Popular Post DeTeEff Posted October 16 Popular Post Report Posted October 16 (edited) Oohhhh, the day has come! This old lurker releases another creation of his deranged mind...! What has he in store? Does it involve sunlight and pollen and hayfever? Will it involve strange towers and priests with bad breath? Naah, just some mediocre airship type of mission, aimed at the Anniversary mapping contest! I have a lengthy/humourly rant/lore for some of the building process for anyone interrested, in spoiler tags. Spoiler You just can't keep it simple, can you? I kinda longed for building another mission and nbohr1more announced another contest. Do I have time for this? Do I want this? I want to paint more miniatures! I haven’t got time to tinker around in DarkRadiant. I have a house and a kid to tend to. I cannot keep stuff simple! I also haven't kept up with all the cool features that have been added to the mod. So what? I can enter with a small mission for the luls. Some Dire Straits on the sound system and just map away. Yeah, small you say? Okay, this mission isn't one of the biggest in the house but man did I cram a lot of stuff in. My plan was to create an airship and three different playstyles. I’ve done it before, I can do it again, better and bigger this time! Design wise I started by physically drawing my layout with pen and paper. I wanted corridors and rooms for the guests, and a big hall with fancy lighting and maybe a small stage. Yes, and a balcony where the ladies could sit with small binoculars and check out the gentlemen beneath. I decided to go for the modular approach and build my modules in DR. I do not have the time/energy/know how to learn Blender etc. Then I started mapping out the general layout with easy to see brushwork (some white marble tiling) and then I covered that with my modules, adding more variants of the modules as needed. It feels good to use modules as the general design gets done quickly and you swiftly get the feel for the locations. Then came some lighting and I bumped into the fist hurdle; light seeping right through the walls! I consulted the forums and learned that this was a tradeoff for the new, enhanced lighting calculations. Cool, I’ll just have to add some extra brushwork with shadowcasting abilities inside the walls. Cannot even trust caulk anymore, grumble, grumble… Several weeks passed and here I was, sitting at the airport, heading for Venice, reading on Discord the wise words of Dragofer on how to connect something an AI does, to the AI, so it affects him afterwards, like eating a muffin. Could the AI eat muffins? No, there was no animation for that. At least not for muffins. But carrots can be eaten, at least there is an animation for that. Cool, can any AI eat then? Only carrots? Okay. Dragofer, how do I make people eat muffins? Create a new entity def you say? That’s a bit scary, haven’t tinkered with defs so much before. After some trudging I got it to work, but the food is placed weirdly in their hands. Sigh…Well, I don’t have the time/energy to mangle this one, players just have to assume the food is in their hands, even if the food sticks through the hand. It works enough I say! And it looks funny when they eat a whole chunk of cheese. I could change that but it is funny so I say let it be! Venice was nice by the way, can recommend it for any Thief fan. As I mentioned earlier, I wanted three different playstyles; a regular thief, and some kind of infiltrators. To kill people is fun, at least in games. I love the Hitman series so I borrowed some ideas from that game, mainly the poisoning of foods. I had tried to make scripts for that in the past so I knew roughly how to pull it off. After some time and late nights at the computer while my little boy slept and my girlfriend sorted out her Pokemons I got it to work. Regarding scripting, I’ve learned some new stuff in this mission; how to access the different AI-stats, how to spawn stuff and give them a unique name, how to get script herpes eating your brain, as you sit for hours trying to create the simplest thing and I learned how to see if the player is in a special area… The thing about spawning and naming stuff was needed (at least I think so) for the fuse-pulling script in the mission; The player can pull fuses to kill the lighting in large portions of the mission, but the mechanic (an actual NPC) has the ability to replace them, should he live so long. This created scripting problems for me with adding and removing fuses from the player inventory and again, the boys on Discord came to aid. After several evenings trying and trying I was almost about to give up but I persevered. That’s the thing about mapping (in TDM at least). It’s like a fresh swim in