Nyarlathotep
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Posts posted by Nyarlathotep
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I was not talking about anit-matter, I was talking about a simple hole, like the one you can have in your pocket and where your money falls out. And don't try to tell me that it is filled by air next, because you can bring your trouser to space and then the air would be gone but the hole would still be there.
I was extending your analogy to better explain the point I was trying to make: disbelief as a negation of ordinary belief, rather than a lack of belief.
It's a common misconception among psychics, to claim that there is a "believe in science" which is the same as a belief in god. It is not. Also most sceptics don't simply believe in science, which would be quite a strange thing if you understand the process of scientific investigation.That's why I specifically said the belief in the power of science, rather than belief in science (which is paradoxical at best).
Fair enough, some people make a distinction between a "strong" or a "weak" atheist, or state that most atheists are in fact agnostics because they don't specifically believe that god does not exist. I tend to take "atheist" to mean "somebody who lacks a belief in god" rather than indicating any strong disbelief.Yes, but that's a very different kind of belief because it is based on evidence rather than faith or superstition. It is the latter that atheists and skeptics reject, not belief in its entirety.
I tend to agree with that statement, as I was implying in my last post. However, it's not the most common definition that you would hear from a theist, or often those have abandoned religion as they have grown older. Indeed, most theists don't even have a strong idea of where the boundary between atheism and agnosticism lie. I personally don't agree with the specific formulations of "strong" and "weak" atheism, although whether that derives from my own confusion or of the writers of the seminal benchmark-encyclopedia Wikipedia, I am unsure.
The (IMPORTANT!) difference between a belief in religion and a belief in science is what it would take to get you to change/update your beliefs.Yes.
@ Orb and oDDity - if you can live happily with the idea that you'll cease to exist forever in any form - good for you!
(But I think it might go some way to explaining such a high degree of negativity in your outlook on life...)But if someone else likes me likes to think there's something more to it than that, and it makes us happy, where's the harm in that?
Because I might also start thinking aliens took my socks? No - one rule does not work for everything. The thoughts about what happens after death is one place where I'll allow myself to have thoughts about it to make me happy, even though they wouldn't stand up to scientific scruitiny. And it's not a completely random idea - some things I hear about and experience from time to time seem to support it.
It's the whole self-delusion thing--not so much that you're aware of it, but that you persist in it anyways. Someone who believes in in god or heaven or what have you because they believe it to be true may or may not be wrong, but they aren't generally holding two contradictory beliefs at once. What you appear to be professing is not a strict agnosticism ("I do not know if god exists"), but instead holding a belief that you know to be essentially false and meaningless ("God doesn't exist, but I believe in him anyways because it makes me feel better").
I'm more than certain that I've completely straw-manned your beliefs there, and for that I apologize. However, it should give you some insight as to why we find your beliefs so strange and confusing. Incorrect or opposing beliefs are one thing, but (apparent) doublethink is entirely another.
One thing bothers me though, with the obvious exception of oDDity, what makes you believe that we in general (meaning those of us who profess themselves as atheists) have such a negative outlook on life?
Ninja edit
:Damn bloody right I can. The best thing about life is the fact that, whatever happens, it won't last for ever. I actually find the concept of existing eternally pretty close the the idea of hell.Personally, I disagree. I would love to be biologically immortal, living however long as I wanted--if nothing else, for sheer curiosity's sake. I want to see what amazing technologies we will possess in a thousand years' time , to know whether we will settle the galaxy, whether we will ever understand our universe. What strange aeons lie before us just beyond the reaches of our imagination? Why the hell would I want to die and leave all this behind? Very few religious conceptions of an afterlife have anything to do with continuing to experience this world. Even if there is an afterlife, it can always wait a couple of millennia. Life itself is already so varied an experience, so why do we humans alway insist on spoiling the pot with utopian afterlifes?
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What did you expect about with a poll on what browsers we use?
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Philosophy is pretty natural, but don't succumb to fallacies--please!
Well I am Greek, but I havent caught myself doing this (at least not a lot).One question however with no offence, how many greeks have you met anywayz?
I really meant ancient Greek philosophers: Socrates, Plato, Aristotle.
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No, the vice president of Ford. I have no idea what 'Future Forces' is.
Oops, wrong vice president.
As for the Future Forces project, I couldn't remember the name of it--or even whether it had a name--and just named it that randomly. Thanks to the magic of Wikipedia, I now know it's Future Combat Systems. -
so you do have access, just not from your own pc (or mac, dont want to seem prejudice against thoes wimpy macs
)To the forums, yes. To the internet, no.
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Yup.
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Of course that statement is simply wrong. Or would you also say that a hole is just another kind of matter? Probably not.Wrong. A lack of something is NOT the same as having something. Unless of course you are defining "atheist" to mean "somebody who is 100% certain that god does not exist", but that does not describe most atheists.
