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I got the "MAX_REACH_PER_AREA" error - how to check?


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Lately I've been trying to put AIs in different parts of my map and I keep getting this error "MAX_REACH_PER_AREA". I've researched it and read that it's due to AI pathfinding getting too complex. I've read that I need to break up the areas more with more portals and stuff, and/or add a bunch of monsterclip around areas to simplify the pathfinding.

 

I haven't tried any monsterclip yet at all, so I don't know how that works yet, but I have been cutting off areas and adding more portals, and this has worked somewhat in some areas. But right now I have an area that looks pretty dang simple to me and when I add a guard there it gives the error and I can't see why. Is there some thing I can turn on in game mode to see the pathfinding connections or whatever, so I can actually see for myself where it's getting hung up? Something like r_showtris, like r_showaipath or something?

 

There are a couple patch cylinders there for large pillars, so I'm guessing maybe I need to monsterclip them, but I'd still like to know for sure (because two pillars oughtn't mess up the pathfinding so easily)

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Maybe you can use ai_debugMove or aas_showAreas? You can also try to bind something to _impulse27.

 

The current value for MAX_REACH_PER_AREA is 256 already, so I assume you are doing something crazy with this map again?

 

Btw, that's not DarkRadiant-related. ;)

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Thanks, I'll try those (already tried the _impulse27, got some odd partial results...)

 

Hmm, yeah I guess it's not DR, sometimes I don't think hard enough to recognize the separation!

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I had another problem with AAS once, doom sometimes crashed during the AAS part of compiling the bonehoard without giving an error message. It turned out that the stones in the shallow pool in the entrance hall of the bonehoard were the cause. I had cut out some complex shapes, and it seems they were too complex for pathfinding. I converted the stones to func_static and added some monster_clip brushes (some blocks roughly the same shape will do, normally) and the problem was gone.

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Monster-clipping is absolutely necessary for any finished map that has AI. Good clipping prevents path-finding errors such as monsters falling off ledges, refusing to walk over patch/model bridges, trying to walk over hand-rails, getting stuck in corners, etc. As an added bonus it even improves path-finding efficiency. The id dev site describes it in detail.

 

In particular, notice how much more simplified the world looks to monsters on a well clipped map: (images taken from id dev site)

 

post-244-1204259967_thumb.jpg post-244-1204259971_thumb.jpg

 

Clipping the level for the player is also generally a good idea, though it's most commonly done in multiplayer maps. Player-clipping helps prevent the player from getting stuck on level geometry; it's useful to prevent the player from getting stuck behind couches or from getting caught on bricks that slightly protrude from the wall.

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I've looked at pretty much ALL the maps we've made and no one is monster clipping like that! Holy crap, it's like you remake the entire map in a super simplified version!

 

Well, maybe that would solve my problem, but it sorta sucks that we would always have to do it so much

 

By the way, I don't really understand what's going on with "_impulse27". Why do tops of buildings and walls have pathfinding on them? Is that really what it is?

 

aipath1.jpg

 

aipath2.jpg

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I've looked at pretty much ALL the maps we've made and no one is monster clipping like that!
Yeah, it seems like nobody ever bothers to read id's level-editing documentation. :( It drives me nuts whenever our mappers make levels with broken AAS then blame the weird AI pathing behavior on the engine.

 

Holy crap, it's like you remake the entire map in a super simplified version!
Yep... a simpler version that uses less CPU and that the player/AI are less likely to get stuck on. :) Fortunately, it goes much quicker than making the visual components of a level. You primarily just have to clip around complicated bits or around models/patches. Good places to clip would be around handrails or piles of junk.

 

By the way, I don't really understand what's going on with "_impulse27". Why do tops of buildings and walls have pathfinding on them? Is that really what it is?
To be perfectly honest, I don't have experience with _impulse27, but I wouldn't expect it to generate AAS on roofs, unless it manages to find a path from a monster starting position up to the roofs.
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Yeah, it seems like nobody ever bothers to read id's level-editing documentation. :( It drives me nuts whenever our mappers make levels with broken AAS then blame the weird AI pathing behavior on the engine.

Maybe because this stuff is frickin' hidden in the Quake4 devnet site? I hadn't seen this one document either, mainly because I didn't look into the Quake4 documentation (we're modding Doom3, not Quake4, right?). I figured that Quake4 stuff doesn't necessarily apply to Doom3, but obviously this isn't true in this case - it would have been nice if the id people could've been bothered to place a link from the D3 devnet site to the Quake4 AAS article.

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I'm kindof suprised to hear you haven't monster clipped at all Komag. I guess I just saw mention of it somewhere early on and I started using it right away (not that I have anything with alot of AI yet). But anytime I've added anything that an AI doesn't need to path I add clip.

 

Add a cart, add clip, done.

 

Add a boiler, add clip, done.

 

It's really quite easy.

 

That was the only way I could get them to path my spiral stair objects too.

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Well, maybe that would solve my problem, but it sorta sucks that we would always have to do it so much

 

You can also add monster clip to a model in the model viewer by clicking on the advanced button and putting a checkmark in add monster clip. Hmmm, could we put an 'add player clip' box in there too?

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