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Linux sucks


AluminumHaste

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I rebuilt my PC to dual boot Mint Linux 15 and Windows 8. Had no real problems with Mint Linux at all. Native Steam works fine and all the Half Life games are there as full or Beta releases and work perfectly. PlayOnLinux is very impressive. I can play the vast majority of my games with a little tweaking with few problems. I do have a couple of minor issues with returning resolution to the desktop resolution for older games but that's quite rare and easy put right.

 

Not installed TDM just yet. I'm waiting for 2.0 before I do that.

 

Fuck you linux, you are NOT an alternative to Windows and at this rate you never will be

 

In respect to the quote. Good. It isn't meant to be. Same as iOS, Unix, etc. isn't meant to be either.

 

On a related note, I highly recommend Mint Linux 15 with Cinnamon. It's close enough to Windows 7 to be an easy transition without being too samey.

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In respect to the quote. Good. It isn't meant to be. Same as iOS, Unix, etc. isn't meant to be either.

 

On a related note, I highly recommend Mint Linux 15 with Cinnamon. It's close enough to Windows 7 to be an easy transition without being too samey.

 

*clap* :)

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Here comes another rant. I was setting stuff up on my Ubuntu laptop today because I will be leaving soon. I'm using the GNOME fallback mode. It boggles the mind how they violate basic usability principles. For example, take the file manager. For the past FIFTEEN years, you have been able to start typing the name of a folder or file in the current directory and it would immediately be selected in a GUI file manager. Guess what? If you have a folder named "music" and you start banging out m...u...s...i... on the keyboard, it NOW does a recursive search of all sub-folders and displays all sorts of random shit, rather than just jumping to the file on the screen that you are too lazy to grab the mouse and click yourself.

 

Hey developers, when there's a file named Tom's Schedule on the screen and I type tom on the keyboard, you're supposed to select it. Its not rocket science. I don't want to search through all sub folders and start displaying music like Tom Petty, which happens to be four or five layers down in directories from where I currently am. But hey, I guess we have to make use of this core I7 for something.

 

***Number two***

For the past million years, we have also been able to press backspace on the keyboard and the file manager would return us to the previous directory. Not any more! Now you *have* to press alt-left to go back. Since guys like me have established a habbit of just hitting backspace for so long now, this is another annoyance. Also, alt+left takes two fingers, backspace only takes one. Again, you don't need a college degree to figure this shit out. As soon as I get used to pressing alt+left, they will just change it again to annoy me some more.

 

***Number three***

After using the machine for a wile, I shut it down... or at least, I tried to. Although it shut down correctly a couple of times yesterday, it hung on me again today during the shutdown process.

 

Its one of those lessons in life: nothing ever gets fixed, and nothing ever changes.

--- War does not decide who is right, war decides who is left.

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I use linux as my main PC OS--archlinux in particular. And I have to say that it is a pain in the ass whenever I try to change something. Add new hardware, there's almost always a bug with it. Update or add a new program, there's a good chance I'll have a problem with it (almost guaranteed if I do a full system update). Many things only "half work", e.g. for several years I've had a suspend-to-ram bug where there's something like a 10% chance the PC will lock up on execution of the command. I either deal with these things or spend hours--days once in a while--trying to resolve the issue.

 

However, even with these things, I still can't find an OS that better suits me. I simply like a sane development environment, a modular (and also sane) CLI, bleeding edge software (and hardware), and there's always some obscure program I want to install and incorporate into my scripts (thanks to modularity). Windows cannot offer me this, and I find the lack of such things more frustrating than the issues I experience with linux.

 

Still, I do not personally know more than 3 people that I would encourage to use linux, and those people already use linux. I usually reboot to windows 7 to play games, but Valve and indie developers seem to be slowly chipping away at this issue.

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  • 2 months later...

I had a laugh at this this morning. http://www.muktware....rt-ubuntus-xmir

 

I hope the other GPU providers do the same thing. Let's PLEASE not have a complete fucked-up/fragmented graphics system on Linux, where we have to craft special configurations to get specific applications to run depending on which windowing system we happen to be using.