the sea, but after every 10 meters of swim, you slide your soft belly over a rock, littered with barnacles that rips your stomach open, or at least scratch your soft skin. It’s a trudge, but something in me loves it. Anyhow, finally I got the script to work and boy is it beautiful. But as the player pulls the fuse, the mission is bathed in darkness. To balance that out I needed the guards to fetch lanterns. Cool, there is documentation for how to stop a guard mid patrol and give them a new target, to go fetch a lantern. No no no, not so fast. The script event for stopping patrols is a bit wonky. I do not want to sit here as a crappy programmer and throw dirt on any of the guys, responsible for the programming of some of the stuff in TDM, but having worked intimately with those yellow boxes and scriptlines I can say that they only work when they feel like it. At least the script event for making them stop is a bit iffy. My experimentation leans towards that the AI won’t change his patrol if he’s sitting and waiting for the next path; he must be on his way so to speak. That made it cumbersome to say the least to make him change patrols. I wanted to make sure that he got on his way to fetch his lantern and my solution was to not only order him to change path directly, but also add path-changes to several of his upcoming nodes. That way, if he ignored the direct order, there would be several places where he had to redirect to the lantern. Nice, it may not seem much, but these five guards took their sweet mapping time to (somewhat reliable) get to fetch lanterns. But now their original patrol route sent them to fetch lanterns infinitely so I needed to change the patrols back to normal. That resulted in several more hours of painstakingly reverting my patrol changes back to their original state. This burned some brain cells and after looking at all these yellow and pink boxes I felt like dying wasn’t such a bad idea. I can see some experienced mapper asking why I did it this way. There surely is another, more easy way, but that’s apparently not the way I roll. Not to spoil anything, but the player actions will affect the patrols in more ways than just make them go around. Sadly I believe these alterations will get washed away by the player alerting anyone and stirring up the whole ship. Nothing I build can just be standard; it needs tinkering! I'm always up for experimenting... This has resulted in thousands of lines of (probably disgustingly ineffective code) and the mission morphed into a small sandbox. I wanted the player to be able to affect the AIs behaviour in several ways so to speak. Another aspect that was new in this mission is that it is a confined space; there is no "outside world" where I can spawn more guards or just assume there is a toilet or something. Everything the people needs on this cruise has to be built. It would be a shame to seal off sections and just let the player assume there is "some diffuse area over there." After beta testing I have changed a lot. Apart from the usual z-fighting, I have revised the lightning, added volumetric lights, revamped a lot of skins, added more announcements in the speaker system, spent some hours after a nightshift, painstakingly counting loot that doesn't add up, cried myself to sleep, added lots and lots of crap in an effort to make the place more believable. There sure are lots of bugs and misses, but my main focus (believe it or not) has been anti frustration; everything that can be frobbed (in boxes) shall be easy to frob. Only one lock in the mission is unpickable. There is no railroading, the player is free to go wherever he pleases (different player characters may alternate this though). Some people may or may not like that I have made everything that is just for decoration unfrobbable. This is a water divider among us, but I went for this design in this case which was good for my sanity. It is not trivial (at least not for me) to adjust so you can pick stuff out of TWO drawers that are near each other. Loot etc are usually fine but books can be a real pain in the hindside...Lots of lovely hours wasted on adjusting frob distances etc... And that should be the end of the lore... According to DarkRadiant I have worked 570 hours on this, and that doesn't take into account all hours of coding and scripting. This feels like an insanely huge amount of mapping time for this small mission but I try not to judge myself. DarkRadiant says 570 so...I say thanks to all calm hours at the night shift at work where I could sit and script and write readables. And I also humbly bow myself to the scripting genuses that are on the forums. A special thanks to my girlfriend who (almost) always lets me talk about my