Jump to content
The Dark Mod Forums

Main menu Mission name sorting


snatcher

Recommended Posts

5 hours ago, datiswous said:

Why not create a poll?

Sample sizes of polls I've seen here aren't large enough to draw any conclusions. What do we do with 5 votes for option one, 4 votes for option two, and 2 votes for option three? Making decisions based on such low numbers would be irresponsible. Besides, as far as I can tell poll results are available in real time and because of this results can be biased for different reasons.

Let's just put all elements on the table so that he who ultimately decides can take an educated decision.

TDM_Modpack_Thumb.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, snatcher said:

Is anyone in here in favor of the current sorting (very first screenshot in this topic) over other options? Please speak up.

  1. By going current, missions are kind of sorted and mission names are respected.
  2. By going true alphabetical, missions are sorted and mission names are respected.
  3. By going article last, missions are kind of sorted and mission names are not respected.

Please comment if you disagree or have something to add to my three points above.

If I were to decide I would personally find defending the second option the easiest: how would you like Windows to sort your files and folders?

The current sorting was always confusing to me. It was now on this thread that I finally understood what's going on there.

I tend to lean on option 2. I could live with option 3, but I prefer 2. I think it looks cleaner, too.

 

My FMs: By The Cookbook

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 hours ago, snatcher said:

I see what you did in there and how you fooled the game 😉

I think you made a little mistake somewhere while packing the Patch, though:

Oops. I experimented with "< ", but noticed it doesn't look as good for the default missions which I want to have at the top. Fixed!

Edited by wesp5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 months later...

In a few lists, TDM missions are presented sorted (or sortable) alphabetically:
* In the mission downloader GUI
* On the web page: https://www.thedarkmod.com/missions/
* On the wiki: https://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=Fan_Missions_for_The_Dark_Mod

The Chicago Manual of Style (CMOS) recommends placing initial articles (The, A, An) at the end of the full title: "A Tale of Two Cities" would appear as "Tale of Two Cities, A". Titles do not include subtitles unless they are essential for identification. If a subtitle is included, the initial article should be placed at the end of the full title, not before the subtitle. (https://style.mla.org/articles-and-alphabetization/)

I mentioned this in "0006339: Polishing menus: mission downloader" (https://bugs.thedarkmod.com/view.php?id=6339), but I suggest following CMOS in all cases where titles are an entry in a list.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Very informative post, @Fiver.

Few months have passed and it probably is time to ask this again ⬇️

On 10/5/2023 at 9:19 PM, snatcher said:

Is anyone in here in favor of the current sorting (very first screenshot in this topic) over other options? Please speak up.

  1. By going current, missions are kind of sorted and mission names are respected.
  2. By going true alphabetical, missions are sorted and mission names are respected.
  3. By going article last, missions are kind of sorted and mission names are not respected.

Please comment if you disagree or have something to add to my three points above.

If I were to decide I would personally find defending the second option the easiest: how would you like Windows to sort your files and folders?

TDM_Modpack_Thumb.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, chakkman said:

Sounds good to me.

So we are gonna revert to 2.05 style:

https://bugs.thedarkmod.com/view.php?id=4499

?

Needs a vote I suppose.

 

Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod:

 

http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod

 

(Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Chicago Manual really is a solid choice for sorting stuff like this; that'd be my vote (although, I've always been more of an MLA man myself)

  • Sad 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

25 minutes ago, nbohr1more said:

That bug report could be interpreted in two ways: One, the ingame-downloader-sorting needs changing, Two, all other lists needs changed sorting.

The current sorting does not even resolve the issue as the sorting is still different from the missions web page.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 1/22/2024 at 9:50 PM, Amadeus said:

I've always been more of an MLA man myself

I am less familiar with the MLA Handbook, so I don't know what (if anything) it says about how to account for definite and indefinite articles when sorting lists based on titles. I can't find anything about it online. Let's hope they don't come after us if they find out and disagree. 😉

Edit: According to the link I provided in my previous post, "MLA style follows the The Chicago Manual of Style", so there is no conflict between them.

Edited by Fiver
update
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, STiFU said:

That bug report could be interpreted in two ways: One, the ingame-downloader-sorting needs changing, Two, all other lists needs changed sorting.

