Fan Mission: Breaking out the Fence (17/03/2014) by Kyyrma

[DeusXIncognita]

Went through that mission today.

 

Was a nice little mission, with quite a bit of content for that space.

Also there are really nice and interesting ideas that were done in that mission, that was nice.

 

Details:

 

 

First: I played with TDM 2.02; on expert mode.

 

My experience on the runthrough:

After a bit of exploring, the first camera sees me in the dark, which i noticed after an alarm was sound, and all the guards were running to the Front door.

At that point I decide, that this is going to be an unusual playthrough, and decide to just carry on, no matter what, if possible (couldn't really keep that, since being seen most of the time meant the mission being over, sadly - with nothing to parry, hard to get away because of the small map, and no killing / KOing possible, but for everything possible i kept it)

I use that opening to sneak into the tavern, look around a bit. Upstairs i open the door to the outside, which is heard by a guard patrouilling again outside. I look around more, open another door. A guy downstairs hears it, comes up. I take his key. Suddenly he seems vanished. I try to go to the trunk, suddenly the guy is there again, seems to hear something and looks around with a drawn weapon. I hide on the bed till he goes away.

I open the trunk with the key and take the important tools.

 

I use the balcony to go down, remember that one of those guards (I think one i had already) still has a key. I follow the guard in a dark alley, always in the shadow. Want to wait till the guard passes me, to take the key. suddenly, another alarm. I sneak deeper in the shadows, and many guards come to the side entrance. In the chaos, i sneak around the corner to get away. One guard must have heard me, he follows me, can't have ssen me though. He follows me to the toilet, always seemingly hearing me (I can't even hear me well).

I go down in the sewer, and hear that guard trying to find me for some time after that, always mumbling, not really silent (shouldn't he be dampened down here?)

 

I sneak into the target building through the canal. Really close to me a guy goes to the basement. I go in front of the metal door, to hear when he returns. I listen at the doort, but the guy is never to be heard from. I go in on luck, and notice he passed the door already, with me not hearing him. I hear him when the doort is open, though not when I listen at the door.

It was also a bit of a problem with all the ambient noise, especially outside the metal door, I never could find out what should be the source of it, the machine inside had more silent noises, and different, although it was loud too.

 

After springing my fence, I notice that there seems to be no entrance in the building (Sewer way up, front door, side door) were it is possible to enter the building without a bit of luck to not be seen.

 

Ambient sound always was a problem (loud noise for me, hard time hearing the AI, AI seems to hear me anyway. I think the AI should have been less hearing with all that ambient noise, instead they seemed to be superhearing).

 

That the "no KOing" objective (of expert mode) also referred to spiders and the beggar was not really nice, since it should be a stunt for the people above, which had nothing to do with the beggar, and especially not with the spiders.

 

I also couldn't find the key in the sewer, without some help from here. Interesting enough, I had searched that part carefully, and all other pipes - seem to have always missed those, although it seems clearly visible now. Must have been all that other things there, drawing my vision to them.

 

 

Everything together, I really liked the mission, it had those nice extras, and ideas, and good story in it.

I really liked the mushrooms in the bottle, nice combination.

Gameplay wise it could need quite a few improvements in my opinion though. Thats especially true in my opinion, if one of the difficulties promotes a non-optional "no taking out anyone" objective, and the map gives a hard time to really avoid being noticed.

[Also, it would be nice if one could load from the mission failed screen, I definitly need loading more often then restarting the mission, but thats something not related to the map]

 

[MirceaKitsune]

Good thing I have a script to disable the spiders so I could play this... though I still had to noclip through the area with webs, since even that was too scary for my phobias Sadly the savegame also got corrupt over the night for some reason... so I had to use cheats to re-create my legitimate progress to begin with. Was still able to finish it in the end however.

 

This was a good medium sized mission! Average in terms of mapping, with perhaps a bit more story and detail than the majority. There were two things I liked specifically though:

 

First is the breakable glass. No TDM mission I've seen so far uses this, and I wasn't even sure if it's possible! It even alerts the guards, which is really neat. One problem however: A few seconds after I break a glass window, TDM crashes and shuts down. I shall post about this separately.

