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Duke nukem forever 2001 build leaked


freyk
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Some days ago,
Several builds of "the one" 2001 early build of Duke Nukem forever, been leaked online some days ago.
This package includes the editor, but also its source-code. 
And some reviewers says is it legit.

Whats your opinion about it?

Edited by freyk

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Amnesty for Bikerdude!

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Nice. Link? I think it's very possible that some old games like this one are released as "abandonware", same as others, like Shadow Warrior, MDK, Hidden and Dangerous, Postal, Prey (2006) and others, which you can download for free.

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Posted (edited)

I hope so, but dont think so.
because of the licenses, trademarks,  deals with 2K, etc
(and for this leaked package, with parts of the never publicly released source-code of the unreal 1/2 engine)

George Broussard:
"Yes, the leak looks real. No, I’m not really interested in talking about it or retreading a painful past.
You should heavily temper expectations. There is no real game to play.
Just a smattering of barely populated test levels."
Source: https://twitter.com/georgebsocial/status/1523602422437842944

True, but the modding community was longing for this one.
(and the leaked package has the editor and source-code)
So, I am looking forward what the community will do with it.
But i fear for the future problems with 2K (and Epic?).

News articles:
https://kotaku.com/duke-nukem-forever-2001-build-leak-broussard-miller-3d-1848908594
https://www.pcgamer.com/the-leaked-2001-duke-nukem-forever-build-can-now-be-downloaded/

 

 

Edited by freyk

Info: My portfolio and darkmod graphical installer
Amnesty for Bikerdude!

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4 hours ago, freyk said:

George Broussard:
"Yes, the leak looks real. No, I’m not really interested in talking about it or retreading a painful past.
You should heavily temper expectations. There is no real game to play.
Just a smattering of barely populated test levels."
Source: https://twitter.com/georgebsocial/status/1523602422437842944

He seems really bitter about the project for some reason, quite strange considering this all happened 20 years ago. Having seen the footage it seems that is definitely more than "a smattering of barely populated test levels" and I can see a group of fans making a game out of it.

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I heard there might be a 2002 build floating around. Anyone hear about that?

1 hour ago, vozka said:

He seems really bitter about the project for some reason, quite strange considering this all happened 20 years ago. Having seen the footage it seems that is definitely more than "a smattering of barely populated test levels" and I can see a group of fans making a game out of it.

That was his initial statement. He has said more than that. He should be understood to be salty as heck and ignored.

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7 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

Nice. Link? I think it's very possible that some old games like this one are released as "abandonware", same as others, like Shadow Warrior, MDK, Hidden and Dangerous, Postal, Prey (2006) and others, which you can download for free.

Abandonware is a legal gray area which ranges from legit abandoned rights, to pirates trying to excuse themselves. In the case of 3D Realms, they're a fairly big non-indie studio, and the company which purchased their rights are currently developing a game ("Graven", which is a followup to "Hexen", which is a very old IP). In other words, you are banking on lawyers not being around and interested in taking legal action, and I'm thinking that they very much are in this case, so I'm just going to say that freyk posting a direct download link in this forum, is a bit on the ballsy side.

Edited by Nort
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38 minutes ago, Nort said:

Abandonware is a legal gray area which ranges from legit abandoned rights, to pirates trying to excuse themselves. In the case of 3D Realms, they're a fairly big non-indie studio, and the company which purchased their rights are currently developing a game ("Graven", which is a followup to "Hexen", which is a very old IP). In other words, you are banking on lawyers not being around and interested in taking legal action, and I'm thinking that they very much are in this case, so I'm just going to say that freyk posting a direct download link in this forum, is a bit on the ballsy side.

I know this and I am aware of mencioned ilegitims "abandonware", also aware of a lot of "abandonware" Sites who offers this games, often with a little "gift" which you and your PC don't like. But there are also legit sites, like Archive.org and others, where you can find this games, games which company not longer exist, in the case of MDK (Shiny) also often the official company of the game which release an old game for free, when they made a new one or for other reasons, case of the Hidden and Dangerous  (Wiki).

It isn't difficult to find good free games in the web, in Steam there are tons of good free games, apart of several Giveaways (I got the Tomb Rider in this way in Steam), there are no needs for piracy and downloads from obscure sites with cracks to obtain very good games for free (like TDM), only need to search a little bit.

