Jump to content
The Dark Mod Forums
stgatilov

Beta Testing 2.08

Recommended Posts

14 hours ago, Springheel said:

I think just the editor image is missing.  Do you see any issues in game? 


These two should be fixed in revision 15885

 

The other ones are super old models, so either something has broken, or they were never finished and were uploaded by mistake.

 

Ingame the apebeasts seem to be showing up without issue.

 

But now ingame the werebeast is MIA ingame.

 

VbIH5jl.png

 

He is meant to be in the middle.

 

To make sure none of my def files were messing with anything I made this testmap in the dark mod base directory and made sure no FMs were installed. But yeah, in the editor the werebeast looks right, it's just ingame he is broken.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, HMart said:

By using gama 1.3 and brightness 1, the scene still looks a tad dark but much brighter than before, so yes gamma/brightness was the culprit, turning off or on, AO made almost no difference to the darkness but made a huge difference to the depth of the scene, sorry for my hasted "complaint". ;) Love the AO very nice guys.

Btw I also forgot to mention that i'm playing this on a new freesync monitor and it's gama is totally different to my old one, IMO the old one looked better but was only a 60hz screen and after experiencing higher refresh rates I just can't go back! 😜   

r_showFBO 4 shows like you said, a white texture with dark "shadows", btw some of the shadows (not that many) aren't smooth but noisy, like dither noise, is that normal?  

 

I'm actually using gamma 1.4 and brightness 1.2 right now. The default values might still need some adjustments :) Yeah, some noise in the AO is expected, particularly in the distance or where the depth buffer is already crowded. As long as it does not disturb the actual rendered scene... :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I used the SSAO too and tested it.

I actually find that it is very absent.
But i probably expect contact shadows.
You can clearly see that it is just screenspace.
But its generally totally ok! I use it now fulltime!


Can we have more scary Zombie Horror maps?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, cabalistic said:

I'm actually using gamma 1.4 and brightness 1.2 right now. The default values might still need some adjustments :) Yeah, some noise in the AO is expected, particularly in the distance or where the depth buffer is already crowded. As long as it does not disturb the actual rendered scene... :)

Gamma/brightness has been merged into postprocessing pipeline, which somewhat reduces the effects of gamma correction (probably to avoid overbrightening). Previously I heard that gamma = 1.2 is sort of default, so I set it as default value (with gamma = brightness = 1 the game is obviously too dark). But new gamma = 1.2 is a bit darker than old gamma = 1.2 😃

To be honest, I came to conclusion that I should adjust gamma every time depending on circumstances. Am I playing or only testing? How strong is ambient light? Is it morning or evening in the real world? etc. Previously it was too painful to use non-default gamma, because desktop was messed up after a crash, but now everything is OK.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Goldwell said:

 

Ingame the apebeasts seem to be showing up without issue.

 

But now ingame the werebeast is MIA ingame.

 

 

 

He is meant to be in the middle.

 

To make sure none of my def files were messing with anything I made this testmap in the dark mod base directory and made sure no FMs were installed. But yeah, in the editor the werebeast looks right, it's just ingame he is broken.

The animations are present in the release SVN.  It's possible they were not included in the release package, as the werebeast used to be excluded.  Although that doesn't make sense, as the mesh and the animations are in the same folder.  If the mesh shows up in DR, the animations should as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I set all TDM 2.07 settings to default and enabled postprocess then tried to eyeball the equivalent look in 2.08

With windowed mode and screens side by side.

Here is what I currently have set:

 r_ssao_edgesharpness = "1"
 r_ssao_base = "0.1"
 r_ssao_intensity = "0.82" (tame darkening effect transition a little so ssao to non-ssao looks smoother)
 r_ssao_bias = "0.05"
 r_ssao_radius = "72"  ( bigger radius has a richer effect but ssao=3 doubles this so if you use that mode set radius=36 )
 r_ssao = "2" (less samples than 3 so less quality but better performance than 3)

r_postprocess_desaturation = "0.05"
r_postprocess_colorCorrectBias = "0.1"
r_postprocess_colorCorrection = "5"
r_postprocess_colorCurveBias = "0.95" (a little more contrast and brighter brights)
r_postprocess_brightness = "1.0"
r_postprocess_gamma = "1.22"

r_ambientGamma="1.11" (compensate for gamma loss from color curve)


Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm stoked to check this build out! Congrats.

