Visible Player Hands Mod

[AluminumHaste]

On 4/4/2025 at 11:10 AM, jivo said:

I'm planning on releasing the 2.13 version and also adding the updates I've shared in this thread.

I've been focused on finishing writing my thesis so there hasn't been much time for me to work on the mod but it will come eventually and I haven't abandoned it.

First off, this is fantastic work!

Also....

"but it will come eventually and I haven't abandoned it."

Famous last words

[datiswous]

On 4/6/2025 at 4:08 PM, AluminumHaste said:

Also....

"but it will come eventually and I haven't abandoned it."

Famous last words

Well at least there's the source code.

I still think it's suboptimal to having to overwrite tdm executable for this. But maybe there's no way around it.

Edited April 10, 2025 by datiswous

[jivo]

On 4/6/2025 at 3:08 PM, AluminumHaste said:

"but it will come eventually and I haven't abandoned it."

Famous last words

Soon™

Don't worry, I'm still working on the mod. The GitHub page has been updated with version 2.13 of TDM and I also finished an animation for lockpicking, which will be the last thing I implement before publishing the next mod update. Just doing some final testing to make sure there aren’t any major issues.

Here's a video of the new animation in the meantime. Let me know what you think!
 

 

[datiswous]

I think the lockpicks have to go inside the lock. Maybe that's impossible, but otherwise I don't like it much. I think probably for that to work the player has to be automatically moved in the correct position for that to work.

Also, this looks like you use two lockpicks at the same time, which isn't the case in tdm (I think).

It's still very cool what you did there.

[AluminumHaste]

Well, TDM's lockpicks, don't work like lockpicks in the real world. It emulates Thief 1/2 system.

Also, as you've pointed out, getting the lockpicks to line up with the lock would require moving the player, which is what Thief 3 did and most people didn't like it.

A lot of locked objects in TDM have no visible lock, so that wouldn't work anyways.

 

[jivo]

3 hours ago, datiswous said:

I think the lockpicks have to go inside the lock. Maybe that's impossible, but otherwise I don't like it much. I think probably for that to work the player has to be automatically moved in the correct position for that to work.

It's pretty much like @AluminumHaste said. Even if every lockpickable object had a lock and I could always detect its location to position the player in front of it, this would mean taking control away and it could potentially lead to unwanted situations, like placing the player in front of a guard, or under a light. One of the goals of this mod is to interfere with gameplay as little as possible (ideally not at all), and that would go against that principle.

3 hours ago, datiswous said:

Also, this looks like you use two lockpicks at the same time, which isn't the case in tdm (I think).

It is only one lockpick in TDM, yes. But I felt like it didn’t make much sense to pick a lock with just one pick. Not that my solution is perfectly realistic or anything, I just think it looks better this way.

I appreciate the feedback

[MirceaKitsune]

Custom lockpicks can be defined and I believe a few FM's already use them, including a prototype I have in the works where I made an electronic lock breaker. I understand the animations and item attachments can be customized however, which is a good thing: I presume a custom lockpick can use a custom one-handed animation if necessary.

[jivo]

Version 2.1 released!
 

Hello everyone! I just uploaded version 2.1 of the Visible Player Hands mod to the ModDB page.

Here's everything that's been added:

• Updated to version 2.13 of The Dark Mod.
• Added new item animations. When any of the following items are selected, they appear in the player's hand, each with a unique animation that plays when the item is used:
  - Health, Breath, Invisibility, and Slow Fall Potions: when used, a drinking animation plays.
  - Holy Water: when used, an animation shows the player applying the holy water to a water arrow.
  - Mine, Flash Mine and Flash Bomb: when used, the player performs a throwing motion - first pulling the hand holding the item back, then swinging it forward to release the item.
  - Triangle and Snake Lockpicks: when used, the player initiates a lockpicking animation, bringing both hands forward and rotating the lockpicks, to simulate the act of picking a lock.
• Fixed items clipping through map geometry.
• Improved switching between weapons while holding an item, making it much less likely to cause animation overlaps.

Here's a video showcasing the new version. Let me know what you think!

 

[TheUnbeholden]

Excellent! This is what I've been waiting for. Of course you deserve some kind of cumminity award, and all the praise for this beautiful mod. Can't wait to see more mods like this one. 

[jivo]

I’ve added a way to customize the mod by letting players choose which animations they want to see, since people seem to value different aspects of the mod. I'll add this in the next update, whenever that comes out.

The new setting is under Video > Advanced, at the very bottom, and I separated the customization into 4 different options:

Disabled - Default TDM behaviour
Hands - Only the empty hand animations are shown, like crouching and leaning (no item animations)
Items - Only the item animations are shown, with the item in the hand and their use animation (no empty hand animations)
Everything - All animations are shown

Sorry about the video spam, but it's just an easier way to show what I'm talking about. Check it out and let me know if this feels like a good way of separating things.

 

[MirceaKitsune]

Fantastic changes once again. At this point it looks pretty finished: Anything else that wasn't done yet? Especially now that a menu option was added, I'd really like to hear the developers take on this.

[jivo]

15 hours ago, MirceaKitsune said:

Fantastic changes once again. At this point it looks pretty finished: Anything else that wasn't done yet? Especially now that a menu option was added, I'd really like to hear the developers take on this.

Thank you!

I'd say there are still a few things missing. Some items still need to be implemented, like the spyglass, keys, readables, and the newly added gasmine. I'm also considering adding interaction animations for things like opening doors or grabbing loot, but that's not a priority right now and it might not work well, so we'll see. Lastly, I think it could be cool to show animations for climbing ropes or mantling, but making that look good might be impossible. It's really just an idea for now.