 

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23 minutes ago, Zerg Rush said:

I know this and I am aware of mencioned ilegitims "abandonware", also aware of a lot of "abandonware" Sites who offers this games, often with a little "gift" which you and your PC don't like. But there are also legit sites, like Archive.org and others, where you can find this games, games which company not longer exist, in the case of MDK (Shiny) also often the official company of the game which release an old game for free, when they made a new one or for other reasons, case of the Hidden and Dangerous  (Wiki).

It isn't difficult to find good free games in the web, in Steam there are tons of good free games, apart of several Giveaways (I got the Tomb Rider in this way in Steam), there are no needs for piracy and downloads from obscure sites with cracks to obtain very good games for free (like TDM), only need to search a little bit.

 

You're not making sense to me. A leak is very far from a free game, no matter if it comes with a virus or not. A leak is a theft of an IP. It's stolen goods, and with an abandonware argument, you're only arguing that it's not hot stolen goods, and that nobody will miss it enough to come looking for it. It has nothing to do with how clean the clothes were that the fence wore.

Edited by Nort
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Copyright infringement of imaginary property is not theft. There are no "stolen goods". It's just copyright infringement, with its own criminal and civil penalties but typically lax enforcement.

We'll see if Embracer Group or whoever currently owns the Duke Nukem IP tries to shut down distribution and modding of a 20+ year old dead game, but they can't stop it if the people working on it are determined. There's a reason pretty much every movie and TV show is downloadable and streamable on pirate sites within hours of release: whack-a-mole doesn't work very well. Some people will get scared off by a DMCA letter, but the files are already widely available now.

As for whether or not it should be linked in here, that's a question for the forum staff. Maybe the links should be removed. Just provide helpful hints instead.

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2 hours ago, Nort said:

Abandonware is a legal gray area which ranges from legit abandoned rights, to pirates trying to excuse themselves. 

Someone always owns the rights, so, it's usually the latter.

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28 minutes ago, chakkman said:

Someone always owns the rights, so, it's usually the latter.

The term actually comes from cases like the game "Area 51", where at least for a limited time, it was made available for free for the entire internet, or cases where copyright eventually expires. Those cases are rare, but it happens.

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Copyright expired after 70 years, which at least in informatik don't make sense. If the Duke Nukem build was leaked, it's a copyright infringement by the guy who leaked it. If the script is now in the network, it can't be avoided that someone use it to fork a own Game with it. 

Most games are made this way, because also big companies use third party game ideas or scripts to make its own with it, even using invers engineering. Most old shooters and also new ones are very similar, only different in the storyline and graphics used, all they are descendient of Pacman in last instance as original idea. In the Manga games, even the protagonists have the same aspects, even there are different companies.

This copyright thing is very debatable in many cases, especially in old games that don't even work on modern computers without having to use some kind of emulator, DOS Box, etc. and whose companies often don't even exist anymore

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18 minutes ago, Zerg Rush said:

Copyright expired after 70 years, which at least in informatik don't make sense. If the Duke Nukem build was leaked, it's a copyright infringement by the guy who leaked it.

It's also copyright infringement by anyone who uses that code in their own game. Copyright doesn't magically vanish the moment the first person who leaked the code is caught and punished. Copyright follows the code/image/text/movie wherever it goes, and if you use that content in your own work without permission, you have made a derived work which is copyright infringing.

18 minutes ago, Zerg Rush said:

Most games are made this way, because also big companies use third party game ideas or scripts to make its own with it, even using invers engineering. Most old shooters and also new ones are very similar, only different in the storyline and graphics used, all they are descendient of Pacman in last instance as original idea. In the Manga games, even the protagonists have the same aspects, even there are different companies.

You're saying that most games are based on illegally leaked code? I don't know what you're smoking, but I suggest you cut down on it.

Making a work which is "similar" has nothing to do with it. Copyright applies to specific texts: code, images, movies, blog posts etc. It does not apply to generic "ideas", which is why anyone can make a first person shooter, or an anime series about heroes saving the world, or a story about a teenage wizard (as long as he's not called Harry Potter).

18 minutes ago, Zerg Rush said:

This copyright thing is very debatable in many cases, especially in old games that don't even work on modern computers without having to use some kind of emulator, DOS Box, etc. and whose companies often don't even exist anymore

If the company doesn't exist anymore and the rights to the IP were not sold or passed on to anyone else, then you have an "orphan work" which (depending on legal jurisdiction) may be covered by special rules.