Yes, the description is somewhat unclear. When it says "The in-game downloader might show something different than the main menu.", I don't perceive that as a problem. Sorting a list by titles (articles last) is one thing; presenting the full title (with article first) is another. And they serve two different purposes:
* When presenting the title in a list along with other titles by other authors, I would want to put more emphasis on functionality, usability and the overall presentation of the list as a whole. It is in everybody's interest that the list is functional and neat.
* When presenting the title by itself, I would want to put more emphasis on the author's wishes.

 

4 hours ago, STiFU said:

The current sorting does not even resolve the issue as the sorting is still different from the missions web page.

I think the web page and the list on the wiki should follow CMOS too, for the same reasons.

By the way: the web page (https://www.thedarkmod.com/missions/) has a column "Type" which has values "S" or "C" but it does not explain the difference. Does anyone know?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I suggest following CMOS in this case. That sorting style would also be easy to implement on the web page, on the wiki, and anywhere else too.

One detail may remain, though: How do we list a title like "The Lieutenant 1: In Plain Sight"?
* "Lieutenant 1, The: In Plain Sight", or
* "Lieutenant 1: In Plain Sight, The"

I'm pretty sure the first alternative is better because it connects the title to the word it modifies.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Seeing this made me wish we also had a little search box in the top right corner. That would make finding missions a lot easier.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Fiver said:

By the way: the web page (https://www.thedarkmod.com/missions/) has a column "Type" which has values "S" or "C" but it does not explain the difference. Does anyone know?

It stands for campaign or single mission.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Personally I'm strongly against using:

Wind in the Willows, The

That look just sucks and makes no sense to me. It's i.m.h.o. not true alphabetic sorting.

Also, I would think that in the above example someone could think that Willows is the most important and so it should be:

Willows, The Wind in the

 

I prefer:

The Wind in the Willows

That is the whole title and the The at the start is just as important as any other word in it. Otherwise why would the author put it there? You should assume it's important.

 

I think it should at least be possible that I can change the way this shows by edditting Gui files (or by a cvar). If that is possible I'll will do that (just as I made the install_splash.tga show without transperancy applied). I think currently that isn't possible.

 

Edited by datiswous
Link to comment
Share on other sites

52 minutes ago, datiswous said:

The Wind in the Willows

That is the whole title and the The at the start is just as important as any other word in it. Otherwise why would the author put it there? You should assume it's important.

I agree, which is the reason why I made mission sorting in my patch like this, which is also how missions are sorted elsewhere in the web.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

Kinda wish we could sort it by author/plot. As well as order of completion (which one I did last, which one I did first), and order in which they should be completed ("Sequel to [mission] play that one first and come back here")

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 months later...

Years ago, when I started downloading music and keeping a thousand songs, I realized how stupid it was to put the word "The" at the beginning of a song or else everything would be filed under "The."

So I left that off of every song, but eventually databases started to ignore it in the title (thankfully) and now it is safe to put it in the title of the apps I use.  For continuity, either ignoring "A" and "The" makes the most sense, although a comma and then those words after are still a common way to do it.  I'm shocked to find that some people think that filing under "A" and "The" is a winning solution.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recent Status Updates

    • Ansome

      Taking a break to alleviate burnout. In retrospect, I probably shouldn't have jumped into a map-making contest so quickly after just finishing another project and especially with my busy schedule, but I do believe I have something that the community will enjoy. No clue if I'll be able to finish it on time for the competition if I factor in a break, but I'd rather take my time and deliver something of quality rather than engage in development crunch or lose part of the map's soul to burnout.
      · 1 reply
    • Skaruts

      Working on an update for my mission By The Cookbook. If anyone that played it has any further bugs to report, please let me know.
      I posted more details about the update in the mission thread.
      · 1 reply
    • lucien

      being thankful for tdm is a good feeling
      · 0 replies
    • The Black Arrow

      Happy birthday to me!
      Yes, today's my birthday and as much as I want to play The Dark Mod, I won't until it's late Autumn, where it should be a bit chilly in my place and there's some wind too.
      For now, it's time to enjoy my birthday, if any of you want to play a great fan mission in my honour...Well that's asking too much, just play the mission because it's fun, not because of me, enjoy it yourself! 💪
      · 5 replies
    • nbohr1more

      New texture wiki article created: https://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=Creating_textures_from_Ornate_Photos
      · 11 replies
×
×
  • Create New...