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Thief Model Ingame


Domarius
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Okay with oDDity's help on MSN, I got the Thief in the game with all his textures on and a few anims. Okay, almost all his textures on. But the shaders are right for the ones that are on.

 

Also he's been resized by 110%

 

He has some holes where there is some texture missing somewhere...

 

He has 4 anims - af_pose, lean_r, run, crouch

 

Test him out by loading up a map then typing

testModel thief

then type

nextanim

to cycle through the anims.

 

It should be enough to do something with hopefully?

 

post-10-1154444423_thumb.jpg

Oh yeah, the pic looks like crap because I need to do an update and the materials on the walls are screwed, and at full brightness. The thief is dark because it's actually dark in that room.

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Is the camera going to be adjusted up? Standing next to him, either we're really short, or he's one big fellow.

 

The camera shouldn't have to be adjusted if everything went smoothly. Resizing him by 110% should have raised his eyes to 68 units, which is where the camera is located.

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Okay with oDDity's help on MSN, I got the Thief in the game with all his textures on and a few anims. Okay, almost all his textures on. But the shaders are right for the ones that are on.

 

Also he's been resized by 110%

 

He has some holes where there is some texture missing somewhere...

 

He has 4 anims - af_pose, lean_r, run, crouch

 

Test him out by loading up a map then typing

testModel thief

then type

nextanim

to cycle through the anims.

 

It should be enough to do something with hopefully?

 

post-10-1154444423_thumb.jpg

Oh yeah, the pic looks like crap because I need to do an update and the materials on the walls are screwed, and at full brightness. The thief is dark because it's actually dark in that room.

 

To get the left lean, I think I was playing around and mirrored the right lean and saved it as an mb file. Just needs to be converted to md5. I would do that for you, but I haven't been able to get the md5 conversion working. I'll post the lean_left when I get a chance later.

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Yes, something is not right. He actually looks the same size as the elite watch.

 

edit: I can't load the model into the editor without getting just a weird serious of boxes, so I can't measure him, but I'd say that he is definitely too large. Are you sure you didn't resize him 110% twice?

post-9-1154452335_thumb.jpg

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Yes, something is not right. He actually looks the same size as the elite watch.

 

edit: I can't load the model into the editor without getting just a weird serious of boxes, so I can't measure him, but I'd say that he is definitely too large. Are you sure you didn't resize him 110% twice?

 

Here you go Spring.

 

I hacked a def file together and fired up Dark Radiant.

 

 

post-3-1154459181_thumb.jpg

 

They're the same size.

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Oh, I see what part of the problem might be. In the AF pose he's standing straight up. But in the model pose I used to measure his height, he was kind of hunched over, which is how he is in most of the animations, I believe.

 

height3.jpg

 

I'm not entirely sure that's the whole reason he seems large, though. He really shouldn't be as tall as the elite watch even standing straight up. Can you post the def file you used NH? When I tried to throw one together I just got weird boxes in the editor. We should be able to apply one of the animations in the editor and see what that does to the height.

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The problem is - I don't even know how you arrived at 110% - you could have been looking at a different file or something.

 

Okay - no more stuffing around. This is what I need. Do this for me and they'll be the right size.

 

Do me up a bitmap image of each character in the AF pose, then a marker where the ideal eye height should be (I say eye height and not head height, because some of them wear helmets and hoods)

 

Ensure that the shot of each character is in the AF pose and is the latest copy from CVS. And ensure that the shots are taken in an orthographic view (just like the wireframe ones so far) so that distance and perspective distortion is not an issue.

 

This way I can import the picture as a reference, resize it so its matches the size of the current characters, then resize the characterse so that their eye heights are level with your eye height marker.

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Okay - no more stuffing around. This is what I need. Do this for me and they'll be the right size.

 

I'll be away until next week so someone else will have to do this. Although, like I've said before, the player model's eyes should be at 68 doom units--but this should be while moving around, not necessarily in AF pose. If the character is going to move in a 'skulking' pose where they're hunched over, then the AF height will be larger.

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Well I definetly need a bitmap. Doom units mean nothing, because the modelling app works in its own units of measurement. And percentages are too unreliable, too many factors that can be different between how someone arrives at that number.

