Jump to content
The Dark Mod Forums

Electronic Music


Ombrenuit

Recommended Posts

I had a streak for about a year where I was determined to become a composer--of course it fizzled when I realized that surviving college as a composer would be more then I could chew (I couldn't practice 6 hours a day...I couldn't). I've always enjoyed ambience, atmospheric music done electronically along with electronic music these days. I'm listening to the Dark Mod OST right now, and I'm wondering to myself, "How do they do that?"

 

How do you do it? Do you use a program to generate the sounds? Do you use a keyboard? I have a midi keyboard myself, but it isn't really generating the kinds of sounds I'm hearing on this soundtrack--the quality that is. I'm very curious. What is the developmental process for this sort of thing?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well I thought one of the actual sound guys would give you a thorough reply, but since they haven't, I've got enough experience to at least tell you what you need to know.

 

Everybody generates sounds in a variety of ways, generally they use a mix of things.

 

Primarily though, you want to be using some sort of ... hm can't think of what to call these apps, but basically they emulate all sorts of sound hardware right on your computer. Previously you bought decks that mix sounds and apply filters and do interesting thigns with them but now you just use software that emulates the same processes, using simple plugins instead of individual peices of hardware.

 

Of course enthusiasts use their hardware in conjunction with these apps (their keyboards that alreayd have some cool features on them) but yeah, read on...

 

I hope you've used Photoshop cause I'm going to use it as an analogy.

 

In the same way you apply various filters to an image, layer the effects of different filters, and layer different images on top of each other, you also manipulate sound in this way. There are different "effects" you can apply to sound to do all sorts of interesting things with it. And just like you can draw a picture from scratch before you start applying filters to it, some of the features of these sound apps are "tone generators" with which you can actually generate all sorts of interesting sounds to begin with.

 

The hardcore people use an app called "Reason", but for beginners like myself I highly reccomend "FL Studio 5", I daresay it is not as capable, but by the same token it is a lot easier to understand and pretty much contains more features than a person like you or I could ever know what to do with. You can generate any kind of music with these apps, eg. acoustical, electronica, and the atmospheric stuff you hear in the Theif games.

 

Use the MIDI keyboard to enter in music (I have a little MIDI keyboard myself, it's great for coming up with melodies) but input it into the software so that you can use it to control any instrument you generate with the software.

 

Generally a MIDI keyboard doesn't actually generate sounds once you plug it into the MIDI input on the computer (traditionally, this is the old fashioned "game controller" port on your soundcard), it just sends key information, and the software you're using generates the sounds, so you can use your MIDI keyboard to play any sort of sound you can possibly construct.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Generating sounds is analogous to generating image textures in many ways:

 

1) There is a large variety of tools available, from professional studio apps to bits of freeware that are good for one or two specific jobs. Typically a selection of tools will be employed, starting from "generation" tools and ending with a final "composition/mastering" utility (PhotoShop, Sound Forge, Cool Edit, etc).

2) A combination of "painting from scratch" or layering existing samples can be used.

3) By using high-quality original samples you can generate a very good result with relatively little work.

4) You don't need any special hardware (MIDI keyboards/graphics tablets), but more experienced artists/composers may find that their workflow is quicker with one.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hmm, this is a tough question, kinda. Or rather, the answer is tough.

 

Domarius and Weaver covered the technical basics neatly in their posts. I think the word Dom was looking for is 'Sequencer', which is the core part of any composing software. As the name indicates, it's simply a schedule when to play what note.

 

The actual sound is created by either samplers or synthesizers. A sampler is something that replays a previously recorded sample, often giving you the option to alter pitch and length. A synthesizer lets you design a sound from scratch. It is very difficult to recreate natural sounds or instruments with synths, witness the good ol' MIDI sounds, but they are great for more experimental sounds.

 

Finaly, you have all sorts of effects you can put on your sounds. Reverb, chorus, delay... the list is endless. But in essence, it all boils down to this:

 

Sequencer->Generator->Effects

 

In the olden times, you had to buy hardware for this, but nowadays software gets close to perfect in emulating those machines. And yes, some hardware still can not be replaced.

 

Interfaces for the programs vary, of course. To use Domarius' analogy, some people like Paintshop, some prefer Photoshop. Reason and Fruity Loops use an interface that is strongly derivated from a special type of sequencer hardware, which was mostly used in live environments. This interface is very simple, and I would recommend FL for beginners to play with, too, because I can imagine it is very intuitive.

