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kshatriya

kshatriya - Compositions, suggestions and questions

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By advice from a team member I'll make this thread were I upload my contributions, for evaluation by the others. I'm not egocentric, I just think it's convenient to organize all my works, suggestions and questions in one thread.

 

I might begin with some questions and suggestions:

 

1. What do you guys think of having a musical score that's recurring throughout the game, in various variations? Like in the intro, and then vaguely in some parts of the game, and then more fullblown towards the end? It has been done successfully in games like Metal Gear Solid, and in movies like Last of the Mohicans. It can really build up a nice feeling.

 

2. Are there any specific missions/places I should do music for, or am I free to make whatever I like? I thought it would be better if I have knowledge of the different areas in the game, so that I can make music specifically suited for those parts of the game.

Like, you tell me you need ambient music for a monastery, and then I make something that sounds like a monastery ambience.

 

3. Any music for combat needed?

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The problem with an ongoing theme is that this works well for a contuniung game. Currently this is not the case, because we are only creating the tools at the moment. So our current set of missions is not connected in any way and is more a random collection of what we need for the development phase.


Gerhard

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2. Are there any specific missions/places I should do music for, or am I free to make whatever I like? I thought it would be better if I have knowledge of the different areas in the game, so that I can make music specifically suited for those parts of the game.

Like, you tell me you need ambient music for a monastery, and then I make something that sounds like a monastery ambience.

If you like you can have a look at the bonehoard map, which is in SVN. We already have a few ambients in there, but we wanted to remove the more intense ones and replace them with more sublte ones. Some moody sounds would be ok - it doesn't even need to be a full musical score, just a few reoccurring "musical" effects would be nice, fitting into a grand scheme so that they are interchangeable. Don't know if that's your thing, but if angua and me like, it has a good chance of getting in. :)

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The problem with an ongoing theme is that this works well for a contuniung game. Currently this is not the case, because we are only creating the tools at the moment. So our current set of missions is not connected in any way and is more a random collection of what we need for the development phase.

 

I understand. I thought you were working parallell with the game, which on second thought is not a very good idea when the tools are not finished.

 

But, are there any plans of using the current missions or are they just temporary?

 

If you like you can have a look at the bonehoard map, which is in SVN. We already have a few ambients in there, but we wanted to remove the more intense ones and replace them with more sublte ones. Some moody sounds would be ok - it doesn't even need to be a full musical score, just a few reoccurring "musical" effects would be nice, fitting into a grand scheme so that they are interchangeable. Don't know if that's your thing, but if angua and me like, it has a good chance of getting in.

 

Bonehoard sounds interesting, since it's so desolate, mysterious and creepy it should be a good place for moody ambience.

I guess you want one consistent track that you can sample different parts from, but that in a whole also is usable?

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But, are there any plans of using the current missions or are they just temporary?

 

That's undecided. They are not temproaray, they are just to be released as single maps, not as a campaign. Might be that we decide later to make a campaign out of it though.


Gerhard

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That's undecided. They are not temproaray, they are just to be released as single maps, not as a campaign. Might be that we decide later to make a campaign out of it though.

 

Ahh I understand. It's not 100% that it will be a campaign at all? Just separate missions?

I thought there was some T2X-like campaign in the making...

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I guess you want one consistent track that you can sample different parts from, but that in a whole also is usable?

I'm not sure. I envisioned two or three very subtle "baseline" soundtracks (two or three minutes, looping), each fitting the various parts of the map (there is a desolated industrial area with an attached graveyard at the start, then there are the caves/outer catacombs and then there are the "old" core crypts).

 

On top of that baseline, I would like to have many smaller samples, which are loosely repeating and which can be swapped over time. This can be a small melody, or just a distant percussion sound or a deep "thump" sound which is played once in a minute, or some faint ghosty whispering, or bells which are sounding from far away. Do you get what I'm trying to explain? I'm not an educated sound guy myself, so my words are a bit amateurish.

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I thought there was some T2X-like campaign in the making...

 

The FAQ mentions working on a campaign "once the toolset is done". After many years, however, I'm not sure how many team-members will have the stamina to stay on for something like that. Especially since "done" is hard to define.

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I'm not sure. I envisioned two or three very subtle "baseline" soundtracks (two or three minutes, looping), each fitting the various parts of the map (there is a desolated industrial area with an attached graveyard at the start, then there are the caves/outer catacombs and then there are the "old" core crypts).

 

On top of that baseline, I would like to have many smaller samples, which are loosely repeating and which can be swapped over time. This can be a small melody, or just a distant percussion sound or a deep "thump" sound which is played once in a minute, or some faint ghosty whispering, or bells which are sounding from far away. Do you get what I'm trying to explain? I'm not an educated sound guy myself, so my words are a bit amateurish.

 

Don't worry, I'm not educated myself. Not in music anyway.

 

What I am unclear about is just if you want the other smaller samples to be merged with the track, or if you want them separately so you can add them over the baseline at will?

 

I'm asking this mainly because the baseline can't be too intricate if you intend to copy and reuse some sections of the track, instead of using separate samples.

 

The FAQ mentions working on a campaign "once the toolset is done". After many years, however, I'm not sure how many team-members will have the stamina to stay on for something like that. Especially since "done" is hard to define.

 

Okay.