But in game development this is a rare situation, because if the studio who made the game is shut down, the rights to the game will pass to the publisher, or whoever else buys the original studio's assets. Companies don't usually disappear into thin air, they get bought out by someone else, or their assets sold off in bankruptcy proceedings. So it would be very unwise to assume that a particular leaked codebase is an orphaned work just because the original company which made the game doesn't exist anymore.

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It's clear that forking the Duke Nukem code to make a imitación of it, also infringe the copyright, but is it a infrigement to use it to make a different game' The copyright is also for the script of the idea. less of the engine or basic code. How many games are out there using the saame engine and very similar content of the game, even they are different companies?.. Mostly all of them had copied things one from another in their games, in shooter games, RPG, platformer, sidescroller, selled as own game but only forks from others with different backgronds and protagonists, more o less complex. The basic code and idea of Mario Bros and the Dino from Google is the same.

If you make a game, let's say a shooter, using your own engine, but with the same development and maps as DOOM, copied 1 to 1 you commit copyright infringement, because you use the same script and idea, but not if a big company does it, big game companies lives from the plagiats, own or from others, that is the difference. Remember that the old Doom engine is freely usable, but not the original wad files and every fork, be it Freedoom or Risen3D, needs these original wad files to work, at least the first level shareware. Copyright is a very complex theme and nearly inexistent in asiatic game companies.

Same in movies and other contents

https://plagiarismsearch.com/blog/15-scandalous-cases-of-plagiarism-in-hollywood.html

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34 minutes ago, Zerg Rush said:

It's clear that forking the Duke Nukem code to make a imitación of it, also infringe the copyright, but is it a infrigement to use it to make a different game' The copyright is also for the script of the idea. less of the engine or basic code. How many games are out there using the saame engine and very similar content of the game, even they are different companies?.. Mostly all of them had copied things one from another in their games, in shooter games, RPG, platformer, sidescroller, selled as own game but only forks from others with different backgronds and protagonists, more o less complex. The basic code and idea of Mario Bros and the Dino from Google is the same.

If you make a game, let's say a shooter, using your own engine, but with the same development and maps as DOOM, copied 1 to 1 you commit copyright infringement, because you use the same script and idea, but not if a big company does it, big game companies lives from the plagiats, own or from others, that is the difference. Remember that the old Doom engine is freely usable, but not the original wad files and every fork, be it Freedoom or Risen3D, needs these original wad files to work, at least the first level shareware. Copyright is a very complex theme and nearly inexistent in asiatic game companies.

Same in movies and other contents

https://plagiarismsearch.com/blog/15-scandalous-cases-of-plagiarism-in-hollywood.html

This isn't so much a copyright issue, as it is a data theft issue. I have no idea how the laws of your specific country work, but I don't think it's what you use the stolen goods for that's the illegal part. You're not even looking to make a game with these files in the first place, but regardless, you are allowing access to stolen intellectual property, and handling it, and just hoping that nobody is around to be bothered by that.

Further, your claim that "everybody does it", is just speculation. You're basically saying that programmers are too lazy to program on a basic level, as if for example The Dark Mod must have taken code from the Thief engine directly, and not from ID Tech 4.

Yes, there has been obvious stolen engines in the past, which hasn't been taken to court, but that's due to practical reasons, like the victim not being able to afford a legal process. This depends on if the victim or defendant is rich, and in the case of 3D Realms, they are the rich party here, and I find it risky to mess with them.

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Copyright infraction IS a data theft issue.  But don't get me wrong, this case of DN data is one thing, but once these are filtered, who is going to control if someone finds this data to use it for a different project of their own? It would be a problem and a crime if someone used this data to create an exact copy of DN and distributed it as their own.
You mentioned TDM, yes it is based on the Thief series, but it would be a crime if I copied 1 by 1 the missions of this game. Even using a different engine and code, it would be a copyright infringement to appropriate content that is not only the programming part, but the intellectual property of the author of the storyline, which is certainly not the case.
It is always a balancing act if a game is developed, in this case an FPS that from different companies can even use the same engine and therefore a similar basic programming regarding moving the protagonist, AIs, etc, but that are different in the development of the story, graphics, environment, etc, is where the intellectual property mainly resides.
For example I have seen several Star Wars Fallen Order trailers and the resemblance to many aspects of Tomb Raider was invariably striking, naturally not because of the setting and story, but because of the challenges and form of the game.
As I said, it is a complicated issue to clearly determine what is a problem of copyright infringement, data theft or plagiarism, as one always wants to call it.