 

#5201 The apebeasts are missing some wearable objects. One of which is used in an animation and I think if the system can't find an animation object it throws up an error and kicks the player back to the main menu. See bug for more details.

Edited by kingsal
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I ran through most of Down by the Riverside with notarget to check if there's any outstanding bugs. I don't think the following have been reported here yet, spoiler tag for screenshots.

 

Spoiler

Firstly, there's several light fixtures with black skins (I encountered 3). I don't know if this is double definitions or something else having to do with dragofer's assets being incorporated into the core mod, so he'll have to check the map himself, I don't know if these are mod bugs per se.

LVSuUF9.jpg

The lantern by the statue on the forest path.

S60UMm7.jpg

The free-hanging lantern (there's two similar models, only this one at the farmstead is affected, the other model is present elsewhere, at the church, and it looked fine).

ckc1l0Z.jpg

Here you can see both the "on" and "off" models of these non-flickering dual lamps are broken. The single versions seem fine. The flickering versions are fine too, weirdly enough. When you break them from flicking the switch enough times though, their broken skin is the same as the closer lamp in the above screenshot, ie. broken.

Next up, the new font for the console and this font in particular are awfully aliased now. You will have noticed the console text from the FPS counter in some of the screenshots above already. The anti-aliasing option in the graphics menu doesn't fix this - and it shouldn't anyway, that's not what it's for.

LCeJIv7.jpg

Of note is that when you turn the pages of a readable with this font, the harsh borders subside in the transition and you can see the normal font underneath as the pages crossfade.

rYLFgld.jpg

Here I'm in the middle of flipping the page of this readable back. You can see that the text, as it fades out, looks normal. Other fonts I've encountered in the FM were fine.

The third bug has to do with shadow maps. AI skins seem to be transparent/noshadows, but their accoutrements are fine. This doesn't happen with stencils.

R3VjFrW.jpg

Interestingly, the player shadow is also affected. It should still be off by default, I had it turned off myself but decided to check on it and lo and behold:

mdLsRLd.jpg

My shadow looks like Rayman.

Last but not least: the "Gamma Standards" UI element in the options menu is now useless. The new gamma doesn't affect the menu (good) but that makes the element not get affected by the sliders. I'm sure there's a solution to this, akin to the UI size adjustment subwindow.

 

Edited by Spooks
  • Like 1

My FMs: The King of Diamonds (2016) | Visit my Mapbook thread sometimes! | Read my tutorial on Image-Based Lighting Workflows for TDM!

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, kingsal said:

I'm stoked to check this build out! Congrats.

 

#5201 The apebeasts are missing some wearable objects. One of which is used in an animation and I think if the system can't find an animation object it throws up an error and kicks the player back to the main menu. See bug for more details.

This should be fixed now on SVN,

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, nbohr1more said:

@Spooks Are you using single pass shadow maps? Disabling the single pass cvar should fix the missing AI and movable shadows.

Alright yeah, that fixed that, thanks.

EDIT: BTW, it seems when you get too close to an object with SSAO on, you occlude it and it becomes black. I'm encountering this after I uninstalled a mission and started another one, the shadow maps also seemed to be pixelated and not soft like they should've been according to my settings. Other people testing be on the lookout.

EDIT 2: Something weird happening in this skybox. (i don't remember what prefab this is but the texture is either clouds2 or twinkle_stars)

Edited by Spooks
  • Like 1

My FMs: The King of Diamonds (2016) | Visit my Mapbook thread sometimes! | Read my tutorial on Image-Based Lighting Workflows for TDM!

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Spooks said:

Alright yeah, that fixed that, thanks.

EDIT: BTW, it seems when you get too close to an object with SSAO on, you occlude it and it becomes black. I'm encountering this after I uninstalled a mission and started another one, the shadow maps also seemed to be pixelated and not soft like they should've been according to my settings. Other people testing be on the lookout.

Change to a higher soft shadow quality after starting your mission. For some reason switching missions breaks soft shadows. ( r_softShadowsQuality )


Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah I messed around a bit and that works. I've put another edit in my post and I want to amend the point about the aliased font. I've encountered another aliased text in king of diamonds, with the same parchment, so I'm beginning to think that rather it's that particular readable parchment gui that is the problem (though I have no idea why it would do that).


My FMs: The King of Diamonds (2016) | Visit my Mapbook thread sometimes! | Read my tutorial on Image-Based Lighting Workflows for TDM!