projects. She has also written some of the readables and voiced some recordings in the mission. Thanks to Dragofer, Mirceakitsune and Melchior for much needed scripting help. Thanks to YouTube channels BGM President and Sound Effects where I've borrowed some music and sound effects. Thanks to my betatesters; nbohr1more, Bergante, datiswous, Wesp5, nightmare, Jaxa and Cambridge Spy. And a big thank you to the mod in general for still being alive and supportive! ########################################## MISSION RELATED STUFF ########################################## On an airship, heading for Flowerdale a lot of strange things can happen. As some people guzzle down liquor in the bar, some others skulk around in the shadows. Certain people cannot be trusted and there are even those that kill for a living. Somebody may or may not work for foreign powers. But everyone yearns for those shiny pennies. There are some strange things in the cargo, huge coffers that can hold bodies, alive and dead. This story may unfold in several different ways; Three characters can be chosen; Zacharias the thief, Oliver Mortimer, the assassin or Rupert Peabody, youngling of the Wizlas woodfolk. DOWNLOAD LINK https://drive.google.com/file/d/10w_SJSBAxxVFYTwPjJhIo48fEzvuTo1M/view?usp=sharing Edited October 19 by DeTeEff 16 1 Quote
datiswous Posted October 16 Report Posted October 16 Congratiolations with the release of this special fm! (Could you maybe remove the formatting in the spoiler text? It looks kind of ugly in the dark forum theme, because it adds whitespace. You can do this by cutting the text and then paste it without formatting - ctrl-shift+v) Quote
DeTeEff Posted October 16 Author Report Posted October 16 Maybe I should have beta tested the release post Better now? Quote
thebigh Posted October 16 Report Posted October 16 Congratulations! 1 Quote My missions: Stand-alone Duncan Lynch series Down and Out on Newford Road the Factory Heist The Wizard's Treasure A House Call The House of deLisle
nbohr1more Posted October 16 Report Posted October 16 The mission is now in the database! @DeTeEff shall I add a poll to your thread for you? 1 Quote Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod: http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod (Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)
DeTeEff Posted October 16 Author Report Posted October 16 Ahh, sorry forgot that. Yes, please do. 1 Quote
chakkman Posted October 16 Report Posted October 16 1 hour ago, nbohr1more said: @DeTeEff shall I add a poll to your thread for you? Sorry, but, I have to ask again: Are the votings in these polls relevant for the contest? I guess yes, but, I thought I'd better ask, because I "recklessly" voted in bikerdude's mission thread, without considering that it could be contest relevant. Quote
Amadeus Posted October 16 Report Posted October 16 Congrats on the release! This looks like a very cool setting, I'm excited to play it! 1 Quote FMs: A Good Neighbor, Eye on the Prize Co-FMs: Seeking Lady Leicester, Written in Stone, The Painter's Wife
nbohr1more Posted October 16 Report Posted October 16 57 minutes ago, chakkman said: Sorry, but, I have to ask again: Are the votings in these polls relevant for the contest? I guess yes, but, I thought I'd better ask, because I "recklessly" voted in bikerdude's mission thread, without considering that it could be contest relevant. Yes, the scoring in the 15yr mission polls determines the winner. We generally ask that you vote based on the general merits of a mission rather than it's comparative merits to other contest entries. If you must compare it to other missions, consider comparisons to the overall mission database ( best vs worst ) as your scoring range. Quote Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod: http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod (Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)
DeTeEff Posted October 16 Author Report Posted October 16 8 hours ago, nbohr1more said: The mission is now in the database! @DeTeEff shall I add a poll to your thread for you? Sorry, you better update that database with the new version in the link. Made a last minute change. (A shadow mesh had gotten just outside a wall so it was a strange shadow there.) 1 Quote
nbohr1more Posted October 16 Report Posted October 16 2 hours ago, DeTeEff said: Sorry, you better update that database with the new version in the link. Made a last minute change. (A shadow mesh had gotten just outside a wall so it was a strange shadow there.) Fix is in the database now 1 Quote Please visit TDM's IndieDB site and help promote the mod: http://www.indiedb.com/mods/the-dark-mod (Yeah, shameless promotion... but traffic is traffic folks...)
