Mystery Dev returns to TTLG.

[New Horizon]

Interesting thread at TTLG.

 

The Mystery Dev is back...this time releasing some old materials from the unfinished LGS game, Deep Cover.

 

http://ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1621710#post1621710

[Nyarlathotep]

MysteryDev to the rescue!

[demagogue]

Technically speaking, Digi said it's not the same MysteryDev that released some of the other stuff we've seen ... so MysteryDev #2, but all the same cool news. Maybe this is a mod project I'd like to work on.

[Maximius]

Would these assets be of use to the Mod, would they not be outdated?

[New Horizon]

Would these assets be of use to the Mod, would they not be outdated?

 

Lord no, we couldn't use them....they're no better than T2 assets really...and it would be illegal.

[Maximius]

Lord no, we couldn't use them....they're no better than T2 assets really...and it would be illegal.

 

Oh I thought they were being released for general consumption.

[demagogue]

We can probably get away with using them for T2 mods.

I think that was the general expectation when MD gave them to Digi, and why Digi waited to see what happened to the T2G stuff after it was released.

It's better karma because at least with T2 there is a license to use LGS stuff, and dromed is its home engine, and it can still honor the spirit of LGS, which is really why this stuff got out. It wouldn't be good karma to use them on another, unrelated engine.

 

What I mean is that these kinds of happenings are in the realm of good faith and karma ... they do us a gratuitous favor that's not entirely proper but they'll go out on a limb for us because we're "good people" and they trust us, so we match that by staying in good faith in using them, and part of that is knowing the line between meeting expectations vs flaunting their going out on a limb for us ... using it in dromed is expected, using it elsewhere would be disrespecting the spirit of what they did.

 

Honestly speaking, though, if you look into it, most all of the objects and textures are actually a mix of Thief 2 and SS2 objects as placeholders, or low-quality, thrown-together or obvious-derivative stand-ins, and the architecture is just dromed brushwork. So there's really nothing that's actually new or good here worth using.

 

When I mentioned a mod project above, I was thinking about finishing the maps of the actual original game as it might have developed (minus the professional part) in T2dromed, similarly to the T2G project. That's the kind of thing I'm thinking was the primary expectation they had in getting this stuff released. It's not really good for much anything else, unless you want a bad palm tree or boxy car model.

Edited August 4, 2007 by demagogue

[Maximius]

This makes sense. For my own part, I gave away my Thief 2 disks, as much as I love them if I were install one right now and started watching those AI do they "circle search pattern with sword arm extended even if you dont carry a sword" I would shut the thing down. Too burnt out on the way things work, too predictable, even with New Horizons difficulty improvements and all that. It got way too easy to break the maps, pitting AI against one another to empty rooms, trapping/drowning AI, blocking them with objects, whatever. I never even used the Nudge, never needed to.

Edited August 4, 2007 by Maximius

[demagogue]

You have to give yourself your own discipline to play it with a challenge ... like ghosting or, my growing appreciation, parkour style where you're really running through it as fast and efficiently as possible, with more emphasis on speed sneaking, or if you get guards running after you, fast evasion.

Edited August 4, 2007 by demagogue

[Nyarlathotep]

I like the sound of doing it Le Parkour style. I have to admit, I have a habit of incorporating speed run techniques into my normal play already. Tell me more about how I can become a traceur in Thief...

[Macsen]

Hmmm... is it some kind of modern version of Thief?

[demagogue]

@Macsen, in a nutshell, Deep Cover is about a 1960s Cold War era tuxedo spy, and yes the emphasis was going to be on Thief style sneaking in a modern setting ... Bay of Pigs, downtown Havana, Castro's villa, a dinner meeting, escaping the Gulag, a Russian ship, and a few others.

 

@Nyarlathotep, honestly the idea just occurred to me. I love watching those traceur videos on YouTube, and all the time it occurs to me that that would be an fun way to play Thief. I esp like that, if you read the stuff when the serious traceurs talk about it, it has an ethos to it ... efficiency, balance, being very much in touch with the environment around you. It sort of fits the Thief world (and my own personal ethos).

 

...................................

 

Ok, complete OT tangent: As far as an actual playing style ... first, I don't think there's been an effort at developing a new playing style since like 2000, so it's sort of fun to even have the audacity to claim to be developing one. I suppose the most important thing would be to distinguish it from just a mere speed run. The thing I notice about parkour is that it's as much an art as a science. Ghosting is like a science. There are very clear rules you know when you've broken them. Parkour is about being creative and quick on your feet about negotiating whatever the situation is ... so too many rules sort of defeat the purpose.

 

What separates it from a mere speed run, I'd think ... Speed runs to me, while they are "fast", look clumsy. You are running diagonally and hopping and have advance knowledge. And it's about honing the same carefully pre-planned moves after dozens of trials where you're doing the same thing mechanically over and over. With parkour, you should be thinking on your feet, you should stay in motion and not be stopping for too long, you should still be trying to "properly" sneak, and not be seen if you can, but quickly, efficiently. With a speed run, you run by the guards it doesn't matter. With parkour style, you should stick to the shadows and not be seen unless it wastes a lot of time, but even if you go in a way you'll be seen, you should be doing it efficiently, in a way that best covers yourself. I'd think it's okay if a guard sees you, it should not be a break like ghosting. But you should run around them so they don't see you if you can. Or you need to efficiently evade them if you are caught until they are definitively no longer on your tail, so in that sense it's not like a speed run where the objectives are all that matters. I'd think it should be Ironman in that you shouldn't reload either; quickly resolve the mistakes you make.

 

Maybe, to try to crystallize the idea, and to keep its rule-less ethos, it's close to a speed run, but you get points for style. If it's clumsy or mechanical looking, or you are deliberately ignoring the guards in the interest of pure speed, it doesn't count (for much). When another person watches it, they should see it. You can have guards on alert and running after you, but they can never catch you or lay a weapon on you. But you should not put a guard on alert if it's at all possible to efficiently pass him.

 

Now I'm going to try all of these ideas out in some OMs & FMs and try to work out how the style works. Then I'll boldly post on ThiefGen that I've developed the first new playing style in seven years and be showered with accolades as it sweeps the Thief-fan world by storm. Well, maybe not that last part...

 

I think, to the extent this style might be fun, it would be to fraps your run and post it on YouTube, and then ask people to rate you on your style and efficiency in doing the run.

Edited August 5, 2007 by demagogue

[Nyarlathotep]

I'm going to have to try it out.