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new monitor for TDM?


Flanders
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Get an IPS monitor. They're much better all around, and watch out for 6-bit monitors. Instead of using 8x8x8 bits per color, some monitors use 6x6x6 bits, which means they can't display all the colors. This can lead to banding artifacts.

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Laptop's typically have TN panels. IPS or PLS will tend to have better contrast and color reproduction.

Dynamic contrast can be problematic so always try to see the product locally before getting one or find out if the feature can be

disabled.

 

The last I've seen, Samsung tends to have some of the best looking displays for the price.

 

Biker will probably have a better or more specific recommendation though.

 

If you are gonna go crazy, consider getting an RGB LED backlit display or if you really want to be extreme get

a Plasma display or OLED.

 

http://www.cnet.com/topics/monitors/buying-guide/

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S-IPS vs S-PVA vs TN Eizo monitors

 

 

Cheap vs Expensive IPS Monitor

 

 

 

 

 

In my opinion there is no huge difference between monitors now available. More expensive ones have better colour/colour accuracy and viewing angles; I doubt that is important enough if

one sits alone in front of the display and is not making true colour printing/publishing stuff.

The sad thing seems to be that even if you buy an expensive monitor or not, the native contrast ratio will at best be at 1:1000 or a little higher at best.

So a good 24'' TN-panel for 150 bucks or a good IPS for 500 bucks will not result in much of a difference in games that really need to show nuanced darkness.

 

There are two exceptions:

Get a good old CRT.

Or buy a "TV", a plasma one; here quality depends on the specific model, but generally they have very high contrast and therefore are very enjoyable for playing thiefy stuff in the dark.

Example images:

https://www.avforums.com/threads/sharp-shows-off-37-lcd-with-1-000-000-1-contrast-ratio.460004/

 

 

Last december I got to try out a small 12" OLED display on a science/tech expo. Some of the makers of the organic substrates had it on demo, and it cought my eye. We talked a bit

and I connected my netbook on it, quickly donwloaded Thief2 and tried it out; through skillful use of a sweater I made myself a textile tunnel of darkness and played two minutes as if I

were at home and in total darkness - it is really a vast difference, the best I've ever seen; toal blacks, really high number of visible nuances in blackness. It is so much better to not have to turn brightness

high so you can see what you are supposed to see without making all of the game much too bright that there is no real sense of hiding in the dark.

 

 

So I would guess if you need a monitor today, go for a good cheap TN; if you can wait, save the money for OLED or something with very high contrast that will be available sooner or later.

Edited by Outlooker
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IPS and PLS without A-TW polarizer show large amounts of IPS glow. Sometimes so strong you can barely distinguish darker tones at all even in a perfectly dark room.

Currently sitting in front of an IPS and it sucks for playing darker games.

Here are some examples:
http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1039115916&postcount=2
The 20WMGX2 is a normal IPS without polarizer.

Here the same:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?s=44df8ca5a8d8393e53c7152d499047b6&p=47122975&postcount=4
HP without.

Price doesn't matter. There is no difference in the amount of glow between a cheap Dell U2414H or a NEC SpectraView Reference. Same with Eizo CG except for the CG246 ( http://www.prad.de/en/monitore/review/2012/review-eizo-cg246-part8.html#Viewing ).

VA has the opposite problem. Darker tones in the middle of the screen crush to black. Plus some contrast shift to the edges.

 

http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1040354042&postcount=428

Eizo FG2421 and BenQ GW2760HS have VA panels.

 

I wouldn't recommend TN.

 

For reviews:

 

http://www.prad.de/new/monitore/testberichte.html

http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/

https://pcmonitors.info/

http://hardforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=78

 

Other problems are PWM and noise. You don't want a flickering screen that emits a nice high pitched buzzing sound.

Same as above. Price doesn't matter. Even with the most expensive NEC and some Eizo you will get both.

 

Input lag is another problem. 144Hz doesn't matter much if the display electronic features two frames latency.

 

And then there is colour management. In short get one with 100% or close to 100% sRGB coverage or programmable LUT for gaming and everyday use. If you really need aRGB or a larger colour space you will know it.

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What everyone else has said IPS/PLS is good standard to aim for, I have a PLS panel in my 50" Samsung TV and it does marvelous blacks.

 

Some of the Benq models do the best blacks bar non, but I suggest you do you research.

 

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=benq+black+levels+tft+central&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&gws_rd=cr&ei=WJi6Vd-xEIHP7Qb3wI0I

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Plasma Sets made after 2012 by Panasonic or Samsung if you can find them.

They provide very good motion performance and rediculously good contrast compared to lcds.

 

Local dimming lcd sets. Sharp Elite (Pricey), Vizio P series (More affordable) or other local dimming full array backlight sets in between.

The problem with buying a small monitor or tv and expecting quality is the fact that there is far less profit for the manufacturer in smaller sets.

That's not to say that anything edge lit led/lcd isn't completely worthless as a display technology, regardless of size.

Edge lit lcds are the enemy of picture quality RUN (don't walk) away from them as fast as you can, always go for a full array backlight ideally with local dimming.

 

On the cheap you can drag in a 200+ pound behemoth of a hd widescreen crt rear projection set and take the time to restore the picture quality by following the guides over at avs forum. Expect to put about 30 hours of work in for a good image with tweaks and mods, and don't forget about the risk of death from electric shock when adjusting the crt focus controls :P.

I went this route but I sure as heck wouldn't reccomend it unless your very nostalgic about crt, plasmas have surpassed the image quality for the most part anyways.

You may also find some crt front projectors as well or smaller direct view crt sets.

