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Harry Potter Is Really Frustrating (!spoiler Alert!)

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I just finished Harry Potter Volume 6 and I'm really frustrated how this ends. I don't want to spoil it for you, in case you haven't read it yet and planned to do it, so I don't want to say to much. But I almost wish I hadn't read it.

 

Well, I can understand why this had to happen, but still ... it's a really frustrating ending. I hope that Rowling will at least finish the last part soon.


Gerhard

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I was quite disappointed with the 6th book. It was twice the size of the earlier novels but with half of the plot. Everything happened in the last hundred pages or so.

 

Anyway, I'm sure the ending sets up a big twist in the next book where he returns. Cue loads of tearful kiddies and a spin off series.

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Actually I found the 6th part much better than the 5th. :)

 

I can see what you mean about the tearful kiddies. :) I wonder wether Snape is really a Death Eater or not. I know that in all books he acted in such way that you had to think he was one, and then it was shown that he was not. It's pretty similar with this book, and considering Dumbledors command to Harry, he could have done the same to Snape, in order to secure his position. Of course Snape is the character that is supposed to be despised but this can also mean that despite of that he still could be the "good" guy as he was in all the previous books.

I would be very surprised if Snape doesn't have a major part in the next book.

 

Care to post any ideas what you think how Snape and Draco could come off in the next book? :)


Gerhard

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Snape is almost certainly working for the forces of 'good'. I think his repulsion when facing Dumbledore on the tower had more to do with what he was going to do than with seeing Dumbledore there. It doesn't make sense that Dumbledore was pleading after staying so cool with the others. He saw Snape hesitate and so was pleading with him to carry out his heinous deed. :) If he didn't do it Snape would have blown his own cover.

 

I think Draco will save Harry, and vice versa, in the 7th book. Harry will die fighting Voldemort (I have a hunch that Harry is one of the 7 thingies Voldemort created, so he'll have to scarifice himself in the end). Ron and Hermoine will get married or something.

 

Anyway, we shall see... :)

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I loved the 6 book, better than 5 sure, but my favorite is stil 4. I like the way the plot turned, I wanted that to happen - it's not so typical then. Snape is a damn strange guy. I was 100% sure he is good but with some drawbacks, sometimes I even liked him. Speaking of Draco... Well, he dissapointed me, couldn't even kill the guy. Heh. But, shame Sirius did not return, I still want him back, that veil didn't have to mean direct death...


May the Abyss rule!

 

Shadow of the Serpent Riders fan.

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What are you guys doing reading kids books anyway:/

What do you expect.


Civillisation will not attain perfection until the last stone, from the last church, falls on the last priest.

- Emil Zola

 

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That kid book is damn good.


May the Abyss rule!

 

Shadow of the Serpent Riders fan.

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What are you guys doing reading kids books anyway:/

What do you expect.

 

No idea, I'm just a sucker for hype. If dog shit was preceded by a massive advertising campaign I'd probably buy it. :(

 

It's just one of the few books everyone reads, so it's good for talk at work, on forums, ecetra. Da Vinci Code was also quite crap but made for a decent discussion. :)

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yeah, i read it some time back. I stopped at 4, never read 5 or 6 because i like the way 4 ended - inconclusive :D

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No idea, I'm just a sucker for hype. If dog shit was preceded by a massive advertising campaign I'd probably buy it. :(

 

It's just one of the few books everyone reads, so it's good for talk at work, on forums, ecetra. Da Vinci Code was also quite crap but made for a decent discussion. :)

...And yet books are a higher form of art... m-hmm...

:)

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Snape is almost certainly working for the forces of 'good'. I think his repulsion when facing Dumbledore on the tower had more to do with what he was going to do than with seeing Dumbledore there. It doesn't make sense that Dumbledore was pleading after staying so cool with the others. He saw Snape hesitate and so was pleading with him to carry out his heinous deed. :) If he didn't do it Snape would have blown his own cover.

