Squawks Templates - Oddity Style

[Domarius]

As you can see by the overlay, she did a pretty good job - it lines up perfectly. All I did so far was enlarge the boots.

 

What do you guys think so far?

[Domarius]

I forgot to add, if the boot looks like it's bigger on the outside edge, it's not. They're just in a different position. Here's a closeup so you can see they're pretty much the same size, just offset from each other a bit.

[Domarius]

Sorry, here's one with the arms matching squawks pose - once I did that, I could see the arms were noticibly longer than oDDity's version, so I shortened them.

 

What do you guys think so far?

[SneaksieDave]

Looking very good. Only concern so far is polygon count. That looks like one very round head!

 

Edit: Incidentally, how are the counts? If these are templates, I assume they'd be fairly low?

[Springheel]

Yes, it looks much improved with the arms shortened and the legs widened. A few other suggestions:

 

The cuffs on the boots are very large. They would look more appropriate for our style if they were almost half as long.

 

I don't know if that's the same head I commented about earlier, but it looks like it would poke through the helmet if the two models were standing right on the same line. Don't know if that's a size issue or height issue.

[New Horizon]

The anatomy looks much improved, but capturing the finer details of oDD's style is going to be harder.

[Domarius]

The anatomy looks much improved, but capturing the finer details of oDD's style is going to be harder.

If you help me out by pointing out the differences, I'll have a crack at it.

 

If you mean something as detailed as facial details, that's squawks area. I'll get these back to her, and at least she'll be able to start off with the correct proportions. I'd like to then see any average person who could split the finished models into two groups (oDDity's and squawks)

 

@Spring - hm, here's a close up of the head. The eyes & mouth are lined up, and everything seems to fit snugly inside the area of the helmet...

 

 

Here, his boot cuffs are shorter now, what do you think?

 

 

@SneaksieDave - The whole guy is 3413 triangles, including the head

[Springheel]

Yep, the boots look better. The head looks fine in the closeup, so maybe it was just the angle of the other shot. Could we see a comparsion shot (of the body) from the side?

 

Currently the pants look like they're painted on, is that intentional? I'm not exactly sure how much attention I should be paying to the clothing.

[New Horizon]

I'd like to then see any average person who could split the finished models into two groups (oDDity's and squawks)

 

 

The average gamer I wouldn't mind, but we're talking about Thief fans.

[Domarius]

Yep, the boots look better. The head looks fine in the closeup, so maybe it was just the angle of the other shot. Could we see a comparsion shot (of the body) from the side?

Sure, when I get home.

 

Currently the pants look like they're painted on, is that intentional? I'm not exactly sure how much attention I should be paying to the clothing.

It's not actual pants, it's "template clothing" . You'd tweak or swap them to be whatever pants you wanted them to be.

 

 

The average gamer I wouldn't mind, but we're talking about Thief fans.

Then I revise my statement, substituting "thief fans" for "average gamer". I bet, unless you worked on the mod and know oDDs models off by heart, if you're a new player, there wouldn't be any obvious differences.

 

Copying styles is not really that hard, compared to inventing them. All the time, our artists at Halfbrick are required to adopt the style of the cartoon the game is about, and all they do is have heaps of reference material from the show (ie. episodes), and some character sheets sent from the company. And you can't tell the difference between their work and the original cartoon.

 

From what I can see, oDDs style he developed for these models lays in the body and face proportions, and the rest is just his high-quality work. The former is dead easy to copy, the latter we already have with squawks abilities.

[Ishtvan]

The anatomy is looking better now IMO. I'm not sure how to best explain this, but he kind've looks like he has a "powerful build," like he does leg presses and benches every day. It's fine for a guard, but I'm not sure if that would suit a peasant character.

 

Also, I always appreciated the expressiveness of the face models and textures in Odd's characters. An arrogant priest looked arrogant, a downtrodden guard looked downtrodden, etc. I don't have a good feel for how much was the model and how much was the texture though, so it's hard to judge without a detailed face texture. (I saw one in the other thread but wasn't sure if it was WIP?)

[Domarius]

Well consider this the "heavy set" body peices. If someone wants to make a scrawny noble or peasent, then someone (Me?) needs to duplicate and tweak it into a new set of "scrawny" body peices. That's the point of all the parts being seperate. We can swap them around however we need them.

 

I think it's good that we have the heavy set peices first, because I assume most of the males in our game are heavy set - guards, thugs, etc.

 

Yes, the facial expressiveness was one of the defining characteristics of oDDity's style. This head (that she showed in the other thread) is a sort of strong but sad looking man. I'll be sure to mention it to squawks, and we'll see how she can capture such character in the exchangable heads she wants to make. I think that's one area we might have trouble matching exactly, but we'll see

[Domarius]

Could we see a comparsion shot (of the body) from the side?