 

--How to properly solve this problem--

Let's get everybody at a table. They all have to agree on what features the new windowing system needs. Some require tablet functionality, some require multiple displays. Then we build a system that supports all of the features that EVERYBODY requires, but we make it modular. On my desktop, there is no point in having tablet support. On the flipside, on most tablets, there is no point in having dual-head support. This will decrease bloat and memory footprint because the given machine won't have to include those modules.

 

Then, when we get ALL of the features that people require up and running, and when all the GPU makers have good drivers for the new system, we ALL agree to drop X. That is how you do a proper transition.

Edited by lost_soul

--- War does not decide who is right, war decides who is left.

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--How to properly solve this problem--

Let's get everybody at a table.

It's Linux. Which means you will never get everybody at a table. :) That's the general problem with Linux/Open Source. Everybody shares the code, but noone works together. Too many egos. Look at Linus Torvalds. Mr. Super Ego. I like to use Linux on my notebooks (never ever for gaming), but the politics, and background stuff is horrible to me.

 

Btw, Ubuntu gets an undeserved bashing atm. Everything they do is wrong, starting from the stuff with the Amazon-lense. I don't think it's justified. And the article you linked to left me with the feeling "So what.". Pretty sure it won't be a problem for Ubuntu.

Edited by chk772
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I propose we change the title of this thread from "Linux Sucks" to "Ubuntu Linux Sucks".

:P

 

Edit: and yes, I do have an "Ubuntu" system listed in my sig. That's LinuxMint 14, and it sucks slightly less than Ubuntu.

Edited by PranQster

System: Mageia Linux Cauldron, aka Mageia 8

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I propose we change the title of this thread from "Linux Sucks" to "Ubuntu Linux Sucks".

:P

 

Actually Ubuntu is the only decent distribution, as there's a company behind it with enough manpower to sort out issues. But well, not worth another discussion on whose distro is better. :) Mint is a Ubuntu anyway, so. :P

Edited by chk772
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Actually Ubuntu is the only decent distribution, as there's a company behind it with enough manpower to sort out issues. But well, not worth another discussion on whose distro is better. :) Mint is a Ubuntu anyway, so. :P

 

Don't talk stuff without trying other distros. Mint fixes a lot of usability issues with ubuntu and is a generally more pleasant OS to get started with Linux. There's also Fedora and RHEL, made by Red Hat Co, which are by far the most successful distros in terms of enterprise solutions and tech support, both largely surpassing Ubuntu in terms of professional customers and actual profit share, Red Hat itself being valued over 1 billion dollars. Then there's Debian, completely managed by a non-profit foundation and the most popular distro for server hosting worldwide. It's my distro of choice and In fact, Ubuntu is actually based on Debian.

Edited by zergrush
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I tried other distros. OpenSuse, which sucked big time, i always had problems with the packet managing, and installing drivers back then, 2006-2007 was a big PITA. Mint with Cinnamon, which had and still has loads of issues. Xubuntu, which also has enough issues (small dev team, what do you expect). All in all Ubuntu is the most stable and issue free for me. Debian i won't use, because i'm not the guy to build up a whole system. I'm rather a user than a fiddler. Pretty slow development in that too anyway, no wonder as it's community based.

But as i said... please no discussions on whose distro is the best, there are enough of those, and it's stupid anyway. Just wanted to relativize the point "Ubuntu Linux sucks" a bit. Edited by chk772
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I've tried almost all the Linux Distros, out of curiosity, at one point or another and I can't say that any of them "suck". Like TDM, Linux is mostly maintained by community members, so I can respect that the OS 'is what it is'. I can't say that any product made in someone else's spare time actually sucks. With a Windows or Mac OS, you're investing money in an officially maintained product, with Linux it's more an investment of time. I've run into issues with drivers on Windows and Mac too, so being a professional product doesn't fix everything.