Bergante Posted October 16 Report Posted October 16 Congrats for the release and a thanks for the nice overview of the building process beta testing was fun and also the talking about . one thing i wanted to tell you before the release (sorry - too late now ) : normal ranking is : easy - difficult - hard ---- so i feel : Mr.Peabody -> Mr.Mortimer -> Zachariah but what shall s @DeTeEff the next is especially for you : Spoiler as announced in testing Mr.Peabody in Beta 1.02 ( because the end-Alarm was triggered to the players suspicious ) he is named Lunatic - and as a revenge I played him as Maniac in 1.03 it´s a very special challenge because for most every person one has to find the right way to kill him softly Here my Pic's : You know - it´s the german who sorts things and an other critical : for safty reasons doors of fridges should open to outside it´s been a mess to get them all in and still be able to close the door If some one else read this ( and want to try it himself ) - a little helping Tip : Spoiler in settings = be sure to have set - subtitles = on !!! for all the others : have fun playing Greetings 1 1 Quote
DeTeEff Posted October 17 Author Report Posted October 17 @BerganteHaha, that is a nice pileup "The sorting German" Yes, he was first called "Lunatic" and that got morphed into "Saboteur". I first changed the key in his room and forgot to change the used_by on the door and as you know, that broke his key in one of the betas. After that I let the wording be (as it had no effect on the player; the word "Lunatic" or "Saboteur" wasn't mentioned anywhere more than in code and it wasn't worth the risk in changing stuff, should something break) 1 Quote
Zerush Posted October 17 Report Posted October 17 Congrats to this nice and different mission which I enjoyed a lot, despite en part a somewhat low FPS on my humble Laptop 1 Quote
Kamil Posted October 17 Report Posted October 17 A very enjoyable mission! Tight but dense. Great setting and visuals (somehow thing first that came to my mind were custom player homes in Skyrim, lol. Cuple of flying ones stuck in my memory because of how unique they were). I'd add a bit more secrets, as there's plenty of room to accommodate a few hidden buttons and levers in desks, wardrobes etc; but besides that- nothing really to complain about. A fully playable pool game would be mind-bending, but that technology was lost since the days of Duke Nukem 3D 1 Quote
joebarnin Posted October 17 Report Posted October 17 Wonderful mission(s)! Love the airship design, including the Spoiler tight quarters, and the ability to go outside I did them in order, which is probably how it was designed. But I wonder how it would be to do them "out of order"? Too late now. One thing, when doing the Mortimer mission, Spoiler I chose the right hand dagger. The Helmsman's safe had a document that pointed me at Winterdale (room 3). The diary under the bed in room 3 gave the clues to poisoning the dude. But it says, roughly "I'll keep to the library, and my wife can have the bed". But he cycles between the library and the bed. Wife is no where to be seen. Kind of puzzling. I mean, I figured out where to put the poison, but that bit in the diary confused me. Also, Mortimer is a bit of a psychopath, poisoning apples that anyone might eat (not just the target). I tried to go back and dispose of the rest of the apples after Winterdale died, but I couldn't. Felt bad for future victims as I parachuted to safety... Quote
lowenz Posted October 18 Report Posted October 18 (edited) Nice&clever volumetric lights use! (playing on lastest 2.13dev) Edited October 18 by lowenz Quote Task is not so much to see what no one has yet seen but to think what nobody has yet thought about that which everybody see. - E.S.
DeTeEff Posted October 18 Author Report Posted October 18 15 hours ago, joebarnin said: Wonderful mission(s)! Love the airship design, including the Reveal hidden contents tight quarters, and the ability to go outside I did them in order, which is probably how it was designed. But I wonder how it would be to do them "out of order"? Too late now. One thing, when doing the Mortimer mission, Hide contents I chose the right hand dagger. The Helmsman's safe had a document that pointed me at Winterdale (room 3). The diary under the bed in room 3 gave the clues to poisoning the dude. But it says, roughly "I'll keep to the library, and my wife can have the bed". But he cycles between the library and the bed. Wife is no where to be seen. Kind of puzzling. I mean, I figured out where to put the poison, but that bit in the diary confused me. Also, Mortimer is a bit of a psychopath, poisoning apples that anyone might eat (not just the target). I tried to go back and dispose of the rest of the apples after Winterdale died, but I couldn't. Felt bad for future victims as I parachuted to safety... Is that so? There were so many path nodes for all people so I may have lost track on everyone. But he sleeps in the chair in the library and maybe (as you say) he also goes to his room to sleep in between. Maybe the stonach feels better, I don't know The wife sleeps in the spa. Spoiler When playing the middle contract (the spy) you may get the wife as a target and then the maid will ramble about that strange woman, (sleeping in the spa) in her diary. Quote