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Plasma Sets made after 2012 by Panasonic or Samsung,They provide very good motion performance and rediculously good contrast compared to lcds.

Not any more, I compared anLG plasma to an LG and Samsung LCD and the LCD are far bright ands have better colours and tint.

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Not any more, I compared anLG plasma to an LG and Samsung LCD and the LCD are far bright ands have better colours and tint.

Where was this comparison made? Hopefully not in a brightly lit big box store with a few uncalibrated torch mode displays.

 

You'll also see that I didnt mention lg plasmas, this is due to the poor contrast on lg plasmas in comparison to Samsung and especially Panasonic.

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Just want to say that I'm in the same boat as you Flanders but haven't really found anything I like after I giving up my CRT many years ago (too hard on the eyes). The next technology I plan to try is OLED and LG is coming out with some new panels this year. I will probably wait until next year since the price will likely be too high this year and since I want to see if the displays suffer from burn in.

 

edit: Of course I've been saying this for many years now.

Edited by woah
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  • Where was this comparison made? Hopefully not in a brightly lit big box store with a few uncalibrated torch mode displays.
  • You'll also see that I didnt mention lg plasmas, this is due to the poor contrast on lg plasmas in comparison to Samsung and especially Panasonic.
  • In my sitting room with the curtains close during the day and at night on a Samsung ue50h6400. And I have to correct what I said about the panel type in that is VA, but its a good VA for the money.
  • Before settling on the LCD I did test an LG plasma for comparison, has the plasma lived up to the hype I would have gone woith that etc.

@Flanders what is your budget and where online places do you liuke to buy computer kit from..?

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I've been hoping for OLED to come along for a number of years too. I'm still nervous about the issues with the chemicals in OLED being

sensitive to moisture (at least their biodegradable :laugh: ) hopefully the new ones will last more than 10yrs. It seems that LCD has outpaced

OLED with regard to switching times though, so it's not gonna be a total knockout but OLED is due to takeover as I can tell.

Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

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  • In my sitting room with the curtains close during the day and at night on a Samsung ue50h6400. And I have to correct what I said about the panel type in that is VA, but its a good VA for the money.
  • Before settling on the LCD I did test an LG plasma for comparison, has the plasma lived up to the hype I would have gone woith that etc.

@Flanders what is your budget and where online places do you liuke to buy computer kit from..?

 

Trust me I would like nothing more than for lcds to be good enough for me.

The largest roadblocks to lcd that i've encountered in the past were color/shade switch motion performance/ghosting and price (I haven't read anything to indicate this is fixed by refresh rate/strobing)

 

The only plasmas really worth having in my opinion are the 2012-2013 Panasonics, 2nd gen Kuros and 2014 Samsungs.

The Samsungs are less desirable though as they have trouble holding the (much better than Lg) black level/mll in brighter mixed scenes (low ansi) and I feel like a local dimming lcd like the Vizios would provide better performance in that area as well as much better brightness.

 

In short I would love to have an Lcd that does not show ghosting, has a good local dimming implementation and performs well in ambient light. Unfortunately only 2/3 are covered at the moment as far as I know.

Edited by Mik James
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  • 5 months later...

Any changes to the monitor scene in the last six months? My beloved 20" CRT is on its last legs, and it looks like trying to find a new one is a lost cause.

 

I looked up the IIYAMA ProLite, but it looks like it's only avaiable in the UK.

 

Can anyone recommend a good monitor for TDM in the $300-400 range that is available in North America?

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Plasma is not produced anymore and while it does have good black levels, the technology has other problems, like the faulty motion representation and false contour/color effects. The technology is dead and not recommended.

 

OLED is the best technology today, but the market is not there yet apparentely. The problems with aging OLED cells is widely solved. The worst thing that happens is that the display may lose peak brithness over time. Aside from some professional displays by sony, there is only LG and Panasonic offering full size OLED displays. Panasonic buys the panels off of LG, however. There is a 34' OLED monitor by LG, but it costs quite a hefty sum. I am definitely not willing to pay this much for a monitor. So, as far as OLED is concerned, we still have to wait a little longer.

 

If you definitely need a new display, I always recommend Eizo. They are not the cheapest, but they are good.

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If you definitely need a new display, I always recommend Eizo. They are not the cheapest, but they are good.

These are considered professional high end.

 

@Springs, if your not in a rush let me do some research, because like your CRT my NEC WGX2 pros are on thier last legs and I need to get upto speed since the last time I looked so -

  • what screen size are you after
  • whats your budget
  • where do you like to buy from
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Ah cool, so found this then did a search for thier 23" gaming monitor and found this on Amazon

 

At £169 on Amazon the Eizo Foris FS2333 is very competitively priced, so then looked for some reviews and found this and this

 

It even ticks a few of my boxes, such a anti-glare screen, thin bezels, matt black facia, IPS panel, large and bright viewing angle, hieght and title adjustable stand, usb ports. But then it fails on a couple as well such a poor black levels (0.34) average response times of 11-14ms.

 

But overall not a bad benchmark to start with, these are certainly worthy replacements for my NEC's which themselfs replaces my old 19" iiyama CRT.

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@Springs, if your not in a rush let me do some research, because like your CRT my NEC WGX2 pros are on thier last legs and I need to get upto speed since the last time I looked so -

  • what screen size are you after
  • whats your budget
  • where do you like to buy from

 

My price max is probably around $400 Canadian (193.01046 GBP).

 

I'd prefer a 16:10, but haven't thought much about size beyond that. I suppose the biggest I can get.

 

I don't play much fast-paced twitch gaming, so rich blacks are more important to me than response time.

 

 

 

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