards others since I've had much more mapping time on this. But if the contest gives a generous amount of mapping time, it should not matter: I just release my map earlier than the others, and other contestants have plenty of time to do their work from scratch.

 

If a my map can enter, I will participate in the contest. If it cannot, I've no time to do another map. (Minus one contestant.):)

Clipper

-The mapper's best friend.

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LOL

 

I think half the votes for Dark Secret might've been to get you to release earlier and the Snow votes might've been for Grayman's pending missions. :laugh:

 

 

 

I can't objectively answer your concern Sotha. If this contest encourages you to "give it all you've got" I would be salivating over that result alone. :wub:

 

(I might need to make a contest rules poll to sort this one out :laugh: )

Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

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He'll be up against all the Darkfate, TTLG, Moddb, Rage3d, Beyond3d, and Quake3world mappers I can find... will that even things out?

 

(Yeah, it's a little unfair to have a head start though...) :unsure:

Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

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He'll be up against all the Darkfate, TTLG, Moddb, Rage3d, Beyond3d, and Quake3world mappers I can find...

 

That's the idea. Getting new mappers in... And I applaud you for the effort and really hope you can deliver on even one mapper from each of those sources... that would be excellent!

 

But stacking the deck? Not so encouraging (generally, on principle -- and for new mappers, in particular). And not necessary either.

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Yes, that's perfect!

 

Let the last contest winner use his chosen mission style to enter a mission he's been working on for some time already in the "contest". That's the spirit!

 

[...]

 

But stacking the deck..

 

Well, if you put it like that, then fine: I'll abstain from entering the contest unless other, more favourable opinions come out. In this case, it should be marked in the rules that only new missions are allowed, ie. mission building was started after the contest announcement. And then there is the difficulty of controlling this: not everyone may be as forthcoming as I...

 

But in the end, the fairness of this eventually boils down to time: if there is plenty of time for the mappers to do their work (as there should be to improve FM quality) any benefit of a head start is insignificant.

 

Oh, and if there is a generous time limit, it would be better to get the contest going already: the sooner the contest announcement, the sooner we have the deadline and the sooner we have new FM's to play..:)

Clipper

-The mapper's best friend.

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If it could be arranged, it would be cool if the contest winner for this contest could get some reward like:

 

1) Early preview of "Blackheart Manor" or "The Dead Gathers"

 

 

Is Blackheart Manor really going to be released ? Couple of years already passed after early preview

Proceed with caution!

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Sotha, sorry to have been so... indignant?... pissy?... blunt?... sarcastic?...

 

AOTA?

 

Anyway, basically what I'm saying is that contests have, I believe, always been about building within some timeframe.

 

As for excluding yourself, I, of course, can not and should not be telling you what to do but I'd hope you might just continue with your current FM and leave the contest to some new folks. You have nothing to prove. You have a FM underway and need no motivation or deadlines or guidelines.

 

And, if you'll look here, you'll see that many potential FMAs are intimidated, whether rightly or wrongly, by "old-pros"...

 

Those are the objective objectives! ;)

 

......

 

Of course full disclosure would be that if you weren't already working on a FM I'd be dropping my usual why-don't-you-see-if-you-can-blow-us-all-away-and-make-two-FMs-for-one-contest! nudges... and further FD, already stated explicitly, I hope to see this contest succeed by being a launching pad for many missions by many new FMAs and without the passing of many moons.

 

Those are the selfish subjective objectives! ;)

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Typically contests have the requirement:

 

New missions only. That's why it's a time limit, etc... To see who can build the mission in the time limit, not who can finish up a mission in the time limit. I've got a mission that would qualify under dark secrets, but seeing how it's got 4 + months of dev time in doesn't seem like it would be fair to enter it.

 

I don't think there should be a 'noob only' rule, that just minimizes entries. And since there isn't some big prize to compete for it's not like a noob would lose out on that. Contests have always been about 'mission accomplished' imo. Participating and getting one done.

 

Also, I don't think any entries, even if completed, should be released before the final date. IMO it stacks the voting, etc... One comes early a lot more people play and discuss it long before any one else even finishes.

