DeusXIncognita
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Posts posted by DeusXIncognita
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Went through that mission today.
Was a nice little mission, with quite a bit of content for that space.
Also there are really nice and interesting ideas that were done in that mission, that was nice.
Details:
First: I played with TDM 2.02; on expert mode.
My experience on the runthrough:
After a bit of exploring, the first camera sees me in the dark, which i noticed after an alarm was sound, and all the guards were running to the Front door.
At that point I decide, that this is going to be an unusual playthrough, and decide to just carry on, no matter what, if possible (couldn't really keep that, since being seen most of the time meant the mission being over, sadly - with nothing to parry, hard to get away because of the small map, and no killing / KOing possible, but for everything possible i kept it)
I use that opening to sneak into the tavern, look around a bit. Upstairs i open the door to the outside, which is heard by a guard patrouilling again outside. I look around more, open another door. A guy downstairs hears it, comes up. I take his key. Suddenly he seems vanished. I try to go to the trunk, suddenly the guy is there again, seems to hear something and looks around with a drawn weapon. I hide on the bed till he goes away.
I open the trunk with the key and take the important tools.
I use the balcony to go down, remember that one of those guards (I think one i had already) still has a key. I follow the guard in a dark alley, always in the shadow. Want to wait till the guard passes me, to take the key. suddenly, another alarm. I sneak deeper in the shadows, and many guards come to the side entrance. In the chaos, i sneak around the corner to get away. One guard must have heard me, he follows me, can't have ssen me though. He follows me to the toilet, always seemingly hearing me (I can't even hear me well).
I go down in the sewer, and hear that guard trying to find me for some time after that, always mumbling, not really silent (shouldn't he be dampened down here?)
I sneak into the target building through the canal. Really close to me a guy goes to the basement. I go in front of the metal door, to hear when he returns. I listen at the doort, but the guy is never to be heard from. I go in on luck, and notice he passed the door already, with me not hearing him. I hear him when the doort is open, though not when I listen at the door.
It was also a bit of a problem with all the ambient noise, especially outside the metal door, I never could find out what should be the source of it, the machine inside had more silent noises, and different, although it was loud too.
After springing my fence, I notice that there seems to be no entrance in the building (Sewer way up, front door, side door) were it is possible to enter the building without a bit of luck to not be seen.
Ambient sound always was a problem (loud noise for me, hard time hearing the AI, AI seems to hear me anyway. I think the AI should have been less hearing with all that ambient noise, instead they seemed to be superhearing).
That the "no KOing" objective (of expert mode) also referred to spiders and the beggar was not really nice, since it should be a stunt for the people above, which had nothing to do with the beggar, and especially not with the spiders.
I also couldn't find the key in the sewer, without some help from here. Interesting enough, I had searched that part carefully, and all other pipes - seem to have always missed those, although it seems clearly visible now. Must have been all that other things there, drawing my vision to them.
Everything together, I really liked the mission, it had those nice extras, and ideas, and good story in it.
I really liked the mushrooms in the bottle, nice combination.
Gameplay wise it could need quite a few improvements in my opinion though. Thats especially true in my opinion, if one of the difficulties promotes a non-optional "no taking out anyone" objective, and the map gives a hard time to really avoid being noticed.
[Also, it would be nice if one could load from the mission failed screen, I definitly need loading more often then restarting the mission, but thats something not related to the map]
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Nice mission, lots of possible exploring too.
Couldn't see the visual clue that should give away not openable windows though, was making exploring hard sometimes.
I also had a bit of bad luck regarding the elevator, I tried the wrong florr first (the one without the cabin, didn't see the call button (tried all the others in the room (for the light), and then opened the door to jump in. That didn't work, so the elevator was non-functional to me.
So of course i missed a few very importan spots.
I needed the clue from the forum to get back right on track.
Also I didn't see the side that opens the glass vitrine at the end.
But blind lockpicking into it and then trying to open it worked - although I was a bit stumoed that the opening was on the other side of which I picked.
Otherwise its just fun, though the performance was in some areas really bad.
Some time since that mission has been done, but i am glad i have finall< played it.
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@DX: thanks for playing. Sorry for the frustrating moments. [...]