Perhaps I should have been more clear as to what I meant. I was specifically referring to disbelief, rather than a lack of belief. The statement, "I do not believe in god," does not specify whether it is a lack of belief or if it is disbelief (although it does imply the latter), but "I believe there is no god" is a disbelief in god and therefore also a belief. In sparhawk's analogy, antimatter or negative matter is still a type of matter, not a lack thereof.
The point that I had been trying to make is that atheists almost necessarily still have beliefs, such as a belief in the power of science. Belief is a necessary evil, as a complete lack of beliefs requires that one either knows everything (and therefore has no need for belief) or that one knows nothing (and consequently cannot learn anything). (If anyone cares, I could easily use Plato's Image of the Divided Line to further elaborate my argument.)
It's a common slang term for an ignorant and credulous person, you'll find it used commonly on any sceptical discussion board.I've never heard it before. I honestly thought you had misspelled "believer," but it still sounds like a Larry Niven curse word.
It seems we do agree after all.Indeed. Occam's razor gives foundation to a belief in a lack of a god, and furthermore, it is falsifiable--the key trait of all knowledge (the fact that a counterexample would be unfalsifiable only makes it stronger).
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That's one of the paradoxes that philosophers have been debating for hundreds of years now.
Since this is the off topic forum, a thread that becomes off topic belongs here, because it is off topic. But if it belongs here, it can not be off topic, because it means that something is NOT on topic and thus it can not belong here.
That's the fallacy of equivocation. There are two different "off-topics" you are referring to. The first is off the topic of TDM, and the second is off the topic of the thread. The Greeks did this a lot, actually; it's really annoying.
Edit: I don't mean to spoil people's fun; I just have fun spotting and pointing out fallacies.
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I don't have internet access. Whenever I want to read the forums, I go to modetwo's servers and do my posting there. (Ya rly!)
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Hm the future forces project is interesting but who knows what kind of climate conditions the year 2032 will be. It's so far off. I'm willing to bet they will have to scrap a lot of projects and just make the average joe able to survive in the weather and global climate conditions due to global warming.
You can make a lot of reasonable extrapolations to 2032. No disaster short of an apocalypse is going to change the battlefield appreciably in 25 years. The only thing that could alter the battlefield in an unpredictable way is is a radically new technology, and one that hasn't been predicted. Furthermore, the Future Forces program doesn't try to design the "Army After Next" per se, but rather, it tries to introduce a a host of technologies that will be invaluable to said army. It's not an exercise in pure fantasy, imagining that flying cars will be commonplace fifty years from now, but it is trying to pick technologies that will be mature in 25 years, and can produce technologies we know will be useful. The Future Forces program is designed to be as flexible as possible, while still remaining a useful prediction.
I've interviewed the vice president, seemed like a nice enough guy.
That's probably because you've never been hunting with him.
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Aceyalone, IIRC there is also a secret level in "The Bonehoard" that you can only access in the expert level setting. Don't ask me more, its been years since I played that FM, but someone else here could elaborate.
Wasn't that where you get the bow upgrade?
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No it doesn't. Atheism is not a belief, it is the lack of belief, despite what the bleevers tell you. There are no "hoops" that you have to jump through to NOT believe in god, because there is no evidence to support his existence and therefore nothing you need to "avoid".
Three points:
1. Good spelling makes your arguments actually seem intelligent, even if they're not. "Bleever" sounds like yet another idiotic curse word invented by Larry Niven. How about I jinxtapocise my tasp up your tanj-hole, scrith-herder?
2. Disbelief is a another form of belief--only knowledge can transcend belief.
3. You completely missed the point--I was talking about the irrationality of beliefs, and that everyone, especially those claim to be above belief, harbor them.
4.
5. There is no four.
No, you're making it too complicated for these people. The explanation I gave is a lot simpler than that.Occam's razor - don't give something more of an explanation than is necessary.
It's simply ignorant people trying to make sense of a world they know nothing about, so they attribute the same principles to nature as to themselves, give everything a spirit and a personality ,and then try to interact with it.
It's the most direct and obvious way to explain something for them.
If they did the logical thinking that you say, then they would simply have extrapolated the chain back to two gods, a father and a mother, and of course, a father and mother god for every other species of plant and animal, but this doesn't happen in any religion.
It's the nature of everything to start off simple and become more complex, including religion.
You're trying to start it off way too complex.
Because of Occam's razor, atheism is essentially the default viewpoint. A lot of "atheists" and theists alike seem to forget that atheism stems from a lack of proof of deities, rather than "denying god." If that last statement didn't make sense to you, that's because it doesn't.
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That essentially stems from the fact that people generally refuse to change their beliefs. Once they have decided to believe something, they'll go through all sorts of intellectual flaming hoops just to maintain it. Nota bene: this applies to atheists just as much to theists--it's any belief.
Thanks, I prefer popcorn for the show. And a good glass of cold coke, while we are at it.DO NOT MOCK THE FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER!!!