 

People who already play an instrument and are used to the staff view would likely prefer a program that offers this kind of interface, like Cakewalk and Finale (not sure if P'heads included musical staff view in Reason meanwhile).

 

Myself, I'm using a program derivating from the Tracker branch. Trackers originated in the computer demo scene and where in essence only samplers, offering a limited number of tracks or channels you could sequence on. The program I am currently using is Jeskola Buzz, which is freeware and (save the core engine) opensourced. I'm not up to date, but I think developement on this particular app has ceased, but I read about a promising spin-off the other day. If you want to have a look at a simple Tracker interface, I recommend MadTracker. Still no synthesizers, but it will give you an idea of things before you tackle a beast like Buzz.

 

So much for the tools. You will be able to beep and bleep with something like Fruity Loops without any knowledge of musical theory whatsoever, but it really helps. I'm autodidact and worked my way from slamming an E major chord on a guitar - without knowing wtf E major means.

In retrospect, if I had spent more time reading up on theory instead impressing girls with slamming E major cords I would have an easier time now - I still can't read staff fluently... then again, the benefits of impressing said girls weren't too bad, either.

But anyways, you should at least be aware of what a muscial scale is, and how the different notes are named. Knowing major from minor also helps, but really, most software has play on click, and you will quickly learn which tones go well with each other.

 

And then there's the creative process. Well, I could of course describe how I usually go at a track, but this is different for everybody, like with everything else.

 

Hope this helps, and sorry for the late answer!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Primarily though, you want to be using some sort of ... hm can't think of what to call these apps, but basically they emulate all sorts of sound hardware right on your computer. Previously you bought decks that mix sounds and apply filters and do interesting thigns with them but now you just use software that emulates the same processes, using simple plugins instead of individual peices of hardware.

Are you talking about VST-plugins? They are used to emulate sounds, based on notation/midi-sheets or whatever. They're not application-based, even if Steinberg created the format (I think), and most DAWs can read them pretty well.

 

There are other types of systems out there (trackers/sequencers), but DAWs (Digital Audio Workstation) are the most common applications for creating music (not nessecarily for the creating of pure electronic music though), and they work pretty much like a recording studio. You record real instruments (or use VST-plugins) on a timeline (if you've seen programs like Premiere or Flash, you know what that means) across several channels, and mix everything etc.

 

The hardcore people use an app called "Reason", but for beginners like myself I highly reccomend "FL Studio 5", I daresay it is not as capable, but by the same token it is a lot easier to understand and pretty much contains more features than a person like you or I could ever know what to do with. You can generate any kind of music with these apps, eg. acoustical, electronica, and the atmospheric stuff you hear in the Theif games.

Reason works well when you're only dealing with electronic stuff, but if you need to work a lot with digital audiofiles, you want to use something like Cubase (Steinberg) or Cakewalk.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The program I am currently using is Jeskola Buzz, which is freeware and (save the core engine) opensourced. I'm not up to date, but I think developement on this particular app has ceased, but I read about a promising spin-off the other day. If you want to have a look at a simple Tracker interface, I recommend MadTracker. Still no synthesizers, but it will give you an idea of things before you tackle a beast like Buzz.

You're kidding :) Buzz is, like, the coolest thing ever.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is, but it's not particulary fit to learn your way around tracker environments - it employs tracker-style sequencing, true, but there are a gazillion more features that can make things too complicated for a beginner.

 

 

Oh, and Ombrenuit, is your avatar from Gankutsuou?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This all seems like a lot to swallow, but I thank you all for taking the time to explain a bit of it. I can read music to a reasonable degree and I own a diluted version of Finale actually. I've been taking piano for 10 years, but then again, considering how much I should have practiced and how little I actually did; I'm definitly not as good as I should be in the least (one of the reasons that ambition didn't particularly float. I was completely out of my league). I suppose what I was mainly wondering was about synthesizers themselves and how sounds and texture for music were generated. I think my biggest hindrance is simply that although I have the creativity for composing, I'm completely lacking in experience. I've done some rudimentary music theory studies and that sort, but nothing that inspires the ideas. Then again, trying to compose piano music isn't exactly something one should start with. I wanted to fiddle with electronic music because I like the idea of music as textures and interaction; the basic beats are relitively easy to control the the structure comes more naturally to me then say, trying to write a piece that sounds like it came out of the Romantic era. I haven't composed anything since I abandoned my original ambition, and the guilt has been hanging over my head for that while.

