Dark Mod Pre-Beta Download links and discussion.

[Springheel]

I believe the entire problem arises from the fact that in T1/2/3 you by default run, and only hold modifier to walk or creep. In TDM you walk by default and use modifier to run.

 

Huh?? Since when did you run by default in T1/2? Running by default was (as far as I know) a new, and highly criticized, TDS decision--what kind of stealth game defaults to running?

[Ishtvan]

The object handling is quite TES: Oblivion-ish, but with more control thanks to that there object rotation.

Rearranging the furniture of nobles' houses will be fun!

Glad you like it! Just keep objects away from doors and elevators if you don't want to be terribly disapponted. We still have to implement some physics on those things. Until recently, we actually thought vanilla D3 physics could handle things like doors and elevators pushing objects, but nope.

[New Horizon]

Huh?? Since when did you run by default in T1/2? Running by default was (as far as I know) a new, and highly criticized, TDS decision--what kind of stealth game defaults to running?

 

I think Dark Project defaulted to run on W, walk on S, and walk backwards on X.

Pretty sure Thief 2 defaulted to walk with the W key. Might be wrong about that though.

[Komag]

Now that you mention it I'm not so confident anymore, it's been quite a long time since I changed binds for those games...

[ffox]

My TDP default.bnd and TMA dark.bnd both have:

 

bind shift +creepon

bind alt +slideon

 

bind w +walkfast

bind keypad_up +walkfast

bind up +walkfast

 

bind s +forward

bind keypad_center +forward

 

bind x +backfast

bind keypad_down +backfast

bind down +backfast

 

Interestingly there is no walking pace "back"!

[lowenz]

A little thing about the object handling: imho the maximum distance i can reach with the mouse wheel is toooo high for a "human" arm

[Tels]

Interestingly there is no walking pace "back"!

 

Ooh, finally a new bug We have overlooked that you shouldn't be able to run backwards

 

(No someone will probably point out it is already handle

[Ishtvan]

Actually I think leaving in the ability to run backwards was a design decision, not an omission. I would have to review the design thread, but this is what I vaguely remember: Some "ultra realistic" games remove the ability to run backwards at sprint speed. However, in a game that will eventually feature melee combat, this would be quite an oversight. While it's true that you can't sprint backwards in reality, you can execute rapid backwards manuevers in melee combat, such as hopping back, fencing retreat, etc. We obviously can't model all these advanced manuevers or the controls would be unmanagable, so they are well represented by a backwards sprint. Ideally we wouldn't let you do it for prolonged periods of time, though.

 

If you don't believe me, watch a fencing match and watch how fast they can retreat or "parry with distance", especially with one backwards hop (in Saber they do it a lot). It's pretty damn fast. Removing the sprint backwards ability would remove the parry with distance tactic, which is a perfectly valid option. Most game AI are too stupid to deal with that tactic and just stand there swinging at nothing, but we hope to give our AI the ability to swing as they move forward after a retreating player, so that parry with distance isn't necessarily a sure-fire way to beat them.

[Dziarsky]

Oh and i have something about map.

Outside it is posible to climb on the wall near the corner.

Author rather want to use rope and way using roof but its posible to change his plans .

[Tels]

Oh and i have something about map.

Outside it is posible to climb on the wall near the corner.

Author rather want to use rope and way using roof but its posible to change his plans .

 

No, this is a feature You don't have to use the rope.

[Tels]

Actually I think leaving in the ability to run backwards was a design decision, not an omission.

 

See, I told ya, somebody would come and declare it a feature

 

I go now and do some work instead of discussing things

[mangrove]

Huh?? Since when did you run by default in T1/2? Running by default was (as far as I know) a new, and highly criticized, TDS decision--what kind of stealth game defaults to running?

 

Yeah the default t2 is walk. I always change it to run by default as that is what you spend most of the time doing. Then I just hold right mouse + run to walk. I never had a creep bind as you could always sneak up just fine walk mode. If creep would have made you inaudible on tile/metal floors it might have been worthwhile, but it didn't, so it was fairly pointless

 

I must admit the movement does seem a little slow, even if it is t2 matched. It would feel better a little faster I think.

[Dziarsky]

I always change it to run by default as that is what you spend most of the time doing. Then I just hold right mouse + run to walk. I never had a creep bind as you could always sneak up just fine walk mode.

Me too. But in TDS i bind creep, not walk to right mouse button.