The toolset and some missions to go with that is great nonetheless.

 

Maybe some other modders will make a campaign someday.

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What I am unclear about is just if you want the other smaller samples to be merged with the track, or if you want them separately so you can add them over the baseline at will?

I think what he's looking for (he'll clarify if I'm wrong) is the latter. So, essentially, create a couple looping soundscapes (a bass line with some low-level howling or breathy noises, for instance -- nothing that has any kind of discernible tempo) and accompanying hits as separate files. These hits can be used for cues triggered by the engine on top of the soundscapes and for lead-ins for transitions between the soundscapes.

 

Check out the intro to mrDischarged's "Cathedral", the intro to his "Grand Piano" and drewb's "Devigniti" from the OST for some ideas for hits. Just single notes, chords or short percussive elements. These could be stereo or mono.

 

One small note: Don't go too crazy with panning for the bass line. In fact, anything below about 100 Hz should be kept pretty much dead center. For those with 2.1 or 5.1 systems, most of the bass content will be crossed over to the subwoofer anyway. For users with headphones, too much panning of the sub-bass can be annoying. Just something I want to emphasize given some of the work I've been doing today :)

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What I am unclear about is just if you want the other smaller samples to be merged with the track, or if you want them separately so you can add them over the baseline at will?

 

I'm asking this mainly because the baseline can't be too intricate if you intend to copy and reuse some sections of the track, instead of using separate samples.

The latter, I'd think having modular sound pieces might be a good thing, but then again, if it's a major pain to create for you, feel free to come up with something else. :)

 

I'd actually like the baseline to be rather simple and not too intrusive, it should stay well in the background, delivering the base mood. Then spice that up with samples...

 

... but thinking about this more, I guess that's not very easy to do, because it's probably too hard to synchronise the rhythm of the baseline and the samples. So I'd be inclined to screw this idea and just let you come up with whatever you feel like. If it fits the mood, and angua and me like it, we have a winner. :)

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... but thinking about this more, I guess that's not very easy to do, because it's probably too hard to synchronise the rhythm of the baseline and the samples. So I'd be inclined to screw this idea and just let you come up with whatever you feel like. If it fits the mood, and angua and me like it, we have a winner. :)

 

For me, it doesn't matter. I can make separate samples, or I can merge them in the track. Since it would be easier for you to pick whatever you like from samples, I'll go for that. I'll just avoid a rhythmic baseline, as phide suggests.

 

Please note that I can't produce any real ambient sounds by recording. All I've got is Reason, midi keyboard and a guitar. Reason has a wide variety of nice pads for environmental vibes anyway.

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Please note that I can't produce any real ambient sounds by recording. All I've got is Reason, midi keyboard and a guitar. Reason has a wide variety of nice pads for environmental vibes anyway.

 

That's ok, we usually keep environmental ambience (anything that could have a physical source, like crickets chirping) and musical ambience seperated anyways. You can of course use samples, as long as they are free for use.

 

If you haven't already, you may want to check the Master Plan for technical and logistic information. It's a good idea to make musical ambients loopable, since the fade-in/fade-out can be done by the game engine.

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Samples from Reason should be free of use, they are part of the program.

My copy of Reason is not obtained through the regular channels though, so to speak, is that going to be an eventual problem?

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It may be an eventual problem for you, yes, though surely the odds are practically nill. Reason's only 400 bucks (or roughly 1.8 billion Euros), so I don't quite understand why you'd need to get it illegally, but whatever.

 

I can't find Reason's licensing agreement or terms of use. Odds are you have a PDF or something that you'd be able to reference for this kind of information. 99% probability this isn't an issue.

 

Propellerhead's a fine company that produces fine products worthy of the suggested retail prices. Consider going legit on this one.

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Well, I was thinking more about if any copyright complications might occur, for me or the DarkMod crew, when there is music that comes with the DarkMod not made with a legit Reason. If the release can attract any "heat", more specifically. I'm not wondering if it is within the law or not, those things I already know.

 

Just wanted to see if you guys have a policy concerning this kind of software.

 

I should add that I am using it now mainly as trial, if I continue to use it I will buy it. There is also the issue with money, which I don't have in abundance exactly at the moment. I already have a retail Cubase copy, so I'm not a cheap pirating person.

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Any samples should be royalty free to be able to be used in the DarkMOD. Reason samples are generally royalty free, especially if they are instrument samples, because you have paid for the licensing to use the technology - just like you can't charge royalties for the sound of a Fender Stratocaster or a Moog synthesizer.

 

Specific SFX are a different story, though. Sound libraries must be licensed or released as royalty free.

 

(Saxmeister drops by to say, "Hi," to all!)


"Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid."- Frank Zappa

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Thanks, that answers what I was thinking about.

 

In case anyone has wondered about my absence, it is mainly because I sold my old computer and have bought a laptop instead. I still need to get an external sound card, and that will probably happen sometime this autumn.

 

I am still interested in this project.

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Thanks, that answers what I was thinking about.

 

In case anyone has wondered about my absence, it is mainly because I sold my old computer and have bought a laptop instead. I still need to get an external sound card, and that will probably happen sometime this autumn.

 

I am still interested in this project.

 

Np....i have video tutorial for reason 3 and 4 "ASKVideo" if you want it just tell me and i'll drop RS.links by Pm to you.

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