TDM Hub poll thread

[ungoliant]

idea taken from this thread.

 

would you like it or not?

Edited September 10, 2012 by ungoliant

[pusianka]

The poll has a tendency in its answers

 

and it should have added - THE FEATURE ITSELF.

 

and there should be reference to other topic...

Edited September 10, 2012 by pusianka

[ungoliant]

the vote is only for the feature. I didn't put in any caveats

[Melan]

The Nope Pope says nope.

[grayman]

No, for reasons given in the thread where it was proposed.

[Bikerdude]

No, for reasons given in the thread where it was proposed.

+1

[jysk]

I would like to have pink elephants in TDM.

[Mortem Desino]

I would like to have pink elephants in TDM.

Yes, and Farrell needs a bazooka as well as fuzzy bunny slippers on his feet.

[SeriousToni]

No, the rocket launcher first!

[7upMan]

NNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!, because I hated the city hub in TDS. I wouldn't want to repeat this experience in TDM.

[Tels]

Regardless on willingness and manpower to implement this feature, this will not work. On a fast machine, with everything loaded from cache, a small map takes only a few seconds to load. However, a bigger hub, on a slow machine, after boot (not yet cached PK4s), this will take a minute.

 

Players will not like to wait a minute just to select a mission.

[Obsttorte]

this hub thing isn't that bad at all, it only doesn't fit in the way pusianka intented it here

it could be quiet nice if for example someone would build an own campaign (if ever) and wants to include this feature

but I think it shouldn't be made as for example in Thief 3, I think:

 

- the hub shold be rather small

- it should extend from mission to mission, so you don't always see the same

- you should have a profit from going there, for example you can find a map for the next mission or unlock gadgets for the pre-mission shop like gas-arrows or something

- it could be optional like you can go there and accomplish e.g. the above mentioned things or just skip to the next mission

 

I think in such a way it may work, but as I said only in an own campaign, so its more an idea that may never come true

Edited September 12, 2012 by Obsttorte

[lost_soul]

I voted yes, even though I understand perfectly well the reasons it will not happen and I agree with them.

 

It would still be cool to experience something like a hub. Besides, terrorizing the city in Thief Deadly Shadows was a lot of fun.

[RPGista]

Thief 3 AI had some advantages over TDM's, I had it written down somewhere, but there are reasons this AI wouldnt go well with a GTA kind of city, like Thief3 was aiming at emulating (for the success of the concept). One shared fault is that AI will know who you are even if they never saw you before, if you are a "suspect" (did something wrong in public and now is branded as a criminal) everyone will react to you even in the other side of the town (that would be limited to a node in T3). There should be a difference between AI that witnessed you doing the crime, those who got the warn, and those who are still unaware of the whole thing. AI in TDM wont notice you are doing something "illegal" like pickpocketing in front of everyone, as in T3. TDM's neutral AI is quite rigid and will not respond to almost anything you do, or that they see you doing (as if you are a ghost), either they are your enemy by default or they will ignore you exist. They also need to be placed carefully and have their own patrols and interactions drawn in detail by the mapper, there is no "random spawning of AI going about their business and walking the city with possible valuables" to populate the map and walk around by themselves. There is more to say, but anyway... Any rich city space in TDM has to be carefully orchestrated by the mapper and would most likely be aimed at a single run, beating the aim of what you guys are thinking about.

[demagogue]

All the things about AI (guards or neutrals) noticing the player committing a crime or remembering if he was a criminal or not (as opposed to AI in other locations) is all part of the Security Level system in the works for TDM. Hopefully in the future it will have a system very similar to just how you described.

 

There are ways you could do random spawning of AI in TDM, and I think a few FMs have done it. I think mappers just haven't tried it very much.

[lost_soul]

The thing about respawning AI though is that you have to delete the old bodies, or the frame rate will go way down. While unlimited guards would be bad in missions, respawning civilians/city watch would add to making a city hub feel alive. This way, you could do cool things like having thugs fighting/running from city watch without interraction from the player.

Edited September 14, 2012 by lost_soul

[stumpy]

my maps are not set in bridgeport so how would that work.

[Springheel]

respawning civilians/city watch would add to making a city hub feel alive

 

They didn't in TDS.

 

"Look, the woman I just KO'd has an identical sister who just came around the corner. *thump* Hey, look, they must have been triplets! *whack* Hey..."

[Obsttorte]

respawning AI wouldn't add more athmosphere to a map, i think at least it would just enoy the player

i mean, you knock out a guard patrolling in front of a door you want to lockpick and one minute later a new guy appears so knocking out the guard doesnt give you any benefit

 

btw. the player dont have to knock out a civilian just to pickpocket her neither anyone else if they ignore them until he is seen by something illegal (so he just had to avoid that)

[i30817]

I beg to differ!

 

 

Would really need a special AI that doesn't do hit collision between themselves (but moves in ways so that it's not obvious to the player) though.

[pusianka]

To all asking "where would be my mission", I already exaplined all possiblities and as for Bridgeport - I haven't said for one stupid moment it's gonna be Bridgeport. Best for consistency would be not to call the city any name. It allows everyone to say - hey, it's city called [enter the name that you like].

[New Horizon]

Generica?

[pusianka]

pardon?

[New Horizon]

The name of the town? Shall we call it Generica? lol

[Springheel]

Best for consistency would be not to call the city any name

 

Kind of defeats the argument that "it gives is a much bigger connection to the world of TDM" if the hub is just some nameless, generic city.