Hdtv = Monitor?

[Ishtvan]

So I need a new TV, need a new monitor. I usually get pretty high end monitors (the last one is 6 years old, so I can afford to spend a bit on the next one... I'd be willing to spend under $2k). I'm wondering about the feasibility of just getting a nice TV and using it as a monitor (or vice-versa).

 

I'm kind've wary about using a plasma TV as a monitor though, since I've heard plasmas use a lot of power and also have issues with burn-in.

 

That being said, this looks kind've interesting: link . It claims it has a resolution of 1024x768, and I don't usually feel the need to set games above that anyway. Still, not too keen on the plasma.

 

[EDIT: Here's a 42 inch LCD one just under $2K that claims a resolution of 1366(H) x 768(V) , although it says "720p, effective", so I dunno if that would be compatible with a PC output near 1024 : link]

 

Anyway I'll keep researching, just getting started really, and haven't looked at any specific sales or deals, but if anyone has ideas or setups that work well for them, I'd be interested to hear about it. Thanks!

[Ishtvan]

In retrospect, 42" is WAY too big for a personal "room" TV/monitor.

 

This one from Viewsonic looks kind've promising. Native res. is 1366x768, but they don't really tell you how good the pixel interpolation is for other resolutions...

 

http://www.viewsonic.com/products/tventert...t/lcdtv/n3260w/

 

[EDIT: According to Tom's Hardware, most of the 32" LCDs do not have very black black levels at all. I could probably deal with a 26" for this application]

[Komag]

Have you looked at projectors? They can be very sharp nowadays. I have a 800x600 one and I'm amazed at how clear each square pixel is on the large screen. I imagine the pixels could be one quarter the size (1600x1200) and still be pretty sharp little squares up close. I don't know what resolutions they can come it, but I'm sure they run the gamut.

[obscurus]

I'd avoid plasma - they have come along a bit, but they are still pretty shit, as they 1. don't last very long, so you will spend a shitload of money on something that will not last much longer than a cheap flourescent light bulb before you start losing pixels at a rate of knots(at best), 2., have very poor image quality when viewed up close due to the technical limitations on pixel size with plasma screens, 3., they do suffer from burn in if the same thing is on screen for a while, and 4., they generally have very poor contrast ratios.

 

Regardless, the bigger the screen, the poorer the image quality unless you are willing to invest in a projection system. You need a room that you can make fairly dark, and a good sized wall to put your screen against, but if you do it right, it is the best way to have a really big screen.

 

 

The next best thing is LCD.

 

TVs don't generally make for ideal computer monitors, as they are designed for viewing from a distance, while monitors are designed for viewing up close, so regardless of what you get, you will be making a compromise.

[Komag]

Playing Oblivion on a huge wall is quite a trip though, highly recommended!

[Ishtvan]

Yeah, I've had access to a projector before and they're great, but for this purchase I'm thinking it'll be more like a "bedroom TV / monitor." I don't know why I was thinking of such a huge size at first, I'd probably be fine with 20-26. Due to the latency and "bright black" issues, I'm thinking a monitor is probably better than a TV for the dual monitor/TV use. Needless to say I'm going to want to play games, so low latency is good.

 

Now I just have to see if I can afford a 26" LCD monitor. Tom's Hardware was implying that 20" is pretty much the standard for LCD monitors, not sure why.

 

(Yeah, Viewsonic monitors at least only go up to 23")

 

EDIT: Sony and Samsung both go over 23", but there seems to be a jump there away from monitor applications and into "digital signage" applications. It also seems like a lot of other performance metrics go down when you make the jump to larger screen monitors. Maybe 23" would be good enough for small room TV applications?

[obscurus]

If I were in your situation, I would go to a store that has a range of monitors on display, and see if you can get a feel fow how big a monitor you really need. A twenty inch widescreen LCD would seem adequate to me, and they come with fairly decent performance ( <8ms latency, 600:1 contrast ratio). Once you go above 20", the price becomes pretty painful, and performance, as you said, diminishes.