Mackie's lost ring is indeed there. His note mentions that a rat stole it, and if you watch where the rat near the water wheel travels, you'll note that at one point he disappears into a wall near the generator. A few rings are sitting on the floor just outside his hidey-hole.
I'm not sure what "pull people along the grating near the water" means.
Grue's a nasty fellow, and probably deserves to be hung several times over anyway.
Well, you can't have everything. Nothing to be sorry about. As you read, I had my fun once I decided to kick over my usual playstyle, so it was refreshing.
Nice detail, found the rings now, nice little detail, I like such things. Didn't find the rat there though, not exactly sure why, but I think one rat was killed by a guard, or drowned, or something, at least I found a body of a rat.
Good to know about Grue, hadn't found evidence of any sort other than that he is a thief. Couldn't help but sympathize a bit in that case ;-)
More details for the grating near the water: where the moat is, on one side of it there is the way down to the cells. If, from that point, you walk over the bridge of the moat, to the left there is a hole in the wall, with grating below it, on which you can crouch walk. Water below the grating (I think the water below is where you had to dive to get the money bag someone dropped), wall above in that little space. You come out a short way after that, where the regular way over the bridge an on and that little hole come together.
And when In dropped a body on that grating, I could not drag it along, it stuck there somehow. I just could pick it up - and the engine doesnt allow to drop it then under the wall, which is the reason why i tried to drag the body there.
Hope that makes it clearer what place I mean.
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Finally finished that mission, and I have a definitive Love/Hate relationship with it.
The mission design was fantastic, but never before I was so frustrated by NPCs.
On the other hand that changed my playstyle, which was a nice change.
(Details that might be spoilers below)
Those many guards with Lamps where quite a frustration, At first I thought I would go the usual way and ghost (more or less) the mission, A while it worked quite well. But the constant movement of many guards with lamps and the dark places made the exploring so tedious I stopped my ghost run and began taking out those guards. Took quite a time to NOT kill them.
And finally I had explored everything in peace and could go above...
The final nail in being silent and taking them out from behind began there, when first the guy with torch spread more light than the stationary torches, and then I was caught between two torch bearers with no way to not get seen. Running, diving, hiding, trying to take certain people out to move more freely (that outside of the jail is really crowded, and then the final nail:
There was no way to pull people along the grating near the water. You couldn't get a grip there. That meant not pulling them under it, and further no good hiding place. I didn't want to drown them, had to take out more that came near the hiding space next to the jail stairs, missed some, decided to clear everything.
Hit a few people on their full metal helmets (my fault for not looking close enough / mistake one guard for another with a different helmet, because i thought there was only one)
Finally taking a few people out with dropped crates => fun moments.
So all in all quite a few frustrations, but when I decided to play along it worked nicely.
I still was quite frustrated that I couldn't free Grue without failing the mission, after reading that journal of Warden Fielder it might be nice to "un-dangerous" him, because I would guess he is marked that way in the book about the prisoners, because the Warden wants to get rid of him.
For a simple theft he doesn't deserve to be left there, in my eyes.
And I couldn't find that ring that Mackie Note spoke about, not sure if it is there? (Then again I missed 1000 in Loot and have no idea where, so I guess I missed something big or lots of small things)
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That mission was nice, although for me it was definitly outshined by "The Transaction".
What I really liked were the maps. They are rare in TDM, and I am always happy when I have some.
For me the Holy water was really necessary at the beginning, to feel save throughout the mission - so i was glad to have it. I have a feeling Thomas Porter will never ever again go out without some of it. It would have been nice though, to have some already, after all that trouble to get some in the last mission.
I had the right instinct for the poor couple, but trying to throw that diary before his feet so that he doesn't kill himself before he reads - it was not quite the right solution. I had thought maybe he would take the gift from the "mysterious helper"
That guy also seemed stuck, he always went from the rope to the door behind him, made 5 (or so) rounds in front of it and went back to the rope. After what I read in the thread it seems he should walk somewhere else too.
It was definitly nice to have an official "solution" that is recognized by the mission.
Also the trap was a nice development.
What I found good was, that nearly all lights were lighted again when darkened. It meant I had much equipment, but I had to ust it maybe more than once on the same torch. I had a bit bad luck with those, as whenever I took a torch out, it seemed someone came in immediatly to light it again ;-)
Sadly I had limited knockouts and could't try the leadball.