 

I have puppy linux running on an older laptop right now, and a PPC version of Ubuntu on an old G4 ibook. They're not perfect, but no OS is.

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I've run into issues with drivers on Windows and Mac too, so being a professional product doesn't fix everything.

The driver situation is mostly pretty much down to whether the companies provide drivers for Linux or not though. The open source drivers usually don't support all features of the hardware, or are just bad. What most people don't get though, is that the companies are not "evil not to support Linux" though, but it's completely a financial consideration. Why support, and put manpower into supporting a system running on 1-2 % of home computers world wide. And to take it further, a company has to pay its employees. It cannot waste money and manpower into things without a decent market share.

 

Concerning the issues and bugs: In my experience, Linux always has a couple more of those than Windows or MacOS. That has to do with the manpower, and often also with the "gift horse" thing. You just don't mind the issues so much, if you have paid nothing for it. :) At the moment, on Ubuntu 13.04, i have some issues with full screen applications, it shows parts of the Ubuntu panel, when using full screen sometimes, and the shadow of the panel. Further, the standby mode doesn't always work. Many times, i have to close my netbooks lid 2 times to invoke the standby. On Mint i had problems with deactivating the wireless. Needed to reboot then, to activate it again... further, some of the Cinnamon panel applets have some issues, the thrid party extensions won't work in 90 % of the cases, VLC has some issues after pausing the playback (same on Ubuntu) and a couple of other things... i don't have that amount of issues on Windows.

 

Edit: Oh and Java programs have general GUI issues in Gnome 3/Cinnamon and Unity.

Edited by chk772
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... i don't have that amount of issues on Windows.

 

Again, it comes down to free vs. multi-million dollar companies.

 

It's all relative.

 

I've installed linux on a number of Mac and Windows PC's over the years and I guess I've just been lucky not to run into anything that couldn't be solved by spending a few minutes googling and then running some commands in the terminal. It's higher maintenance, yes, but that's to be expected. Considering how it's developed, I think it's a fantastic OS.

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Again, it comes down to free vs. multi-million dollar companies.

 

It's all relative.

 

I've installed linux on a number of Mac and Windows PC's over the years and I guess I've just been lucky not to run into anything that couldn't be solved by spending a few minutes googling and then running some commands in the terminal. It's higher maintenance, yes, but that's to be expected. Considering how it's developed, I think it's a fantastic OS.

Totally agree. :) I've not gotten into bigger issues myself either, but i bought my hardware with Linux compatibility in mind anyway. Better to run out of the box imo.

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I'm sure I've said it already, but I think the system you're used to will be the one with least annoying bugs/issues/tribulations - and that has more to do with what you're used to and grown comfortable with rather than some kind of quantifiable measure of bugs / issues. [says Jay remembering the giggles getting Windows 7 to talk to a printer on a network.]

 

If you're a computer enthusiast, then you've probably learnt to tame windows / linux - but you also probably forget that most people aren't enthusiasts and don't have that level of knowledge/skill/patience. Most people's experience of (Windows) PCs are that they spend 3 months bothering you with nag screens and pop ups and getting ever slower before grinding to a halt.

 

Generally I've found that 'nix works pretty much seamlessly straight out the box perhaps 90% of the time (rough guess) + maybe a tiny bit of one time help with spit and polish & getting a few things just so - but once you're there, that's it. Windows on the other hand is working out the box (heck, it's preinstalled) maybe 100% of the time, but the UI is a dog and for most people the general experience then goes down hill rapidly.

 

Most of all, I think PCs are highly complex, multi purpose legacy devices. You pay your money (or not, both are effectively free) and takes your choice.

 

--edit--

Actually, I've got a thing or two to say about drivers.

 

The open source drivers usually don't support all features of the hardware, or are just bad

 

err, which open source drivers are 'just bad'? Seriously, name 'em. And what the hell is great about Windows and its drivers?