 

Not knowing the dimensions of the room or the intended viewing distance, I can only guess at what would suit you best, but monitors have much better image quality than TVs, due to the closer intended viewing distance. I've seen a lot of LCD TVs that have noticable latency issues, and they cost more than an equivalently sized monitor in most cases anyway.

 

Get the monitor I say...

[Ishtvan]

Yeah, I agree a monitor is probably the way to go. The room is bedroom sized, if I had to guess I'd say roughly 8'x12'. Most often it will be used as a monitor. I'm not sure yet whether to wall mount it or put it on a desk.

 

Occasionally it will probably be used to watch movies/TV from farther away, but probably no more than 6 ft away max.

 

Currently I'm thinking I won't need more than 26" max. Maybe the 23" size that seems to be the last standard size before "digital signage" would do it, I'm not sure. I'll have to wait 'till I move into the room and put up some test structures.

 

[EDIT: THis one from Viewsonic looks nice. I keep coming back to Viewsonic because of the low latency:

http://www.viewsonic.com/products/desktopd...eries/vp2330wb/

]

[sparhawk]

I have purchased a plasma 42" and I'm very satisfied with it. Can't say that it lacks contrast (1:10000) and we will see how long it last. Ufnrotunately I didn't manage to hook up my computer on it. I can only connect it via the normal VIDEO OUT connection which has quite a crappy quality for the desktop. It supports also VGA standard, but somehow it doesn't work and I have to figure out whats wrong.

On the other hand, for games it's absolutely amazing. I was running Need for Speed 2 on that screen and it's really a great experience on such a big screen.

The conputer that I connected it to was only intended for movie viewing, so it is not really suitable for games. That's why I choose NFS2 because it's older and run well on that machine. After seeing how it feels to play on it, I really consider to move a better machine there. I wonder how it is to play Prey on such a screen.

 

Incidently, we have a movie theater here in the town and they set aside one of the theaters for PC gaming. So you can play there on the movie screen for about 3 Euro per hour with an high-end machine. Currently they are reconstructing but when it is finished I defintely want to go there and see for myself. If you are only watching it's free so I can take a look and see how it is.

[Arumakani]

I basically have this one: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Toshiba-27WLT56-Wi...W/dp/B000BKVLZM

 

Absolutely brilliant with the XBox360. Oblivion looked magnificent. The Computer looked cool enough through it though I got a 19" Monitor for it.

[god_is_my_goldfish]

Dude, just spend about 300$ and (if you have the space) build your own hi-def projector!

http://www.tomshardware.com/2004/11/13/sup...e_your_tv_for_/

(Especially if you can find a monitor that supports 1280x1024)

[Maximius]

Incidently, we have a movie theater here in the town and they set aside one of the theaters for PC gaming. So you can play there on the movie screen for about 3 Euro per hour with an high-end machine. Currently they are reconstructing but when it is finished I defintely want to go there and see for myself. If you are only watching it's free so I can take a look and see how it is.

 

 

I'm brushing up on my German, my plane lands in five hours, can I borrow your couch for about fifteen years?

[sparhawk]

Ah! Now I get it!

 

No need for hurry. Last time I asked, they said they will be finished at the end of September. So you have still time to take a language course and find a flat.

 

But I found this a pretty cool idea, when I read this. I wonder how the screen looks, because with such a size I would expect a lot of artefacts. Depends on the machione and the game of course. Can you imagine playing Need for Speed on such a machine? Or Prey? Wow! When that sucking nasty doors opening with such a size? They already look disgusting on a normal screen.

[demagogue]

Thanks to goldfish, I'm totally going to build my own movie projector now and wow all my friends with one of our high-school projectors being put to good use. It looks fun to do just for the sake of doing it.

[Maximius]

Ah! Now I get it!

 

No need for hurry. Last time I asked, they said they will be finished at the end of September. So you have still time to take a language course and find a flat.