 

Yes. I thought the same. I was not thinking it throuhg as you explained it here, but it made sense nevertheless. I was more going by the previous books, where Snape was always supposed to be the villain, and then it turned out to be not as it seemed. And since Dumbledore forced harry to give him the drink, even though this might have killed him, he could have done the same with Snape as well.

 

I think Draco will save Harry, and vice versa, in the 7th book. Harry will die fighting Voldemort (I have a hunch that Harry is one of the 7 thingies Voldemort created, so he'll have to scarifice himself in the end). Ron and Hermoine will get married or something.

 

That could be. never thought about this. At least it would explain why there are still four artefacts left. I thought this strange because it means that either the 7th book will be pretty cramped, or it is not the end. Which reminded me a bit of Wheel Of Time, where the pace was quite fast in the beginning, and then it started to drag. I doubt though tha Rowling will do the same. If not it would mean that in the next book the four artefacts will have to be destroyed AND Voldemort has to be killed, which seems quite a lot to me.

 

About Ron and Hermione this is funny, because from the movies the attraction between the two seemed much more obvious then in the books. Rowling also had a strong influence on the movies, so this could be a hint. Well, and their behaviour to each other in the 6th book was pretty obvious anyway.

 

Anyway, we shall see... :)

 

Well, it's still interesting to speculate. :)


Gerhard

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I loved the 6 book, better than 5 sure, but my favorite is stil 4. I like the way the plot turned, I wanted that to happen - it's not so typical then. Snape is a damn strange guy. I was 100% sure he is good but with some drawbacks, sometimes I even liked him. Speaking of Draco... Well, he dissapointed me, couldn't even kill the guy. Heh. But, shame Sirius did not return, I still want him back, that veil didn't have to mean direct death...

 

I'm pretty sure that Sirius will come back. Dumbledore is dead for sure, there is no denying that, but Sirius was always quoted as dead from the characters. And from their point of view he has to be dead. I hoped that this would happen to Dumbledore as well. That it was kind of a trick, but the fact that his portrait appeared in the office says IMO pretty clear that he is dead once and for all. Pretty said though, because I loved Dumbledore. :|


Gerhard

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What are you guys doing reading kids books anyway:/

What do you expect.

 

Well, you are right it is a kids book. So I have to read it, because I need to know what my kids read. ;)

 

Seriously, I always loved Fantasy, and HP is a pretty good fantasy. If it were not for my wife, I probably would never have picked it up, because I always thought it a kids book. In the meantime I have read each of it several times. :)

 

But speaking of kids books. Last time I started to reread it from the first volumen and I was pretty shocked this time.

I read a book about childmisstreatment from a guy named Dave Pelzer who experienced that himself http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...=books&n=507846.

This book was really shocking, especially because I have three kids myself, and seeing my kids, it always reminded me how they treated him.

Well, when I started to read the firt part of HP this time, it instantly invoked the memory of this book, because the pattern is exactly the same. It spoiled the experience quite lot, even though it was months ago when I read the other book.


Gerhard

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I think that Snape is still good, and that Dumbledore is not dead. There are a number of aspects to the ending with which I am suspicious.

 

* At no point does Snape fire any curses or hexes at any of the good guys, even though he is a very competent wizard who would have been able to take out most of the children single-handedly. When a Death Eater attempts to perform Cruciatus on Harry, Snape stops them with the excuse "Harry belongs to the Dark Lord, we are to leave him". Even when Harry is attacking Snape, Snape only blocks the curses, he does not return them.

* Dumbledore says some very strange stuff when drinking the evil potion ("I know I did wrong, please don't hurt them" etc.). He does not explain to Harry what the potion was or what effect it actually had on him. I suspect that drinking the potion caused something "evil" to enter Dumbledore, and Snape actually "killed" the evil thing rather than Dumbledore himself (eariler on in the book we are told that Avada Kedavra does no harm to the physical body).

* During Dumbledore's "funeral", the magic flames "rise up to obscure the body", and then a large tomb appears. Dumbledore's body is never actually seen to be destroyed. During the funeral Harry thinks he sees a phoenix rise up into the sky, which I am sure is significant (perhaps Dumbledore is an Animagus).