 

The second are those cameras, or scanners if that's a better word. Finally another modern factor, which brings me closer to the things I loved about the stealth games I tried in the past (such as DeusEx). Are the camera entities part of TDM by default, or did the mission have to model and script them separately?

[Airship Ballet]

No TDM mission I've seen so far uses this

Mine does, and you played that already

[MirceaKitsune]

Mine does, and you played that already

Ah... it means I didn't notice it somehow What was the name, so I can take a look again?

[SteveL]

Once more people have cleared the level, there is something I'd be interested in hearing your opinions on.

 

When I was building the level, my inspiration was actually more Deus Ex (which I had recently been replaying) than Thief. Whereas Thief usually gives you most if not all tools right at the start of the level, and allows you to be creative with them, I wanted to take the tools away. This way finding an item is like a key, it allows you to do new things and try new routes. I guess it should also make it feel more rewarding.

 

I wonder, does it show to the player?

 

Yes I like discovering my tools, especially when you can do plenty before you do.

 

An excellent little mission! I'm way behind on missions so I discovered it as a result of MirceaKitsune reporting the broken window bug, then went back in to play properly after finding a fix for that. I played on hard and used the blackjack a bit but I'll give it another go on expert and leave them all walking round. I loved the details: The spidery sewers, and the debris carried by the floodwater. The difficulty felt perfectly pitched to me. I didn't need any help from the forum to find keys or codes. And I didn't see any of the reported bugs except the non-solid dresser. I loved the windows and alarms, very inventive. Those should be used more often! I used an alarm as a distraction to get in through a guarded door before I discovered the lockpicks. It's always satisfying when you pull off a feat like that. Nice work and thanks!

[kyyrma]

Thanks for the comments, glad you guys enjoyed the mission!

 

The second are those cameras, or scanners if that's a better word. Finally another modern factor, which brings me closer to the things I loved about the stealth games I tried in the past (such as DeusEx). Are the camera entities part of TDM by default, or did the mission have to model and script them separately?

 

Those are custom, but they were built completely in the DarkRadiant editor and are actually really simple. The camera you see in the game world is nothing but a prop built from simple brushwork. The actual trigger that fires the alarm is a huge invisible pillar that moves along the ground in sync with the camera prop waiting for the player to touch it.

 

Edited January 24, 2015 by kyyrma

[MirceaKitsune]

Thanks for the comments, glad you guys enjoyed the mission!

 

 

Those are custom, but they were built completely in the DarkRadiant editor and are actually really simple. The camera you see in the game world is nothing but a prop built from simple brushwork. The actual trigger that fires the alarm is a huge invisible pillar that moves along the ground in sync with the camera prop waiting for the player to touch it.

 

camera_shot.jpg

Nice! Would be cool if a model and the entity setup were added to TDM by default, perhaps as a prop. In either case this is very helpful... I'm considering this for my own maps, and it's good to know there's an example

[kyyrma]

Nice! Would be cool if a model and the entity setup were added to TDM by default, perhaps as a prop. In either case this is very helpful... I'm considering this for my own maps, and it's good to know there's an example

It might need to be cleaned up a little bit for that. Right now they are a bit... 'hacky' I would say.

 

Feel free to shoot any questions my way if you end up implementing something similar, I'll be happy to help you out. You can also just open the .map file and take a look at how I built them

[Petike the Taffer]

I've finished playing both In A Time of Need and Breaking Out the Fence tonight (the former on highest difficulty, the latter on medium difficulty), Excellent work on both Kyyrma ! The first one is an exemplary easy mission for someone who's just learning the ropes on TDM gameplay. I wouldn't hesitate to say that it would be an excellent mission if it was included alongside the training mission and The Tears of St. Lucia. As for the second one, you've done some proper hard work on making the rainy environment look very convincing and atmospheric, the spider tunnel was quite spooky, the design details of the tavern and the shop were great (in some places downright exquisite), and most of all, you've made an excellent prototype for security sensors ! I second those who've asked you to maybe offer them as a permanent addition to the game assets. They'd be great to see in other FMs ! The little pier with the boat, the green coded safe and the light switches in the hallways and rooms gave me a very Thief II-esque vibe. No mean feat on your part. These are simply great missions !

[kyyrma]

Thank you! So happy to hear the missions were appreciated.

Me and Airship Ballet might just have something cooking in the same vein, so hopefully you'll get to try it out in the coming months...