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Spooks said:

I ran through most of Down by the Riverside with notarget to check if there's any outstanding bugs. I don't think the following have been reported here yet, spoiler tag for screenshots.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Firstly, there's several light fixtures with black skins (I encountered 3). I don't know if this is double definitions or something else having to do with dragofer's assets being incorporated into the core mod, so he'll have to check the map himself, I don't know if these are mod bugs per se.

LVSuUF9.jpg

The lantern by the statue on the forest path.

S60UMm7.jpg

The free-hanging lantern (there's two similar models, only this one at the farmstead is affected, the other model is present elsewhere, at the church, and it looked fine).

ckc1l0Z.jpg

Here you can see both the "on" and "off" models of these non-flickering dual lamps are broken. The single versions seem fine. The flickering versions are fine too, weirdly enough. When you break them from flicking the switch enough times though, their broken skin is the same as the closer lamp in the above screenshot, ie. broken.

Next up, the new font for the console and this font in particular are awfully aliased now. You will have noticed the console text from the FPS counter in some of the screenshots above already. The anti-aliasing option in the graphics menu doesn't fix this - and it shouldn't anyway, that's not what it's for.

LCeJIv7.jpg

Of note is that when you turn the pages of a readable with this font, the harsh borders subside in the transition and you can see the normal font underneath as the pages crossfade.

rYLFgld.jpg

Here I'm in the middle of flipping the page of this readable back. You can see that the text, as it fades out, looks normal. Other fonts I've encountered in the FM were fine.

The third bug has to do with shadow maps. AI skins seem to be transparent/noshadows, but their accoutrements are fine. This doesn't happen with stencils.

R3VjFrW.jpg

Interestingly, the player shadow is also affected. It should still be off by default, I had it turned off myself but decided to check on it and lo and behold:

mdLsRLd.jpg

My shadow looks like Rayman.

Last but not least: the "Gamma Standards" UI element in the options menu is now useless. The new gamma doesn't affect the menu (good) but that makes the element not get affected by the sliders. I'm sure there's a solution to this, akin to the UI size adjustment subwindow.

 

I encountered the fully black lights and aliased fonts (mine were even less readable than yours) too, in The Accountant 1 & 2.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, nbohr1more said:

Change to a higher soft shadow quality after starting your mission. For some reason switching missions breaks soft shadows. ( r_softShadowsQuality )

SS samples uniform not set after shader reload

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Overall this is an exciting list of new features!

 

I noticed something kind of weird about the new body picking up animation.

It feels good to kind of kneel down and pick up a body, however locking the players feet in place during the animation feels rough to me. It sort of breaks the nice flow of knocking out an AI , grabbing their body, and quickly retreating. 

Bug log here: #5202

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, kingsal said:

Overall this is an exciting list of new features!

 

I noticed something kind of weird about the new body picking up animation.

It feels good to kind of kneel down and pick up a body, however locking the players feet in place during the animation feels rough to me. It sort of breaks the nice flow of knocking out an AI , grabbing their body, and quickly retreating. 

Bug log here: #5202

Exactly.


Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, kingsal said:

Overall this is an exciting list of new features!

 

I noticed something kind of weird about the new body picking up animation.

It feels good to kind of kneel down and pick up a body, however locking the players feet in place during the animation feels rough to me. It sort of breaks the nice flow of knocking out an AI , grabbing their body, and quickly retreating. 

Bug log here: #5202

There was an internal discussion (linked for reference for other team members) about this. It was decided to immobilize the player during the viewport animation in order get a better balancing between shouldering and dragging of bodies, issue #1932. I will therefore close issue #5202. 

If you don't like it, you should be able to disable the shouldering animation by settings the times to 0 via pm_shoulderAnim* cvars.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, STiFU said:

There was an internal discussion (linked for reference for other team members) about this. It was decided to immobilize the player during the viewport animation in order get a better balancing between shouldering and dragging of bodies, issue #1932. I will therefore close issue #5202. 

If you don't like it, you should be able to disable the shouldering animation by settings the times to 0 via pm_shoulderAnim* cvars.

What exactly is this balancing? 

Also there are no other (or very few)  places in the mod where the player's movement is locked. Why do it here?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, kingsal said:

What exactly is this balancing? 

Also there are no other (or very few)  places in the mod where the player's movement is locked. Why do it here?