 

And of course, like I said, they have to be in AF pose. I included an AF pose for the thief this time.

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In the screenshots both NH and Spring posted, you can clearly see that the thief standing up in his AF pose is the same height as the Elite in his AF pose. And they said that the Elite is too tall, so that means the Thief is now too tall as well.

 

I'm sure you guys have worked out exactly what height the average character should be - I don't know how you reached the conclusion but I don't have to - I just need my bitmap image.

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If the thief is at the right height to match up with the camera when skulking (not that this is true, just wondering if it is), does it really matter how tall he is when standing straight up and down? Are we ever going to see him standing straight up and down?

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If the thief is at the right height to match up with the camera when skulking (not that this is true, just wondering if it is),

 

I don't think it is, Ish. It's pretty clear looking at my comparison shot that this new thief model is more than 110% larger than the one in that screenshot. Whether there are multiple thief models floating about with different sizes I don't know.

 

Ok, before I can get the information Dom needs I'll need a working entitydef for the thief model. Mine doesn't work for whatever reason, so I'll PM NH for his. Although Dom, you would have all of the necessary files/info to do this yourself. All you'd need to do is:

 

1. Load your new thief model into the editor in AF pose.

 

2. Change your editor view to Z orientation (so you can see the height).

 

3. Use the entity def window to select the walking or idle animation (or any other animation that has the thief in the hunched over pose).

 

4. Count the grid to see where the model's eyes are currently.

 

5. Calculate how much the model needs to be reduced to have his eyes go to 68 doom units.

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Ok, I take it back, it's going to be a little more complicated than that.

 

There are currently only three animations on CVS for the thief model. Running and crouching aren't really useful for determining average eye height. The leaning animation, however, actually starts with the thief standing straight up.

 

lean1.jpg

 

So now I'm a little confused. Will the default position of the thief be hunched over or not? Or is the idle pose for the thief going to be standing straight, but the movement be with a bit of a hunch? The only reason I assumed the thief would be hunched over is because he appeared that way in Oddity's screenshots. That could have been an arbitrary pose, however. I think it's probably more realistic to have the thief hunched a bit, rather than strolling around standing straight up. But if that's true, then why have the lean start from a standing position?

 

If the player's eye height is going to vary depending on how they are moving, should I just try to pick a size where the average eye height is 68 units?

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Ok, I take it back, it's going to be a little more complicated than that.

 

There are currently only three animations on CVS for the thief model. Running and crouching aren't really useful for determining average eye height. The leaning animation, however, actually starts with the thief standing straight up.

 

lean1.jpg

 

So now I'm a little confused. Will the default position of the thief be hunched over or not? Or is the idle pose for the thief going to be standing straight, but the movement be with a bit of a hunch? The only reason I assumed the thief would be hunched over is because he appeared that way in Oddity's screenshots. That could have been an arbitrary pose, however. I think it's probably more realistic to have the thief hunched a bit, rather than strolling around standing straight up. But if that's true, then why have the lean start from a standing position?

 

If the player's eye height is going to vary depending on how they are moving, should I just try to pick a size where the average eye height is 68 units?

 

I wouldn't be too worried about the model, we're not tied to it like in T3. The camera movements...like the head bob while running... is defined in the player.def file, not by the model.

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So as long as the player model is reasonably close to the right size, that's good enough?

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So as long as the player model is reasonably close to the right size, that's good enough?

 

I think so. Id didn't stick to it very strictly, hence the problem with the lightgem clipping into the floor. It uses the players eyes as a guide and when you crouch, the player eyes drop into the chest area. The model is just there for reflections really. So as long as the idle pose matches the eyes, it should be alright. We likely won't see the player model reflection in motion enough to scrutinize the eye level.

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I'm not sure what requirement the lean code will have on the model, maybe none. The current method bends the model at the waist manually, which is a clever solution but doesn't get quite enough distance. I'm guessing we'll end up decoupling the view and the model when we alter the lean again, since we now have a lean animation. As long as the animation leans out far enough so that the position we move the camera to can be hit by arrows, it should be fine.

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