 

All drivers suck, and companies that demand that you install special software to make their products work suck. Most hardware simply doesn't need a special software driver to make it function (honestly, you really don't need anything a computer can't already do to send a postscript file to a printer and you certainly don't need a driver to use a mouse or a USB stick). The advantages are almost always for the producer (exclusive contracts, software patent wrangles, installing company branding on your PC etc etc) and almost never for the consumer. Drivers are the scourge of shit consumer peripherals. To hell with them.

Edited by jay pettitt
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I tried other distros. OpenSuse, which sucked big time, i always had problems with the packet managing, and installing drivers back then, 2006-2007 was a big PITA.

 

2006/7 isn't now.

 

Mint with Cinnamon, which had and still has loads of issues.

 

It's an unstable DE, what else did you expect? Try the MATE version and stick to it. Besides, Cinnamon has also advanced a lot lately.

 

Xubuntu, which also has enough issues (small dev team, what do you expect).

 

Xubuntu is just Ubuntu with a different DE and software defaults. The same issues you find there are the same exact ones you find in Ubuntu, and it has nothing to do with the team itself.

 

All in all Ubuntu is the most stable and issue free for me. Debian i won't use, because i'm not the guy to build up a whole system. I'm rather a user than a fiddler. Pretty slow development in that too anyway, no wonder as it's community based.

 

If you know how to use Ubuntu, you know how to use Debian. It's not a barebones distro as they say. It just includes a more stale ensemble of defaults. If you can use a package manager that's not the Software Center, you can use Debian. Customizing it is as simple as installing your favourite programs when you do a fresh Windows install, which you do everytime. Also don't use the word "stable" in this context. Ubuntu is actually based on the Debian unstable branch, with some edges trimmed here and there. It's far from being a stable distro when compared to RHEL, Debian Stable/Testing or even OpenSuse, which you previously mentioned.

Edited by zergrush
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Windows users always find someone stupid enough (like me) to maintain it for free. It does definitely not run without issues.

 

And once you're used to the package manager of your distribution, I don't know how you could go back to the way you install and update software under windows. A lot of people I know think software updates are a bad thing just because it's such a pain on windows.

 

My point is that there are issues that most people don't perceive as such because they don't know anything else.

Edited by Baal
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err, which open source drivers are 'just bad'? Seriously, name 'em.

For example the default used wireless driver for my netbook's wireless device couldn't connect me to my router. I had to install another driver to make it work. Do i even have to explain that linux' grahpics card drivers are often bad, because they don't support all hardware capabilities?

 

And what the hell is great about Windows and its drivers?

For example that they're optimised for the hardware, support all stuff the hardware is capable of, are mostly performance optimized and and and... loads of stuff which most linux open source drivers aren't, because someone is working in his spare time on them, and has to do a lot of reverse engineering to make them work.

 

@ zergrush: Please reply to my post as a whole, because it is a whole. Ripping it apart and bashing on single points doesn't do it justice, thanks. :)

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@ zergrush: Please reply to my post as a whole, because it is a whole. Ripping it apart and bashing on single points doesn't do it justice, thanks. :)

 

Your post was composed of several different issues which were more easily treated in a separate manner. If you sum up all the quotes, you will realized I did not exclude or omit any bit whatsoever (save for the last line which is just a simple sum), just split it in parts to make the answer more easily readable and also easier to write. Otherwise you would end up with one bulky paragraph. I suggest you to start reading replies instead of just assuming what's written on them.

Edited by zergrush
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Well, all OS have their pros and cons. Personally I think , if one just want to play some games, watch some videos and surf in the internet a bit, Windows is the best way to go. But if you want a system under which you can really work, Linux has a lot of pros. Due to the fact that the ways data is arranged under linux is relatively fixed, a normal user don't have to do much to get even complicated things to work. Just try to get PETSc compiled under windows if you don't have much knowledge about compiling, cmake etc. and you know what I'm talking about.

 

In addition, it provides a lot of free software in an easy accessible way. And old hardware, like my ten years old printer and scanner work like a charm.

 

As always, it depends on what you actually want.

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