Player's movement is locked for example while mantling and just like in that case, it makes sense to immobilize the player here: Lifting a 140 kg guard is not an easy task, so you cannot move while doing it. And as I said above, this is also meant to balance shouldering vs dragging because shouldering is so overpowered that nobody ever would use dragging (which has been discussed here and in the linked thread). With this brief immobilization, there is a small disadvantage when using shouldering, so the player might consider rather dragging a body than shouldering it in some situations.

Anyway, if you don't like the feature, you can just disable it via the pm_shoulderAnim cvars, as I already said above.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, kingsal said:

Overall this is an exciting list of new features!

 

I noticed something kind of weird about the new body picking up animation.

It feels good to kind of kneel down and pick up a body, however locking the players feet in place during the animation feels rough to me. It sort of breaks the nice flow of knocking out an AI , grabbing their body, and quickly retreating. 

Bug log here: #5202

My 2 cents is that locking the player in place while picking up the body is a good example taken from Thief: Deadly Shadows (TDS).

If Thief 1/2 had more possibilites for speedrunning through the whole thing, than TDS and TDM are slower paced. Picking up the body strikes me as very appropriate in this respect. I'm all for improving animations.

Edited by Anderson

"I really perceive that vanity about which most men merely prate — the vanity of the human or temporal life. I live continually in a reverie of the future. I have no faith in human perfectibility. I think that human exertion will have no appreciable effect upon humanity. Man is now only more active — not more happy — nor more wise, than he was 6000 years ago. The result will never vary — and to suppose that it will, is to suppose that the foregone man has lived in vain — that the foregone time is but the rudiment of the future — that the myriads who have perished have not been upon equal footing with ourselves — nor are we with our posterity. I cannot agree to lose sight of man the individual, in man the mass."...

- 2 July 1844 letter to James Russell Lowell from Edgar Allan Poe.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Alright- But I think its a poor design choice to make a feature everyone uses worse to encourage a less used feature.  I think locking the player in place is too much of penalty for an action players do all the time.  There is opportunity to lessen that penalty by reducing their movement by 50 percent or something during that animation. 

It makes sense  to not walk during mantling,  you're moving up in the Z direction. 

Edited by kingsal
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, kingsal said:

Alright- But I think its a poor design choice to make a feature everyone uses worse to encourage a less used feature.  I think locking the player in place is too much of penalty for an action players do all the time.  There is opportunity to lessen that penalty by reducing their movement by 50 percent or something during that animation. 

It makes sense  to not walk during mantling,  you're moving up in the Z direction. 

The language of 'overpowered' and 'balance' does seem to me to be curiously placed here. If you're making a shooter, and one weapon is so much more effective than others that they don't even see situational use; or if you're making an RPG with selectable abilities, and nobody wants to invest in +1 damage against mud elementals when +10% evasion against everything has the same cost, then okay, you have a balance problem. That the feature to make moving ragdolls over distance more practical is chosen by players intending to move ragdolls over distance doesn't strike me as the same kind of thing.

Edit: to add a more positive note, I think this perceived problem may relate to the fact that players are most often dealing with human bodies. In Thief a dead/blackjacked crayman just can't be moved from its spot, which means you choose your spot carefully if others are around. In TDM, if anything is like that it's... the horse? But in TDM you also have AI you can drag but not shoulder: so, the lanternbot. Also spiders but you're unlikely to want to hide a spider corpse. I see the new werebeast is also set not to be shoulderable but it remains to be seen what effect that has in gameplay.

Edited by VanishedOne
  • Like 1

Some things I'm repeatedly thinking about...

 

- louder scream when you're dying

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Spooks I just checked Down by the Riverside in the 2.08 beta and wasn't able to find anything wrong with my custom lamps. Might be what you're seeing is related to the other issues in that post, or how the wisps in mission 2 showed up as black boxes on your end?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, kingsal said:

Alright- But I think its a poor design choice to make a feature everyone uses worse to encourage a less used feature.  I think locking the player in place is too much of penalty for an action players do all the time.

I haven't played the beta yet, but to be honest, I use the immediate shouldering of guards all the time although it always felt wrong. This sounds more realistic now! Which on the other hand is a rather big change to the gameplay, compared to e.g. exstinguishable oil-lamps which are also more realistic but had no chance to make it into the core game ;)...

Edited by wesp5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...