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19 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

It's clear that forking the Duke Nukem code to make a imitación of it, also infringe the copyright, but is it a infrigement to use it to make a different game'

Yes. Copyright infringement comes from using the copyrighted code, it has nothing to do with what you use it for. Even if you copy that code into an Android alarm clock app, you have committed copyright infringement.

19 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

The copyright is also for the script of the idea. less of the engine or basic code.

Nope. Copyright applies in full to the engine and the basic code. It does not apply to the generic "idea", although it can apply to the idea at a more specific level (so you can't make another game called "Duke Nukem", but you can make another FPS featuring a musclebound dudebro protagonist).

19 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

How many games are out there using the saame engine and very similar content of the game, even they are different companies?

If they are using the same engine then they have licensed that engine. They are not using stolen code. If they did, they would be sued into oblivion.

19 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

.. Mostly all of them had copied things one from another in their games, in shooter games, RPG, platformer, sidescroller, selled as own game but only forks from others with different backgronds and protagonists, more o less complex.

Again, you are confusing "ideas" with code. Anyone can make a generic shooter, RPG or platform game without infringing copyright, as long as it's not called "Super Mario Brothers".

19 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

The basic code and idea of Mario Bros and the Dino from Google is the same.

The basic idea might be the same. That has nothing to do with the code. You don't need to steal code to implement a game which has similar ideas.

Claiming that software which does similar things must be using stolen code is the sort of thing Darl McBride came up with in the SCO vs IBM lawsuit. It failed spectacularly because his assumption was wrong. There was never any stolen code.

19 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

If you make a game, let's say a shooter, using your own engine, but with the same development and maps as DOOM, copied 1 to 1 you commit copyright infringement,

Correct.

19 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

but not if a big company does it

Not correct. Copyright law applies to large companies just as it applies to individuals, and since they are prominent companies with deep pockets, they are much more likely to get sued. That's why they have a legal department to make sure they are using all IP correctly. They do not steal code.

19 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:

Copyright is a very complex theme and nearly inexistent in asiatic game companies.

I suppose if you're talking about some fly-by-night Chinese rip-off company, then they might be stealing code (since enforcing IP against companies in China is notoriously difficult). But if we're talking about AAA game companies in the US or Europe, using stolen engine code is not normal behaviour, although there may be occasional instances where it happens.

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On 5/16/2022 at 6:27 PM, Nort said:

 freyk posting a direct download link in this forum, is a bit on the ballsy side.

If your internet provider doesn't care then it's ok.

"I really perceive that vanity about which most men merely prate — the vanity of the human or temporal life. I live continually in a reverie of the future. I have no faith in human perfectibility. I think that human exertion will have no appreciable effect upon humanity. Man is now only more active — not more happy — nor more wise, than he was 6000 years ago. The result will never vary — and to suppose that it will, is to suppose that the foregone man has lived in vain — that the foregone time is but the rudiment of the future — that the myriads who have perished have not been upon equal footing with ourselves — nor are we with our posterity. I cannot agree to lose sight of man the individual, in man the mass."...

- 2 July 1844 letter to James Russell Lowell from Edgar Allan Poe.

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21 minutes ago, Anderson said:

If your internet provider doesn't care then it's ok.

I was more thinking of the risk of some sort of DMCA claim against the forum itself, and it ending up in some kind of bad standing, but I'm probably worrying over nothing. The internet is a scary place.

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Not only in games, also the companies of OS use plagiarism.

R4RiK3W.png

Even the logo and default desktop image is the one of Windows, but it isn't from MS, its a Brasilian imitación of Windows 10 and 11 with Linux base, which run windows apps and is legit. (WindowsFX - Freemium OpenSource)

Similar attempt with ReactOS, even using invers engineering to imitate a compatible clon of older Windows, at least using a own logo (OSS)

NBMD4i0.png

As I say, for some companies, copyright is a relative thing.

Edited by Zerg Rush
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