I can see having a completion period, so missions stagger a bit and it's easier for people to play them all. But I'm talking a week maybe. If someone finishes early they wait and release first day, if someone has problems or is slow they have a few extra days..

 

But releasing a month early imo isn't really along the lines of a contest, the point is all the missions have the same build time and are released as a 'package'.

Dark is the sway that mows like a harvest

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I'm currently working on a new TF2 map. I've been submitting some models to valve and the reason I'm making this map is also to submit, there's some pretty good money in it if they buy your stuff.

 

The reason I mention it is TF2maps.net is also having a contest, and I'm using that as my base timeline/motivation to get this done. If I can place high in the contest it'll help with recognition, etc... and hopefully increase the chances. Anyway, short story long...

 

The prizes for that contest are:

First Place

3 months of TF2Maps.net donor status.

Steam game of your choice.

 

Second Place

3 months of TF2Maps.net donor status.

Valve store Poster bundle.

1 x random class TF2 keychain + 1 x TF2 card pack

 

Third Place

1 month of TF2Maps.net donor status.

1 x random class TF2 keychain + 1 x TF2 card pack

--------------------

 

So you get donor status to their site, which gives you file uploads/ server admin (change maps, etc... easier to test your maps), a forum name badge (donor)/ contest winner badge, and steam game of choice. The game is really the main prize and it's paid for by donations I'm sure.

 

So it's a bit different, obviously TF2 is tightly entwined with the Valve store and whatnot. And this forums doesn't really have donor options. Peeking at the dev forums isn't really a prize and I don't think the team really wants that stuff 'leaked'. We also don't have merchandise.

but it also shows that the prizes (if given) don't have to be huge to be appreciated or get people to map. (there are currently probably 20-30 entries, I'd say 10 will drop and only 10 will be contenders)

 

Having contest winner on your badge is cool. and I think enough. Also a good write-up, posting on main page, moddb, just good promotion for winner would be cool.

 

But maybe having a paypal fund would be cool to. If everyone chipped in a dollar it could add up (don't have to compete to chip in). Even $20 would just be cool to win. Not that people are going to enter because there's a $20 on the line, it would just be a cool reward.

 

Not really sure if we should go into 'coding help' as that's what the forums are for anyway, or promises of having your code put into mod (gotta find someone willing, team has to agree, etc...). It's really gotta remain a non-commital by busy team members.

Dark is the sway that mows like a harvest

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Sotha, sorry to have been so... indignant?... pissy?... blunt?... sarcastic?...

 

AOTA?

 

Not at all, you pointed out an important thing.

 

What is AOTA?

 

I agree that it would be wise to formulate some kind of standard contest rules. Good ideas have been already posted here.

Clipper

-The mapper's best friend.

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I thought about some sort of co-branding thing for this contest.

 

My first thought was to somehow get Apple on-board was as a contest sponsor because the Apple compile is an upcoming feature. I was dreaming of that "iCade" arcade style iPad dock at Think Geek and dreaming of winning one (along with an iPad). :laugh:

 

After coming down to earth, perhaps Rage3D or NVnews would co-sponsor?

 

I know that motherboard manufacturers used to sponsor mapping contests (I have seen Doom 3 maps with a big garish VIA logo in them ^_^ ).

 

Maybe Rock Paper Shotgun would be game since they seem to mention TDM more often than other publications?

 

Any other lower-profile (more realistic) sites or PC hardware vendors to seek out for co-branding the contest?

Edited by nbohr1more

Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

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There is a good chance that Rage3D will be cross-promoting this contest. (Discussions are ongoing.)

 

We might even get a hardware vendor involved... :D

Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

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One of the ex-moderators at Rage3D often told off-color or politically incorrect jokes. Eventually he lost his moderator status for crossing the line. Many of his admirers followed suit as an act of rebellion against the dismissal and some of that nonsense still lingers...

 

The mainstream Rage3D user is more interested in over-clocking voltages for ATI hardware and complaining about games that aren't properly profiled for Crossfire with ultra-mega dual-GPU video cards (so Quad Crossfire).

 

In short, it's a hardware buff site and one that might even offer a hardware prize for this contest if stars are aligned...

Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

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I don't like it at all. Quite frankly, the difference between a good mission and an excellent one will hardly be made by the plot.

Given the relative youth of TDM, it's not yet worth having a contest over storytelling issues. IMO the voters will probably rate highly the best mission independently of the theme.

 

I would have preferred the theme having a much bigger impact on the difference between released missions.

 

As for not allowing already started missions, I wonder what part of the contesters will really be newcomers. People who intend to work on TDM someday probably either have started their missions already or are waiting for free time to do so and a contest won't change a thing. At least I know it won't for me.

Sure it would be more fair to have everyone start from scratch, but in the end what matters is the fun the mappers had and the quality of the released FMs. So if some people have something that fits the theme and to which they have already given a lot of love, I say let them enter.

How are you going to enforce that rule anyway?

Edited by Briareos H
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I don't like it at all. Quite frankly, the difference between a good mission and an excellent one will hardly be made by the plot.

Given the relative youth of TDM, it's not yet worth having a contest over storytelling issues. IMO the voters will probably rate highly the best mission independently of the theme.

 

I would have preferred the theme having a much bigger impact on the difference between released missions.

 

As for not allowing already started missions, I wonder what part of the contesters will really be newcomers. People who intend to work on TDM someday probably either have started their missions already or are waiting for free time to do so and a contest won't change a thing. At least I know it won't for me.

Sure it would be more fair to have everyone start from scratch, but in the end what matters is the fun the mappers had and the quality of the released FMs. So if some people have something that fits the theme and to which they have already given a lot of love, I say let them enter.

How are you going to enforce that rule anyway?

 

Well for example a lot of the wip's already have had images posted. 2nd it's a pretty small community and we expect everyone to be truthful about it. Thief FM contests have always been this way, they have never had prizes, they've always been fun.

 

If an author has a mission in progress and they want to enter the mission they just start a new one. Typically contest missions are small, it keeps everyone in the realm of being able to finish on time. But most authors personal works tend to be much larger in scope, so most authors don't want to/ can't use their current projects anyway.

 

And a lot of contest missions come from first time authors, there's never been an 'intimidation factor' imo. Because you aren't competing for some huge prize. It's just a nice small, friendly way to get involved.

Dark is the sway that mows like a harvest

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Thief FM contests have always been this way, they have never had prizes, they've always been fun.

 

Which is why I was wondering (seeing also how you are familiar with the timeframe concept, signaling that you have the same understanding as I do) why you took the "prizes" nonsense to a whole new level by suggesting... monetary reward?

 

superstock01.gif

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Well, I DIDN'T take it took a new level with monetary reward. Someone else mentioned a money pool. I just agreed that it would be a cool prize. Just like a friendly office bet. 20 people chip in a buck. Not enough money to make a contest unfriendly, not even enough to make it worth while to build a mission. And a dollar or two certianly wouldn't put anybody out. If you can afford internet a buck is no big deal.

 

And since I suggested a purely voluntary donation it wouldn't matter if you compete or not, or if you're a team member or not. Not a requirement.

 

Not a motivation, just a cool little bonus.

 

(and this is coming from someone who WOULD donate a few bucks and will definitely NOT be competeing this time around)

Dark is the sway that mows like a harvest

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A prize isn't some evil corrupting influence per se. My only reason for bringing the concept of a prize to the table is to get mappers outside the community hooked on DarkRadiant and The Dark Mod.

 

I'm a pusher. :laugh:

 

Yes, there is no real way to enforce the "This map must be constructed only during the contest time-frame" and bringing in other mappers virtually ensures that, say, a veteran Doom 3 mapper will convert one of his "Hell" style maps to TDM format or a mapper for another engine will export his stuff to Blender and convert to ASE models (etc).

 

I won't be complaining about the quantity of new missions that result from this incentive :laugh:

 

And Sotha could've kept his new mission secret and waited till a contest arrived so his posts in this thread shows a truck-load of integrity from him.

 

I kinda would like the former contest winners in the pool so that the new guys get a chance to "topple the King". That is excitement!

Edited by nbohr1more

Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

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