Jump to content
The Dark Mod Forums

Recommended Posts

I'm goofing around here, looking up crap, seeing what I can do, when I come across a the old parallax map mod over on some site way far away. I think it might be something worth checking out, so I install it and start doing some heightmaps.

 

Things came out pretty well.

 

Now I think I remember us talking about this way back in the day, when our computers were nothing more than glorified calculators, and the thought of implementing something so cutting edge was a little scary. Nowadays though, parallax maps are commonplace. Even the budget line graphics cards can push them and still maintain more than bare minimum playable framerates.

 

So are you all using them? Should I go ahead and make a parallax map for every texture? Or should I just stick to the normals?

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 75
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

From what i've seen in the UDK and read, the "Virtual Displacement Mapping" in the UE3 Engine is just standard Parallax Mapping, not even POM - and few materials actually use it.

That probably is all triangles, altho not sure if he also uses parallax in some materials.   The textures are generally very high res in those pictures.   UE3 is built to support lots and lots of Stat

Yo Renz! How's it going man? Have not seen you here in ages, about two years!

 

How is everything going man?

 

 

As for parallax maps, we are not supporting them by default, though converting the normals into heightmaps should theoretically not be too difficult. The parallax mapping mod is just essentially a plugin so anyone can just paste it into their Darkmod folder and use it. However, with Rebb's new uber ambient shader (which changes interaction.vfp, as does the parallax mod) there is a conflict due to using the same file. I guess one could theoretically merge them together for great visual quality, but we'd need permission from the author of the parallax mapping mod.

Link to post
Share on other sites
I guess one could theoretically merge them together for great visual quality, but we'd need permission from the author of the parallax mapping mod.

And poor Rebb would tear out what little hair he has left over even more graphics card compatibility issues. :laugh:

 

I'm not against parallax mapping in principle provided:

 

1. It's provided as an option and set to off by default, to minimize the impact of the inevitable graphics card compatibility issues. (And it should come with a big red compatibility warning.)

 

2. It doesn't make any extra work for texture artists and Rebb's ambient-light-fixing effort.

 

3. The person implementing the combined shader (probably Rebb if he's willing, since he's our "shader guy" :) ) isn't drawn away from more important work to implement this.

My games | Public Service Announcement: TDM is not set in the Thief universe. The city in which it takes place is not the City from Thief. The player character is not called Garrett. Any person who contradicts these facts will be subjected to disapproving stares.
Link to post
Share on other sites

Just stick to normals for now. We have to remember that our target audience is the Thief community. So far, we already have a necessary performance hit with Rebb's ambient fix to make ambients display properly...we're able to side step that hit for older computer by using the 'ambient texture' method that we implemented, so that brings the performance back up for target systems. It's a performance hit we can't really afford to toss out there, and I think it's also a matter of attainability for users too. If we were to add parallax maps to the mod, just how much larger would the download be? It's at several gigs already. :) We've just gotten the optimizations to a point where I can actually run the mod on an FX 5200 equal to how TDS ran on my system...and even a little better. I don't think we would be wise to start adding more performance demanding features right now.

 

Also, we're in feature freeze now...so unless something is absolutely necessary in fixing an issue, we won't add it.

Link to post
Share on other sites
So far, we already have a necessary performance hit with Rebb's ambient fix to make ambients display properly...we're able to side step that hit for older computer by using the 'ambient texture' method that we implemented

Was this ambient fix used in Thief's Den? Can we read somwhere about it? Right now there are two possible methods of using ambient light? Sorry if I got it all wrong. :blink:

Cartographer's Note FM: in production.

Download Old Comrades, Old Debts FM or Mistrz Effects demo and see my old projects!

Link to post
Share on other sites
Was this ambient fix used in Thief's Den? Can we read somwhere about it? Right now there are two possible methods of using ambient light? Sorry if I got it all wrong. :blink:

No, this was introduced after releasing Thief's Den. There is a short abstract here: http://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php/..._Light_Textures and here: http://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php/Virtual_Darkness

 

However, this needs code support to function correctly, so the PK4 released with Thief's Den won't cut it.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Was this ambient fix used in Thief's Den? Can we read somwhere about it? Right now there are two possible methods of using ambient light? Sorry if I got it all wrong. :blink:

 

Rebb's ambient fix is separate from the texture ambient method.

 

What rebb's ambient fix does, is correct the messed up Doom 3 ambient shading. Traditional ambient light doesn't have shading since it's non-directional, but the D3 engine messed this up by applying an angled shadow to all the textures touched by an ambient light.

 

It's not possible for Rebb to remove this shading since the interaction.vfp is used for all lights, and we would need access to the renderer to change this, so he has been trying to find a way to correct the depth shading on ambient lights. Since D3 uses a unified interaction.vfp, this causes Rebb's extra calculations to be performed on ALL lights in a scene, not just ambient. That causes a pretty heavy hit on older cards. Think of Rebb's ambient as an 'advanced' form of ambient lighting as it simulates depth, even though the light is non-directional. If we could separate ambients from the interaction.vfp, I doubt there would be much of a performance hit.

 

The texture ambient lighting is a performance saver and is also the closest we can get to traditional ambient lighting performance.

 

There are really 3 performance options.

 

1. Rebb's ambient - Slowest, but much better quality.

2. Texture ambient, but still using rebb's interaction.vfp - slightly faster, but still performing extra calculations.

3. Texture ambient using D3's original interaction.vfp - fastest

Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks for the reply, NH!

 

Is Rebb's ambient avaible for Den's resources users?

 

We'll probably make it fully available, when/if we get most of the issues hammered out of it. ATI cards have been absolutely terrible to work with. Every change Rebb has made works on my Nvidia card, but if we get it working on one ATI card...it seems to break another. Very annoying.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Speaking of graphic cards...