[Geep]

Very nice additions. I particularly admire the throwing animations.

The drinking ones are fun. I'd love to see the bottles come a bit closer/lower towards the mouth, and maybe a few drops splash upwards.

The lock-picking is more problematic, and I'd probably like to see an option to enable/disable it. (This could be command-line, given that you're trying to get by with one GUI setting.)

If the player only has 1 lock pick, does the animation still show both? If so, that's not good. But you could substitute a 3rd tool that is clearly different, e.g., a flat file or knife with a different color handle.

The bigger problem is, as others have mentioned, even if the lock hole is clearly seen, the picks are off somewhere else.

A thought. Suppose for a moment that your code knew where on the screen the hole was [a hard but usually plausible thing to determine, at least for standard assets]. Then maybe, rather than moving the player, your hands animation could be dynamically shifted left/right/up/down to hit it when it's in range. (More of the forearms/upper arms would have to be included in the animation, and the offscreen parts clipped, never screen-wrapped.)

In any event, I'm looking forward to see how you animate the upcoming items you mentioned.

[jivo]

1 hour ago, Geep said:

Very nice additions. I particularly admire the throwing animations.

The drinking ones are fun. I'd love to see the bottles come a bit closer/lower towards the mouth, and maybe a few drops splash upwards.

The lock-picking is more problematic, and I'd probably like to see an option to enable/disable it. (This could be command-line, given that you're trying to get by with one GUI setting.)

If the player only has 1 lock pick, does the animation still show both? If so, that's not good. But you could substitute a 3rd tool that is clearly different, e.g., a flat file or knife with a different color handle.

The bigger problem is, as others have mentioned, even if the lock hole is clearly seen, the picks are off somewhere else.

A thought. Suppose for a moment that your code knew where on the screen the hole was [a hard but usually plausible thing to determine, at least for standard assets]. Then maybe, rather than moving the player, your hands animation could be dynamically shifted left/right/up/down to hit it when it's in range. (More of the forearms/upper arms would have to be included in the animation, and the offscreen parts clipped, never screen-wrapped.)

In any event, I'm looking forward to see how you animate the upcoming items you mentioned.

Thank you for the feedback, it's very useful!

I did some tinkering with the particle system to have them appear at a specific frame in the animation, but haven’t had much success yet. I didn’t spend too much time on it since I’ve been focusing on adding all the items first, but I’ll definitely come back to it once that’s done.

As for the lockpicking, the animation does show two picks even if the player only has one. I’ll try out the file/knife suggestion to get around that.

Implementing the lockpick-in-lock part would be very tricky, so for now I’ll just add an option to disable that specific animation in case someone prefers not to have it in its current state.

[jivo]

On 5/16/2025 at 2:44 PM, jivo said:

Lastly, I think it could be cool to show animations for climbing ropes or mantling, but making that look good might be impossible. It's really just an idea for now.

I mentioned this the other day, and it got me thinking whether a mantling animation would look good or even be possible to implement. I think it turned out pretty well, check it out!

 

[demagogue]

I don't think I'll use it, or at least as it is now, but it looks like you've executed the concept pretty well. Congrats on the good work! It does add a layer of immersion or feeling of being embodied in the world.

If I were working on this, I'd probably pour a crazy amount of time on polishing the look and feel of the models and animations, and in that frame of mind, these videos strike me as more proof of concept waiting for that polish.

But I also recognize the challenge of that. I remember those videos showing a third person view of the Mirror's Edge player character. That's a case where the visible arms was done very well, but when you see the 3P view, it's really obvious how exaggerated and unnaturally the models and animations were made to fit the view to the player camera, and look completely bizarre from any other angle. It gives you an idea of how much fine tuning goes into it.

But of course there are different levels this could be at, and some people may already really like how it is now, or you have a target look & feel you're aiming for. But anyway, overall I think in terms of executing the concept, you've done a great job, and if I have any push-back or constructive feedback it's on the look & feel of it in this version.

Edit: Well, one other thing, if you're not specifically using your hands--in idle, walking, and running--I don't think one's hands are just hovering in front of a person. It actually looks tiring. I think they'd periodically swing slightly into view while walking and running, and maybe a little in idle.

[datiswous]

23 hours ago, jivo said:

I think it turned out pretty well, check it out!

I think it looks really good.

[The Black Arrow]

On 5/27/2025 at 11:39 AM, jivo said:

I mentioned this the other day, and it got me thinking whether a mantling animation would look good or even be possible to implement. I think it turned out pretty well, check it out!

 

That is very nice indeed, fantastic job!

Sorry I did not respond earlier regarding the visible shadows and the like, it's sad to know that it is not possible but the hunt still continues nonetheless and this mod is great either way, I have a good feeling that in some later future, your mod will be integrated into The Dark Mod by default.

[snatcher]

@jivo, 2.14 is out and it is time to get back to work!

I am particularly looking forward to this 

On 5/15/2025 at 5:28 PM, jivo said:

I’ve added a way to customize the mod by letting players choose which animations they want to see, since people seem to value different aspects of the mod. I'll add this in the next update, whenever that comes out.

The new setting is under Video > Advanced, at the very bottom, and I separated the customization into 4 different options:

Disabled - Default TDM behaviour
Hands - Only the empty hand animations are shown, like crouching and leaning (no item animations)
Items - Only the item animations are shown, with the item in the hand and their use animation (no empty hand animations)
Everything - All animations are shown

[snatcher]

@STiFU, you want immersion? Well, hiding HUD elements alone does not guarantee a coherent experience. Look no further: here is the way and here is your buddy @jivo.