 

And yes, my avatar is indeed from Gankutsuou, Schatten. I sent you a PM.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is, but it's not particulary fit to learn your way around tracker environments - it employs tracker-style sequencing, true, but there are a gazillion more features that can make things too complicated for a beginner.

Ahem, that came out wrong, sorry. Meant "You're kidding" as in "You're kidding, YOU TOO!?". Buzz is definetly a little bizarre, not to mention confusing.... But you just gotta love it anyway. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I remember trackers, I used to produce music with Impulse tracker on DOS.

 

They are very much a "techi" solution, the Assembler of music production. The main advantage of them is the internal sample processing which means you don't have to use external samplers or anything.

 

What I would like is a tracker with a sequencer-style interface, to combine the best of both worlds.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think FL Studio 5 IS the best of both worlds. The "piano roll" window (as its sometimes known as, I guess) is just like tracking, and you can use anything as an instrument - a wav file, an SF2, tone generator etc. and you can layer anything on top of that to change the way it sounds.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think FL Studio 5 IS the best of both worlds. The "piano roll" window (as its sometimes known as, I guess) is just like tracking, and you can use anything as an instrument - a wav file, an SF2, tone generator etc. and you can layer anything on top of that to change the way it sounds.

 

It's not the interface from tracking I want though - it's the interface from a MIDI sequencer (multiple channels, variable-size blocks that can be named, recorded, edited (in piano roll, notation or event view), copied and dragged around) but the internal sample handling of a tracker (load samples, perhaps edit them, have as many as you want, appy effects and volume envelope, without having to use ANY external MIDI programs).

 

A completely self-contained music production system, in other words, that lets you do anything you want with audio without having to write lines like "F#4 00 01 32 E00" all over the place.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

They are very much a "techi" solution, the Assembler of music production. The main advantage of them is the internal sample processing which means you don't have to use external samplers or anything.

 

Assembler of music? I used FL for a while, but frankly didn't like it. It thinks people are used to some hardware interface and method of production which I'm not. I prefer "pd" or "csound" although I haven't had much practice with them for lack of time. The original post by Ombrenuit completely describes my situation (piano, electronic, composing, etc).

 

lets you do anything you want with audio without having to write lines like "F#4 00 01 32 E00" all over the place.

 

pd and csound both do that without "F#4 00 01 32 E00".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's not the interface from tracking I want though - it's the interface from a MIDI sequencer (multiple channels, variable-size blocks that can be named, recorded, edited (in piano roll, notation or event view), copied and dragged around) but the internal sample handling of a tracker (load samples, perhaps edit them, have as many as you want, appy effects and volume envelope, without having to use ANY external MIDI programs).

 

A completely self-contained music production system, in other words, that lets you do anything you want with audio without having to write lines like "F#4 00 01 32 E00" all over the place.

Again, FL Studio :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I should have mentioned I want an open source product, not a commercial one. In fact if I had the time I would be interested in developing such a tool myself, but unfortunately I don't so it will have to remain on the wish list.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recent Status Updates

    • Ansome

      Finally got my PC back from the shop after my SSD got corrupted a week ago and damaged my motherboard. Scary stuff, but thank goodness it happened right after two months of FM development instead of wiping all my work before I could release it. New SSD, repaired Motherboard and BIOS, and we're ready to start working on my second FM with some added version control in the cloud just to be safe!
      · 1 reply
    • Petike the Taffer  »  DeTeEff

      I've updated the articles for your FMs and your author category at the wiki. Your newer nickname (DeTeEff) now comes first, and the one in parentheses is your older nickname (Fieldmedic). Just to avoid confusing people who played your FMs years ago and remember your older nickname. I've added a wiki article for your latest FM, Who Watches the Watcher?, as part of my current updating efforts. Unless I overlooked something, you have five different FMs so far.
      · 0 replies
    • Petike the Taffer

      I've finally managed to log in to The Dark Mod Wiki. I'm back in the saddle and before the holidays start in full, I'll be adding a few new FM articles and doing other updates. Written in Stone is already done.
      · 4 replies
    • nbohr1more

      TDM 15th Anniversary Contest is now active! Please declare your participation: https://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?/topic/22413-the-dark-mod-15th-anniversary-contest-entry-thread/
       
      · 0 replies
    • JackFarmer

      @TheUnbeholden
      You cannot receive PMs. Could you please be so kind and check your mailbox if it is full (or maybe you switched off the function)?
      · 1 reply
×
×
  • Create New...