 

I probably shouldn't start separate thread about this, so I'll ask here:

 

I have some problems with AIs' shadows. It seems these shadows are cut off at the height of knees and neck (bottom and upper part of the body seems to be 'invisible'). Have you encountered such bug? I use GeForce 9800. I haven't seen anything like that while playing Doom 3.

Edited by Bukary

Cartographer's Note FM: in production.

Download Old Comrades, Old Debts FM or Mistrz Effects demo and see my old projects!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, AI having their shadows cut off does seem to happen from time to time. We haven't nailed down exactly why yet.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I really love well done parallax, I strongly look forward to having this in future Dark Mod iterations and FMs! :D (and that first wall pic looks amazing!)

shadowdark50.gif keep50.gif
Link to post
Share on other sites
lol - Renzatic, I like how you think you can just re-appear out of nowhere after 2 years and start posting as if nothing happened. :D Good to see you back, seriously. We still need help.

 

Well we did know what happened to him, as was explained in the member's lounge by NH.

 

Did you expect an apology or something Dom? Come now, seriously. ;)

Link to post
Share on other sites
lol - Renzatic, I like how you think you can just re-appear out of nowhere after 2 years and start posting as if nothing happened. :D Good to see you back, seriously. We still need help.

 

First off...DRAM!

 

Secondly, I'll stand by my opinion that I thought NH would think the dirty noodles were funny. I guess he didn't, cuz of all the drama that ensued, and I guess he's never forgiven me, cuz he won't respond to my private messages. I can't say sorry any more than I already have. :(

 

Thirdly (and this is the serious one), I'm still gone for the same reasons I left oh so long ago. I still need to improve a bit more, and I don't have all the time I used to back in the day...as you can tell by the amount of time it's taken me to reply to my own thread here.

 

At least the improvement thing is going good. It actually makes me wish I didn't just drop everything, textures, modeling, mapping, and all, after bailing on the mod. If I spent those two years honing my skills instead of waiting to pick it up again only recently, I'd be...well...considerably better. But hey, better late than never, I guess.

 

Anyway, I am around. And doing stuff. Slowly.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Sorry man. You had just written me at a bad time and I forgot to respond afterwards. Also, I couldn't check the ftp for your old textures as the ftp was down for awhile. Good to see you around again. :)

 

Eh, I know you're busy. Get around to it whenever you can. It isn't anything critical.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Secondly, I'll stand by my opinion that I thought NH would think the dirty noodles were funny. I guess he didn't, cuz of all the drama that ensued,

...

 

Wow, now you have make me sit up! The Dark Mod had a "Dirty Noodles Incident"? And no-one wants to talk about it? What about poor Mr. Honk? Nobody talks of him either!

 

:D

 

(Seriously, not knowing what this is all about, it reads like classy comedy :wub: )

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

Link to post
Share on other sites
Well we did know what happened to him, as was explained in the member's lounge by NH.

 

Did you expect an apology or something Dom? Come now, seriously. ;)

Of course! Why, a team member not doing work for months and months, and then coming back and jumping straight in again as if nothing happened, with no apology, why, that's just dispicable!!!

Link to post
Share on other sites
Of course! Why, a team member not doing work for months and months, and then coming back and jumping straight in again as if nothing happened, with no apology, why, that's just dispicable!!!

 

You have noticed his member status right?

Link to post
Share on other sites
(Seriously, not knowing what this is all about, it reads like classy comedy :wub: )

 

Classy is a word rarely ever applied to me and the things I do. Even then, it's usually accidental.

 

Well we did know what happened to him, as was explained in the member's lounge by NH.

 

You're all talking about me behind my back now? Damn. :(

Link to post
Share on other sites
Classy is a word rarely ever applied to me and the things I do. Even then, it's usually accidental.

 

:D

 

You're all talking about me behind my back now? Damn. :(

 

Erm, I am definitely not. I wasn't even around when you took your break, and I have no clue what's going on, anyway. Besides, every bit of work someone puts into the mod is welcome, no matter how small or when. We get all the contributions for free, so I don't think anyone here should argue about them. Afterall, we rather have small contributions, then none at all.

 

So, Renzatic, a hearty welcome (back) and may you contribute much :)

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw (1856 - 1950)

 

"Remember: If the game lets you do it, it's not cheating." -- Xarax

Link to post
Share on other sites
Erm, I am definitely not. I wasn't even around when you took your break, and I have no clue what's going on, anyway.

 

Heh, man....there isn't anything going on. I just left the mod one day with the intent to return, and took a long ass time in doing it. I'm still not officially back yet, and don't know if I'll ever return as anything other than a contributor or beta mapper. Right now, I'm having too much fun playing with both T3 and TDM to commit to just one.

 

I'm gonna be ballsy enough to make a request, though. This is what I asked NH a couple weeks back, but he strikes me as being a bit busy at the moment, and what I'm looking for might be kinda like trying to find a needle in a haystack.

 

A long time ago, I made this hallway to test out some textures and goof around with making things look cool (blackthief did the the lamps, and of course Oddity did the character model). I had all this stuff backed up, but apparently I used cheap CDs to do the archiving, and they went transparent on me over time. Thusly, I can't get them anymore, and I need to come here to ask someone if they can find one particular texture for me...

 

That green plaster wall.

 

It'd be perfect for what I'm working on now. I've already searched high and low across all the old texture sites I used to visit, but I can't find it anywhere. I'm pretty sure I backed it up to the FTP along with the rest of the map, and it might even be floating around in the mod somewhere. If I could get it back, just the diffuse, I'd be forever grateful

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...