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The problem is when people get beaten up for not adding those suffixes, since using terms in informal discussion makes no difference to any possible case of trademark infringement.

 

When people get used to using the term in informal discussions, they often slip and do it in threads that are open to the public, which then leads to the idea being spread around by non-team-members on TTLG and elsewhere. I don't think anyone here is qualified to say what is enough to make a company decide to go after a perceived threat to their IP, so better safe than sorry, especially when it takes about two brain cells to remember. ;)

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I still stand by my claim. This discussion shouldn't have even started. If you can imagine the hammer/gear in the Thief Universe, then you can imagine it in the Dark Mod. Parallels can be drawn because our project is inspired by Thief. Simple as that. If you can't imagine it in the Thief Universe, then you can't imagine it in the Dark Mod. Why such an analogy had to be so controversial is beyond me, unless my post was misinterpreted; which I'll take partial blame for not writing more clearly that I was making an analogy.

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When people get used to using the term in informal discussions, they often slip and do it in threads that are open to the public, which then leads to the idea being spread around by non-team-members on TTLG and elsewhere. I don't think anyone here is qualified to say what is enough to make a company decide to go after a perceived threat to their IP, so better safe than sorry, especially when it takes about two brain cells to remember. ;)

 

The problem with the "better safe than sorry" approach is that it massively exaggerates the threat, effectively providing free FUD for the media companies who could only wish for an IP regime so strict that merely discussing the fictional universe of their game is actionable infringement.

 

Besides, even if Eidos do get territorial about "the Thief universe" and start sending out C&Ds, the very worst that can happen is that the ISP gets panicked and pulls the site, whereupon it can just be set up with another ISP or even in a different country. The industry couldn't even shut down the Pirate Bay, which is based in a single country with a single owner and verges on outright illegality in its behaviour, so how the hell are they going to shut down an international mod team with no single owner, no single nationality and no reasonably-arguable case of infringement?

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Publishing heavyweight Electronic Arts (EA), which owns the intellectual property (IP) rights to System Shock. The team behind the mod, called Sapphire Scar, received a firmly worded letter from EA asking it to stop all work on the project due to infringements on the IP. Obviously, the team was more than a little annoyed, but it has followed the request and is now working on a stand-alone project to rival what an updated System Shock title should offer. Details of the project can be found on the Sapphire Scar website, where you can also review the correspondence received from EA.
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Well basically, having worked in companies before, I'm naturally mindful about saying anything about the project - because you're essentially speaking on behalf of the team, which you may not be in a best position to do.

 

To be on the safe side, I don't consider myself that way at all, and leave it to NewHorizon. Never had a need to speak publically on the forums about it. Only to people I know personally.

 

It shouldn't be too hard to realise you're speaking publically and use the "-like" and "inspired" suffixes.

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Never had a need to speak publically on the forums about it. Only to people I know personally.

 

It shouldn't be too hard to realise you're speaking publically and use the "-like" and "inspired" suffixes.

Ditto, it's not too hard to do that, and I wouldn't. The last few posts should've taught you that you should use "-like" and "inspired" internally all the time, as well; because lawyers will take control of this entire site if they wish. And we haven't established well enough everywhere else the fact that we are Thief-inspired, not Thief.

 

EDIT: I meant this in jest, Domarius, not a put-down in any way, shape or form :)

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Ditto, it's not too hard to do that, and I wouldn't. The last few posts should've taught you that you should use "-like" and "inspired" internally all the time, as well; because lawyers will take control of this entire site if they wish.

 

In order for lawyers to gain access to the boards they would have to file a subpoena, which basically means they would have already started legal proceedings and are conducting discovery for their case. In order to launch the case and get the subpoean they would need some reasonable evidence of infringement, in which case the mod is already in trouble no matter what sort of language is used on the message boards.

 

And we haven't established well enough everywhere else the fact that we are Thief-inspired, not Thief.

 

Fortunately however, trademark infringement is based on what you actually do, not what the community thinks you are doing. It is stated quite clearly on the TDM official website that the mod is NOT a remake of Thief, and even if 100% of the people on TTLG and elsewhere think it is, it still isn't.

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  • 1 month later...

I was working recently on another skins and models variation of The Hammer statue.

 

Here are two skins for the big one:

hammers_big.jpg

 

Now the broken and rusted models: (I might do some flinders for the broken model to put around)

hammers_broken.jpg

 

And some smaller versions - the bigger one is intended to put outside, not in the church.

hammers_medium.jpg

 

So, these are only 4 models all together but with 9 variations. I'd like to do also some small copy - some portable statue - to be put on the altar or as a loot item (that one could be covered with some ornaments).

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Wow, that's awesome Pink! :)

 

I love all the different variations. Please do make a small loot version as well! :)

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Wow! Very nice. I love the big metal one especially (top picture, on the left). Great detail with the riveting on the front of the hammer. Any chance of getting a bit of that on the smaller metal one? The front of it looks a little bit bare. But I'm nitpicking of course. :)

My games | Public Service Announcement: TDM is not set in the Thief universe. The city in which it takes place is not the City from Thief. The player character is not called Garrett. Any person who contradicts these facts will be subjected to disapproving stares.
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Thanks for the feedback! :)

 

Great detail with the riveting on the front of the hammer. Any chance of getting a bit of that on the smaller metal one? The front of it looks a little bit bare. But I'm nitpicking of course.

Of course, there are some chances... :) but I'm a bit tired of them at this moment. I wanted to make them diffrent, but there's no problem to make another skin in the future. These hammers were just "accident" on the way of making graveyard's models....

 

So is that pose how the Builders stand when they pray to the master builder?

Yes, I would say so. They're saying at the same time: Look Master Builder - I'm all Yours, I have nothing to hide... ;)

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I have a question about the skins - can we assign two separate skins for one model? Cause these big Hammers have 2 diffrent materials, which I want to be able to change independently.

Also with the graves models - I would like to make the entire stone material to be changable (to f.e. diffrent colour stone, with some cracks etc...) and independently I would like to change the texture with some text or carvings on it. Is it possible?

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Thanks greebo! That's useful indeed.

 

But it would be even better if I could apply two (or more) separate skins for one model. Let's say grave - I would like to change independently texture of stone, texture of engravings and texture of some ivy wrapped around the grave (to nodraw if you don't want it). It would be easier to change them sepatately cause I wouldn't have to multiply every possibilities. For example: 3 types of stone x 5 engravings x 2 (yes or no for the ivy) = 30 skins for each grave... This might be quite long list...

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The skin chooser in Dark Radiant will make it all invisible to the user anyway

Sorry, I don't know what you mean - what will be invisible for the user?

Do you mean it's not possible to modify DarkRadiant to work with skins that way...?

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Sorry, I don't know what you mean - what will be invisible for the user?

 

Sorry, I just meant that the 'inner-workings' of how skin files are setup is invisible to the average mapper...unless they decide to create their own. To the average user, they just have a wide variety of skins to choose from. They'll be happy in the end. :)

 

Do you mean it's not possible to modify DarkRadiant to work with skins that way...?

 

I can't say no for sure, but I doubt it. Not really a problem with Dark Radiant, but rather how skin files function. As far as I know, you can only assign a single skin file to a model...it just replaces the default 'skin set'. The tutorial shows that you can definitely mix and match your skins on a model, but they have to be predefined in that objects skin file in order to work. It's the same idea as what you want to do, it's just not the same in the 'hot-swappable' sense. Skins need to be planned in advance.

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