 

One suggestion I heard was that Dumbledore also had a Horcrux, although I doubt this since it would seem to be against his character to have murdered somebody. I also think we will find that Dumbledore had a much better reason for trusting Snape than is given in the book.

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That are good points for Snape. But Hagrid is carrying the dead body to the funeral. Harry and a lot of other people also found the body below the tower with broken limbs. Dumbledore was not in a condition to defend himself on the tower and he had no wand when he crashed down, though I don't really understand this. It seems that this isnot consistent, because apparently some tricks need a wand while others are not. I'm not entirely sure why the wand has to be used at all. :)

But you could be right, that the drink could somehow have created a split personality of Dumebledore where Snape killed the one and the other may survive. I also found the funeral rather strange and had the impression that this gives some hope yet. But Dumbledores portrait also appeared in the office. It could be that McGonagal put it there, but the phrasing did not indicate this. To me it read as if it just appeared there, and I had the impression that it did this on it's own. Which of course leaves the question open, when this happens. Does it mean a directorr of Hogwarts has to die? Or does it also appear when he resigns? I guess the portrait comes with the office though, so once you are a director of Hogwarts, your portrait will appear when the condition is met.

I don't think that Dumbledore had a Horcrux, because it would mean that Dumbledore would have to kill just for that purpose, which he despises, so I guess we can rule this out. There may be other ways though.

From the plot perspective it makes sense and was even explained in the book. Dumbledore was the last adult help of Harry and he could rely a lot of him. He had to go away, for Harry to become fully mature and fulfill his destiny. I guess this is the age old story about the parents releasing his child finally into adulthood to stand on his own. :)

What I also wondered about is this Unbreakable Vow that Snape took in the beginning. He knew what the task of Draco was, so taking on this vow, he knew from the start that he either had to let Draco kill Dumbledore, or kill him himself. Of course if Dumbledore told Snape to do EVERYTHING to keep his double role hidden, including killing him if it is neccessary, then he could have done this and he had to, which was made pretty clear.


Gerhard

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When I was a kid, I loved to read John Sinclair and Jerry Cotton. Since I read a lot of books my parents and teachers tolerated it. At that time I considered John them also High Art. :) I read some John Sinclairs a few weeks ago, and either it has droped quite high from the time when I was young, or I did not realize how badly written it really is. I don't think I will ever buy another one, because there are so many bad phrasings in there, that it constantly disrupts my immersion.


Gerhard

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With regard to the portrait, it is interesting that it is described as Dumbledore "slumbering" - unlike all of the other portraits which have animated active wizards in them, Dumbledore's appears to be a normal portrait, which could suggest that whatever condition is required has not in fact been met in his case.

 

The Unbreakable Vow is also interesting because although one assumes that it was related to Malfoy killing Dumbledore, the precise task was never actually stated during the vow, it was just like "will you carry out the task he has been ordered to perform if he appears likely to fail", which could be just about anything.

 

Either way, Rowling has left a lot of unanswered questions and open possibilities for almost anything to happen in the final book.

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I think the fact that his portrait showed means definitely that he is no longer the head of Hogwarts. Whats the proper word for his position anyway? Director (direct translation from German), Head of Hogwarts, principal or something else?


Gerhard

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It's headmaster in my Welsh copy, and in the English films if I recall correctly.

 

Yep, Headmaster is the traditional term for the head of a British public school (which actually means a private school, as in one which is not funded by the government).

 

In the state education system, I believe the term Headteacher is more commonly used.

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Interesting ideas you have there.

 

Well, for this was my first book in English...

 

Anyone thought about the thing written on a paper - someone destroyed the Horcux, and his signature was R. A. B.? Who was that? The only connection I remember is Regulus Black, but he was a DE and died soon.


May the Abyss rule!

 

Shadow of the Serpent Riders fan.

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Regulus Black? and what about the A? I was also thinking about the letters. Usually Rowling is fair enough to introduce characters before she uses them, so it might be that we already COULD know who this would be.


Gerhard

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