 

But I found this a pretty cool idea, when I read this. I wonder how the screen looks, because with such a size I would expect a lot of artefacts. Depends on the machione and the game of course. Can you imagine playing Need for Speed on such a machine? Or Prey? Wow! When that sucking nasty doors opening with such a size? They already look disgusting on a normal screen.

 

Im seeing Homeworld style space battles with dreadnoughts the size of Cadillacs. God it would be glorious, I'd work there as an usher to play afterhours. I could live on ju-ju bees and stale soda. I would need nothing else.

[Komag]

Until you get used to it...

 

Sitting on the couch seeing my screen is a similar ratio to seeing a movie screen from about a little forward of center of the theater. It IS great and cool and stuff, but after time you just get spoiled by it!

[Maximius]

Until you get used to it...

 

Sitting on the couch seeing my screen is a similar ration to seeing a movie screen from about a little forward of center of the theater. It IS great and cool and stuff, but after time you just get spoiled by it!

 

 

Do you find any advantages to mapping and such with the projecter?

[Komag]

Oh no, I actually find it harder to do anything serious with it. I only use it to watch TV, movies, and play games. If I do anything else, I switch the signal to my regular monitor on my desk to the side. That will probably turn you off to them!

 

The reason is probably mostly due to the fact that the best way to look at the screen is to lay back on the couch. I can still play games this way because I have a wireless keyboard and mouse, which I can lay on my lap and next to me on a book on the couch. But to do something more than game controls just doesn't seem to work well in that position, and works better sitting nice and upright at a desk.

 

(BTW, I mostly do all my serious stuff on my laptop anyway, so it also might be I'm just not used to working on the big screen)

[sparhawk]

The big screen is not really well suited for serious work, unless you are modeller maybe, because it simply is to big. And it offers no additional advantages, because the bigness doesn't make for more info. Its just the same resolution spaced out more.

[Ishtvan]

Okay, I'm starting to zero in on a monitor (possibly Samsung 244T - Does anyone have this and if so what's your impression of it?)

 

But I was wondering, what are the pros and cons of having a widescreen monitor?

 

How many games nowadays support widescreen aspect ratios, and will that change in the future? Just how bad do games look when they're stretched/cropped onto the widescreen monitor at 1024x768 or other non-widescreen aspect ratios?

 

I'm not too worried about it for video playing, since I've seen widescreen TVs before and you get used to the stretching, plus a lot of movies are in widescreen format already.

[Crispy]

Widescreen support for games varies, apparently... See http://www.widescreengamingforum.com/

 

Doom 3 appears to work pretty well though, according to that site.

[Komag]

My laptop is widescreen, and a lot of my games aren't, so there are a couple options I have.

 

1. I can set it to only center the resolution, using the exact pixels. If the game is set at 640x480, this would make for a very small viewable game screen, because it will use just the center of my laptop screen. But since my laptop screen is 1280x800, if I use a game at 1024x768 it uses most of the vertical screen, looks pretty good, and nice and sharp to boot since there's no scaling.

 

2. I can set it to "fixed aspect ratio scaling" which will scale up the size but not stretch it, so a 640x480 game will be large up to the top and bottom, but the sides will be black, preserving the 4/3 ratio.

 

3. I can just set it to fully scale up and use the whole screen, stretching any 4/3 to my widescreen.

 

I always use 3 just to have the biggest picture, and only at first did things look stretched wide a bit. Very soon I got very used to it and it looks completely normal to me now. The scaling does sacrifice some sharpness, but it's fine with me and I sort of consider it some free antialiasing.

 

In fact, I've gotten so used to the wide stretch that when I do something on my desktop with normal 4/3 it looks squished to me! But then I get used to it being normal after a few minutes, so now I can go both ways just fine.

[Ishtvan]

I'm a little concerned that T2 is listed as "none" under widescreen support. I hope that means you have to stretch it or center it, not that it simply won't run at all (I can't imagine why that would be, but just want to make sure).

[Komag]

Yes it works fine, will just stretch or whatever. Same with any game that doesn't "support" widescreen