Ghosting the Dark Mod

[Zerg Rush]

Yes, I know, but the guards are with the sword alerted by myself. I also played Perilous Refuge with 0 points, but not all loot, for me it was a mission much easier. At least, find all secrets and loot in huge missions is very hard.

[Klatremus]

 

[Araneidae]

@Klatremus, saw you fighting with the candlestick and the Supreme rules (at around 1:07:00), and it does strike me that it's a bug in the rules if you can relight the candle and leave it lit and still aren't allowed to take the loot.  You're not taking advantage of the temporary darkness, and you weren't seen.  Fix the rules, surely, and take the loot?

[Klatremus]

I agree that these loot items were frustrating to skip, especially when TDM normally does let you take candle holders without putting out the light. Removing lights even for briefing moment, despite not using it in order to gain a stealth advantage is a bust and has been discussed at length before. This thread in the first 30 posts goes through a long discussion where it was suggested to change the rule to allow taking loot that emits light when not used for concealment purposes. We agreed to keep the rule as it has always been.

Edited December 25, 2021 by Klatremus

[Araneidae]

Thank you for that thread, very interesting discussion.

On a related note, I do think your trick with the paper to avoid using moss arrows ... is a bit of a cheat!  Although not strictly forbidden by the rules, to me it looks more like exploiting a glitch.  What do you think?

Edit: I'm thinking rule #8 here: Offical Ghost Rules (oh, actually rule #11 of the Supreme rules).

Edit: Just read more of the linked thread.  Lots of language lawyering for fun there!  I'm guessing that you wouldn't count the silent fall onto paper as a glitch ... just unexpected behaviour ... so it's ok.  Feels a bit cheap to me, but am interested in what you think.

Edited December 25, 2021 by Araneidae

[Klatremus]

It is definitely bending the engine's capabilities somewhat, but not enough to call it an exploit. That would be doing things that are physically impossible, like what is mentioned in the rules as examples: pushing through banners or doors, moving enemies across a room, blocking enemies with boxes, etc.

Using soft items like potions or fruits to cushion drops have been done in Thief by ghosters for years.

Glad you liked the discussion thread.

[Oktokolo]

14 hours ago, Araneidae said:

I'm guessing that you wouldn't count the silent fall onto paper as a glitch ... just unexpected behaviour ... so it's ok.  Feels a bit cheap to me, but am interested in what you think.

That isn't cheap or unexpected at all - but literally the "sim" in "immersive sim" in action.
Surfaces determines impact noise. Paper is a rather silent material compared to harder materials like stone and tile.
So of course you can just silently land on paper. Not unexpected at all (but i didn't thought about that too).

Granted, a single sheet wouldn't be much in real life. But it still is just a game and the engine has its limits.
I would still allow dropping sheets and books to dampen a fall for any level of ghosting allowing the non-plot-forced use of non-consumables because it probably reduces the overall waiting time quite a bit.

But as with all gameplay mechanics, you could outlaw it explicitly for "Supreme Ghost Mode".

[Obsttorte]

On 7/21/2021 at 9:28 AM, Dragofer said:

The pickpocket count should be quite feasible to add to the mission statistics. I'd do it by 1) adding a basic property to the base class for pickpocketable items like keys and purses, then 2) scanning all AIs in the map to count how many such items have been attached to them to see how many there are in total.

FYI: Issue #5678 has been resolved with revision #9926. The end mission statistics now display the total amount of items that could have been pickpocket by the end of the mission. Note that this is no static value. If an ai is taken out by the player, taken the items from the body is not counted as pickpocketing and therefore is not counted to the total value.

 

So depending on the playstyle, this number may vary for different players/playthroughs.

 

Left is the current, right is the future stat screen.

[marbleman]

 

[Amadeus]

Thanks for making this video marbleman! I'm looking forward to watching it and am very curious to see how you ghosted it

[Wellingtoncrab]

This was a very cool playthrough of this great mission @marbleman- "let's plays" are interesting in themselves but it was a nice change to watch such a practiced playthrough and some of the creative solutions you came up with along the way.

I am looking forward to seeing you run through Noble Affairs!

[Klatremus]

Let's Supreme Ghost The Dark Mod - Thief's Den 4: The Alchemist

 

[marbleman]

 

[Klatremus]

 

[Wellingtoncrab]

@Klatremusmy eternal gratitude for your help in testing and improving the mission, the time you took to put this video together and the many kind words you had for it! Many thanks!