...as you can see, there's a bit of work to be done Hehe. I have to get an early night tonight so I will have a crack at it tomorrow.

 

One defining characteristic is that oDDity's heads are proportionately much bigger than real life. Then there's the overall thickness of... everything (body, limbs...) and the exaggerated curve of the calves.

 

oDDity's style for this mod is a very short, squat character. I think it suits the game world with the narrow perspective - realisticaly sized people probably look very skinny and not as vibrant as this.

[Springheel]

I assume most of the males in our game are heavy set - guards, thugs, etc.

 

For the most part that's true. But we actually have pretty much all the guards we need for the time being (6 individual guard models). The models we're lacking are regular townsfolk types--shopkeepers, servants, etc.

 

One defining characteristic is that oDDity's heads are proportionately much bigger than real life. Then there's the overall thickness of... everything (body, limbs...) and the exaggerated curve of the calves.

 

Yes, the thickness translates very well in-game--makes the characters seem solid and the proportions believable after perspective distortion. I've never noticed a problem with the size of the heads. The curve of the calves is an Oddity trademark. I don't think it's necessary to go quite as far as he did but certainly more exaggerated than the template is currently so that there's a consistent look.

 

The biggest thing jumping out at me right now is that the feet will need to be thicker (taller).

[Domarius]

Yeah. I plan to do all those things. Though I agree the curve of the calves doesn't need to be exactly as much.

[Domarius]

Only spent about half an hour but I thought I better post a little update than nothing.

 

I just worked on the legs and boots. I think it's looking much more like oDDity's proportions... I can't wait to move on to the upper body.

[Domarius]

Okay I've reached that point where I've been looking at it too long and need other people to look at it. I tweaked the whole body this time, including the face;

[Domarius]

Here's a side by side comparison between squawks original template and my oDDity style one.

[SneaksieDave]

Is he to be a guard, or an 'average person template'? If the former, that'd be good for a fit brute for sure (though I'd be inclined to say he needs a lot more belly - not a fat slob perhaps, but not Schwarzenegger either). He can probably lift a car.

 

If he's meant as an average person... well, he can probably lift a car.

[Springheel]

Seems ok to me. He's based off a guard-type, but I assume he can be slimmed down if necessary. He does come across as bulkier than Odd's models, perhaps because he's as thick as they are but is wearing skin-tight clothing. It would be nice to see the model in-game to see what effect perspective might have...can it be exported as a .lwo?

[Domarius]

I'll slim him down a bit and then see about exporting it... don't know how smoothly that will go because I haven't done it yet

[Domarius]

Here he is, without so much steroids. What do you think now? The one in the middle is the new one. The one on the left is the last update that you said looks too bulky.

Here's a front orthographic view.

 

I'll see what I can do about exporting it tomorrow. I can't export directly to .LWO from 3DS. Any advice would be good. Was just going to export to .obj and use some general 3D converting app, like deep exploration or polytrans. Any suggestions?

[oDDity]

Yeah, you have to realise that some of my model are bulky because they are wearing a lot of layers of heavy clothing and armour.

Your guys look like bodybuilders, since they're only wearing a t-shirt.

This is one of the problems of having templates in the first place.

My models were all different shapes and sizes. I don't know if you remember that line up I did of about 10 or 12 of them, like 'the usual suspects' but it clearly showed that no two were alike.

Why can't you export from LW to 3ds? LW even has a 3ds exporter built in, though the Deep Ex one is probably better.

[SneaksieDave]

Well, I mostly meant the arms, which don't look to have changed (or much at least). The rest of the body was kind've stocky, yes, so this is definitely more toward average. But his arms are like football linebacker size. Like he's been doing tricep extensions with 200lbs and hammer curls for 7 years. From the looks of it, he's got 19-inch guns at least, which is pretty damn big.

[Domarius]

This is one of the problems of having templates in the first place.

My models were all different shapes and sizes. I don't know if you remember that line up I did of about 10 or 12 of them, like 'the usual suspects' but it clearly showed that no two were alike.

Yes well without your l33t skills, this is the next best solution I'm finding even now that I probably couldn't have come up with something as artistically good as this model I'm working on, but its damn easy to change the proportions, and we could more easily create a variety of different people that look like that lineup, now that we have a good foundation to squash and stretch.

Why can't you export from LW to 3ds? LW even has a 3ds exporter built in, though the Deep Ex one is probably better.

I should have been clearer. This model is in 3D Studio Max 9, and I can't export directly to LightWave format from there.

 

 

Well, I mostly meant the arms, which don't look to have changed (or much at least). The rest of the body was kind've stocky, yes, so this is definitely more toward average. But his arms are like football linebacker size. Like he's been doing tricep extensions with 200lbs and hammer curls for 7 years. From the looks of it, he's got 19-inch guns at least, which is pretty damn big.

 

I only made slight changes. Both feedback says he's still too big, so I'll shrink his torso and arms down again