THE FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER IS REAL, AND HIS NOODLY APPENDAGE TOUCHES US ALL!!! IF YOU DO NOT BELIEVE IN THE FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER, THEN YOU ARE GOING TO HELL, YOU FUCKING ATHEIST!!! RAmen.Actually, that was kind of fun. That must be it! Theists are religious because it gives them an excuse to hate others!
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It wouldn't be bureaucracy if it weren't pointless. Most of the time I wonder if government agencies and corporations aren't actually in for the money--though it may seem so--but aim to make people suffer.
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I didn't buy it, I downloaded a warez copy to work on the mod, and never played it. I didn't even have the content on my system, just the exe and essential editor files.
The way I seen it, we were selling a lot of extra copies of the game for id software by making this TC, so why should we have to pay for it.
I took the reverse approach. I was willing to buy the engine (if I could put it to good use), but not the game. I pirated the game from a friend (I refuse to download) to get me access to the editor, with plans of eventually mapping. The second reason was because I wanted to play Resurrection of Evil, but I couldn't be assed to buy the main game. I always intended to buy Doom 3 if I felt I had or could get my money's worth from it. Making maps, working on a mod, or even just enjoying the campaign would have sufficed, but alas, none of these have happened yet. Seeing as how I lost my pirated copy (and the only one I can get is for Linux), I'd love to get my hands on a stripped down copy until I can fucking finally get a legal Windoze disc. Mind pming if you can help, oDDity?
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I had to look it up in a strategy guide to do it, but throwing the bones in the sarcophagus gives you holy water potions, as I recall.
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Have you downloaded DarkRadient yet? I wish I could be more specific.
When you provide work samples quickly, you get accepted quickly.I had simply assumed that he would have to provide the map itself for people to see for themselves before he could become a beta mapper. Considering the quality, it would have at absolute most delayed his status as beta mapper for a single day.
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I, on the other hand, bought Doom 3 just so I could work on this mod.
Same difference!
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There are already several university students working on the mod (myself included). That's not a problem.
Indeed. I'm a university student myself (although I admit I have to contribute--mostly due to the difficulties of buying D3 while at school).
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But I quickly drew a picture. The question mark ? is because I forgot what was there, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't just a crucifix. Something a bit more complicated looking.
It was definitely the Holy Anorankh.
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Wow! That was fast!
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[Quite a few people] are buying Doom3 just to play this mod.
I would be one of them.
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We were looking at buying a car a few months back, and I did some research on safety. IIRC no American cars were in the top 3 for safety, that was Volkswagen, Mitsubishi, Honda, with some others in the luxury classes. Im not buying, in fact I rarely allow myself to ride in, cars without curtain style side air bags. Just that one feature lowers the rate of mortality in an accident by around a third.
I'm surprised that the perennial safety favorite Volvo wasn't in the top three. As for Hondas, my parents bought the base model Fit last year. That is one freaking sweet car. I just wish my mother wouldn't insist on referring to it as her "pocket rocket."
When I'm driving or riding in it, I love pretending that the future of cars will look something like it: compact, roomy, fuel-efficient, quiet, and handling almost like a sports car.American cars could easily reenter the lead if they focused on making cars so much the better, and let themselves use advanced new technology. For example, switching over to composites (instead of steels) would have a relatively large upfront cost but would make the cars more fuel-efficient (about half the weight), safer (stronger) and cheaper (fewer parts, and no need for the complex painting process). Secondly, they need to focus on providing alternative fuel support to all their vehicles (such as making sure all of their vehicles can run E85 or biodiesel). Simply put, if American car manufacturers focused on making cars more fuel efficient, safer, and so forth, it would greatly help their image. A lot of manufacturers are concerned with developing the car of 2050 (including GE), but so few American manufacturers are concerning themselves with the intermediate cars.
Surprisingly enough, a good example of the correct line of thinking is demonstrated in another American project: the Future Forces project. It's designed to envision the army (really though, it's becoming much more of a joint forces project) of approximately 2032, leveraging technologies that are only just coming off the drawing board now. However, the Army knows that creating the Future Force Warrior is not enough. It also has to create the next army, not just the "Army After Next." Thus, we have the Land Warrior system, which intends to bridge the gap between the army that's currently losing in Iraq and Afghanistan, and the one that will be deployed in 2032. The Future Force Warrior is a host of technologies that are seemly outrageous today (but extensions of what we can do today), but Land Warrior is built from the ground up of technologies that can be put on the battlefield today (and is actually being tested in combat as we converse). What is so impressive is that it exemplifies the sort of forward thinking that the American populace does far too little of today, and exactly the sort that American car manufacturers need.</soapbox>
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Maximus, is that perhaps a taste of what's to come? Because that is pure awesome.
Thief 2 Fan Missions
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Which fallacy is that, then?