[Airship Ballet]

Oh yeah totally just throw that out there. You just can't resist showing off, can you. You're the worst kind of people. This partnership is over.

[kyyrma]

Partnership? Let me tell people a bit about our partnership!

[Airship Ballet]

listen her u lil shit

[MirceaKitsune]

Oh god... a flamewar popping into existence where you would expect it less Now I'm morbidly curious what happened...

[161803398874989]

Oops.

Edited February 28, 2015 by 161803398874989

[Moonbo]

I think they're joking Mircea .

[AluminumHaste]

[Airship Ballet]

Let me tell people a bit about our partnership!

Seriously though I laughed harder at that picture than I did the first time.

[MirceaKitsune]

I think they're joking Mircea .

Ah... hope that's the case. Looked to me like a conflict started after they made a mission together in a collaboration. This sort of thing happens often on the internet, so you can never be too careful

[ferret]

Hi all,

 

I am sort of stuck. I have been playing BotF on Hard (no killing) and I am on the pier with Terry, all mission objectives complete. I have enough loot, I haven't killed anyone apart from 2 spiders in the sewers. I have knocked out a few guys with the BJ and one guard with the gas arrow. Still he won't let me finish the mission. Have I done anything wrong? Help? Suggestions?

 

The savegame is here: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10099866/Quicksave.save.zip

Edited May 11, 2015 by ferret

[DeusXIncognita]

Probably no-one will read my post, but I am sort of stuck. I have been playing BotF on Hard (no killing) and I am on the pier with Terry, all mission objectives complete. I have enough loot, I haven't killed anyone apart from 2 spiders in the sewers. I have knocked out a few guys with the BJ and one guard with the gas arrow. Still he won't let me finish the mission. Have I done anything wrong? Help? Suggestions?

 

The savegame is here: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10099866/Quicksave.save.zip

I tried looking it up, but whenever I try to load the inserted savegame, Darkmod hangs up immediatly (loading status doesn't move once).

I hope someone else can load it.

[ferret]

I tried looking it up, but whenever I try to load the inserted savegame, Darkmod hangs up immediatly (loading status doesn't move once).

I hope someone else can load it.

Thank you.

 

Strange the savegame opens for me. I am running TDM 2.03 on Linux.

 

How about this savegame: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10099866/complete_.save.zip

[DeusXIncognita]

Thank you.

 

Strange the savegame opens for me. I am running TDM 2.03 on Linux.

 

How about this savegame: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10099866/complete_.save.zip

Not working either, but I would guess it could be because Linux saves might be incompatible with Windows TDM?

Just a guess, I don't know about that, but I don't think its far fetched.

I am running TDM 2.03 too, so that shouldn't be it.

Maybe someone in the know can confirm it, or someone with Linux just takes a look, from what I have seen there are quite a few people playing on Linux around.

(Although not using it, I think its great that it works with it.)

[ferret]

Not working either, but I would guess it could be because Linux saves might be incompatible with Windows TDM?

Just a guess, I don't know about that, but I don't think its far fetched.

I am running TDM 2.03 too, so that shouldn't be it.

Maybe someone in the know can confirm it, or someone with Linux just takes a look, from what I have seen there are quite a few people playing on Linux around.

(Although not using it, I think its great that it works with it.)

Thanks for taking the time to try and open my savegame. I hope some Linux user can help!

[Jon Irenicus]

Here is my quick review with spoilers:

Finished on hard because I don't like to not be able to use the blackjack.

+I like starting the mission with only the blackjack because it adds the challenge of having to recover all the default inventory items and weapons.
+The textures, especially those inside the main house, are very good.
+Breakable glass! I don't remember this feature in any other FM.
+Optional objectives are interesting.
+Opening the safe was pretty satisfactory. You need to think in order to solve the puzzle, but it is not that hard that makes it annoying. I like that the puzzle is intuitive.
+The "Inventors Guild Ranging and Detection Automaton" is a very nice invention well implemented in the map.
+The electric lights that can be turned on and off are also a nice feature.
+Readables are very good.

Bug report:
-I was able to kill Terry and Tengrove without failing the objective to not kill anyone.
More bugs here:
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B7VOieCLUVeDeW5sQW1GM2k5M1U&usp=sharing


Thanks!