Sotha Posted October 18 Report Posted October 18 I played this tonight in the thief mode. Spoiler I got the feeling there is something technically broken in the map. Everything was great until I got out from the cargo bay to the crew quarters. Someone came in the room to sleep, a lightning flashed, they saw me and I KO'd them when they were rushing for the door. I was satisfied that they did not get help, but boy was I wrong. Few moments later, the entire ship was looking for me in the room where where I KOd the escaping AI. Good thing I heard them coming and slipped to the maiden's room with the body. Heheh. But that is the technical issue! I firmly believe that the windows are not sound proofing the interiors properly. Outside there is wind howling, thunder striking and all the noise from the machinery. But if you make one little noise in a room that has a window, EVERYONE hears that like they were in the same room. This is a critical issue in the mission, that needs to be addressed. I would propose closing the windows with solid block of window texture. That would also remove the unrealistically loud thunder sound in the interiors. Anyways, my adventure continued: I tried to proceed cautiously, but it was very difficult, because footsteps near a window would get AI attracted unrealistically easily. Therefore, I changed tactics and the mission turned into a KO exercise. It was the only way to complete the mission for me. It was quite fun actually: "he's not gonna go past me agai...*thud*" "what was than noi..*whack*" But I would have preferred to have a more sneaky experience. Another thing was the lighting. In the cargo bay, I pulled out everything from the machine room including the fuses. This, I think switched off all the lights from the mission. I probably KO'd the AI who was supposed to fix the lights. Therefore, all the other AI were standing and moving in the darkness, which felt a bit unrealistic and immersion breaking. Also, it truly a shame, because when the lighting was off, the mission looked a bit washed out and dull. Those rooms that did have lighting remaining had amazing atmosphere and lighting quality, I think it might be good idea to prevent the fuse breaking and have some kind of pretty baseline lighting in the rooms. Anyways, I will refrain from giving score for this mission, until the sound leakages are fixed. With those rough edges honed out, this would be an AMAZING mission. Quote Clipper-The mapper's best friend.
DeTeEff Posted October 18 Author Report Posted October 18 (edited) 2 hours ago, Sotha said: I played this tonight in the thief mode. Reveal hidden contents I got the feeling there is something technically broken in the map. Everything was great until I got out from the cargo bay to the crew quarters. Someone came in the room to sleep, a lightning flashed, they saw me and I KO'd them when they were rushing for the door. I was satisfied that they did not get help, but boy was I wrong. Few moments later, the entire ship was looking for me in the room where where I KOd the escaping AI. Good thing I heard them coming and slipped to the maiden's room with the body. Heheh. But that is the technical issue! I firmly believe that the windows are not sound proofing the interiors properly. Outside there is wind howling, thunder striking and all the noise from the machinery. But if you make one little noise in a room that has a window, EVERYONE hears that like they were in the same room. This is a critical issue in the mission, that needs to be addressed. I would propose closing the windows with solid block of window texture. That would also remove the unrealistically loud thunder sound in the interiors. Anyways, my adventure continued: I tried to proceed cautiously, but it was very difficult, because footsteps near a window would get AI attracted unrealistically easily. Therefore, I changed tactics and the mission turned into a KO exercise. It was the only way to complete the mission for me. It was quite fun actually: "he's not gonna go past me agai...*thud*" "what was than noi..*whack*" But I would have preferred to have a more sneaky experience. Another thing was the lighting. In the cargo bay, I pulled out everything from the machine room including the fuses. This, I think switched off all the lights from the mission. I probably KO'd the AI who was supposed to fix the lights. Therefore, all the other AI were standing and moving in the darkness, which felt a bit unrealistic and immersion breaking. Also, it truly a shame, because when the lighting was off, the mission looked a bit washed out and dull. Those rooms that did have lighting remaining had amazing atmosphere and lighting quality, I think it might be good idea to prevent the fuse breaking and have some kind of pretty baseline lighting in the rooms. Anyways, I will refrain from giving score for this mission, until the sound leakages are fixed. With those rough edges honed out, this would be an AMAZING mission. That is strange. I have used portals with location separators in them so the windows should work like a wall. Yes, the AI all getting bunched up when alerted must have something to do with the high AI density in tandem with the AI search mechanic. I have tried to fix this, but it's not much to do I guess... I don't know how to darken the mission without losing contrast. Oh well, I'll just have to try to fix this after the voting... Edit: Perhaps this can help me: sound_loss "Soundprop: Loss in dB incurred when a sound travels through this portal. Cumulative with door loss if a door is present." If I crisp up that value maybe I can dampen the sound propagation through the windows... Edited October 18 by DeTeEff Quote
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