[Norsu]

Here's what I wrote to TTLG forum thread:

 

Just gave it a spin and my short good/bad things list (bugs ignored)

 

Goodies:

 

-Most models & textures are very nice

-Player control is mostly smooth

-Mantling

-Interacting with objects is accurate (e.g. you can drop something quietly)

-Challenging AI

-Thief athmosphere is spot on

 

Bad things:

 

-Movement speed is too slow or it's missing proper head bob, it feels like the player is walking in tar (Thief 2 had it just right IMO)

-Sometimes it feels like the controls are lagging, e.g I press forward but the player doesn't move immediately. In reality player is moving immediately but the slow movement speed just make it feel not right

-Bowsight is missing (you could make it optional for those who want challenge)

-You might increase frob distance a bit, I managed to drop the objective letter behind the chest and couldn't pick it up anymore (certainly not a too long distance for a good thief)

-Some world textures are out of place (too modern or too 2d compared to rest)

 

All in all this little demo left me want MORE and MORE.

 

And here's more regarding the player speed & head bob:

 

I see, then it's probably just the different head bobbing what makes it feel odd for me. It's not bad really, just feels a bit too robotic or something. Like the player is moving on a fixed track.

 

After further testing I found out why it feels so for me. There's very little or no straight vertical head bobbing at all. Thief 2 had quite a lot of that, in fact sometimes you had to count on it to fit through narrow spaces. I would try to reduce the current spinning head bobbing a bit and add more vertical bobbing. Hard to explain but I hope you understand what I mean. However the current way is lightyears further than the overdone body awareness of TDS, the biggest flaw in that game for me.

 

I tried various cvar settings for pm_bobpitch, pm_bobroll, pm_bobup, pm_crouchbob and pm_runbob but the biggest problem was the bobbing speed. I don't know if you can change it, but it would work great if it were more subtle and not so sharp. Bobbing speed concerns mainly vertical bob.

[lanael]

A little thing about the object handling: imho the maximum distance i can reach with the mouse wheel is toooo high for a "human" arm

 

You fool, this is the "Mr. Gibbons" (© Looking Glass) effect !!

[oDDity]

You don't need the bow sight in this game. Really, try it for a while without it, you'll see it's quite easy to aim. You only want it because you're used to it from the Thief games.

[Tels]

You don't need the bow sight in this game. Really, try it for a while without it, you'll see it's quite easy to aim. You only want it because you're used to it from the Thief games.

 

I'd still like to have the bowsight, thank you very much.

 

(I'd also like to add that the time until the zoom kicks in could be reduced. I constantly find myself waiting for it to finally start to zoom in. Maybe I grown more impatient over the years...

[oDDity]

If you weren't a useless twat, you wouldn't need an aiming sight OR zoom.

Try using skill.

Next thing you'll want auto-aim like in console shooters.

[New Horizon]

If you weren't a useless twat, you wouldn't need an aiming sight OR zoom.

Try using skill.

Next thing you'll want auto-aim like in console shooters.

 

u sew maskulin, I lub u

[Tels]

If you weren't a useless twat, you wouldn't need an aiming sight OR zoom.

Try using skill.

Next thing you'll want auto-aim like in console shooters.

 

You just entered my personal ignore list. Welcome.

[lanael]

I played the map 5 times, playing with everything; and... wow ! Excellent work !

 

Mantling is perfect, the spyglass is great, object manipulation is excellent, etc...

 

I read the "known bugs" page, and I noticed one graphical glitch which is not mentionned involving the water shader and the torche : the water is visually in-front of the torche's flame.

But I'm sure you already know that.

 

Knowing it's an alpha, I have nothing more to say beside I'm eager to play more maps.

It's a great feeling to know that we will be able to play a modern Thief in the near future !

 

Congratulations to Broken Glass !

[oDDity]

You just entered my personal ignore list. Welcome.

Heh, you can't put fellow team members on an ignore list you fool, this isn't a forum where nerds and autistics come to talk shit like TTLG, we're trying to get a job done here.

Grow up.

[peispud]

I really enjoyed playing this on my Linux box . The audio , artwork , and general look and feel were spot on . I turned all my settings up to max and it still played smooth as silk . I realize the short sword is being worked on , but prefer using the blackjack or broadheads anyways . This is Thief the way Thief is meant to be , I'd gladly trade my copy of TDS for the Dark Mod and pay twice the price I paid for the former . Excellent work guys .

[SneaksieDave]

Excellent! Linux feedback. Thanks.

[New Horizon]

Thanks peispud, what part of PEI are you from? I'm in Charlottetown.