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I finally finished "The Transaction".
Which was a really awesome experience, I really love that there are scenes explaining stories, audible speech, and necessary quick thinking.
More detailed:
Frustrating points:
1) The forced fight with the revenant (lich queen) wasn't that nice, but really intense.
When the scene began I had one big problem: I "knew" I cannot kill undead with my sword, and had no Holy Water. So I ran in circles around the flaming thing, looting the hell out of the place and trying each door (one was locked, the other didn't work, I had though maybe to run out and get damaged, but sadly the door was "non existant"
After giving up and trying to fight, I died (no training with most missions, so I wasn't good at it) - read more and found out I just have to hit that thing.
One hit was doable, so I could play on, but at first it was frustrating, because all my experience showed, that I couldn't fight undead (maybe I just trested normal zombies, which I cannot seem to parry?). But it was hilarious to run around in circles and trying to think.
2) The visitor was another frustrating thing, because the way she reacted. I heard something, ducked behind the books where I was just looting the jewels and then tried to dart into the shadows. She saw me - and ran towards me shouting. I tried to silnce her (blackjack) but it wouldn't work at all, I even ran a bit behind her to do that, no use. I left it at that, but tried if it was possible, and from behind it was possible, but the first time it didn't work 8and she had weird running patterns around the room before she left.
That was a bit worrying, since it is stated in the wiki you ca blackjack "1. Unarmed civilian AI from any direction, any time."
I had to read it up to be sure, and i definitly hit her. Well, I left it with that state.
The scene itself was a nice setup, frustrating only because what i knew what should work, didn't.
3) The fate of the visitor. I didn't follow her, but she definilty left the map as far as I can tell, taking scroll and money with her. I would have liked the chance to find her again.
4) The town / torch bearers - everything else closed.
It didn't matter much, but became very frustrating with the torch bearers, since they saw every house entrance when walking by, and you could'nt make a hiding spot by opening the doors. once one even backed me into a stairway, where i couldn't escape, and couldn't even parry, maybe because I was standing to high on the stairs (he hit me anyway)
6) The low light in the abandoned house. It was the perfect dark for that house, athmospheric wise, but since I cannot use my tactile sense in the game it was too dark for me, when the torchers showed up. Since again, they lighted up every hiding spot - except the cupboard of which I had thought I was as deep as possible in was larger, and I could have hid - if I had seen the place.
Highlights:
1) The forced fight with the revenenant (see at frustrating points for more detail)
2) The builders watching the store, me taking out the guy to stop him seeing me entering.
3) The story behind the book store, and finding the portal, and knowing immediatly upon reading of the clue what it was.
4) The torture scene. I heard it through the door, drew my sword and jumped in, finishing the inquisitor before he was able to act. That was one great scene. Sadly I ahd to repeat it, because the guard coming after I freed her (took some time) was running around really weird in the area, and taking hard to predict swings all the while kiled me, seems the guard wasn't really good with the furniture down there, but it went the same way.
Took nice satisfaction from taking down the third one up there, and finally dragging in the unconcious one from the chapel and delivering this fate on him too.
Trying to get further away a guard spotted me in a really deep alcove at the side of the chapel, and I decided to frame the builders, dragged his body in and left it in the torture rack where the woman stood (she vanished where the guard saw me, thats why i hid there when I saw the torch coming...).
Seems they didn't really buy it ;-)
5) The guards coming for me, and not some other undead (I had enough of undead after Glenham, and had hoped I now had a break from them)
6) All the story and cutscenes and spoken bits. That was really nice.
All in all I really loved that mission.
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Oh "That Guard" made me angry. I am not sure what exactly ist meant with the "first time" if its the first time I encountered him, or the first time I relly got past him for future play.
Normally I try to sneak past the opposition, but while looking for a way past that guy he saw me (Must have misstepped). I didn't know about a alternative route at that point, and I didn't even know where that way led. After looking for a way past him at the machinery in the ground and the boxes a bit before him, I seemed to have angered him again (probably some noise or too much jumping), and killed him (not the last time of that, because he got on my nerves) to at least find out where that way led.
Which was the point where I found out that THIS was the mentioned heavily guarded entrance, I was expecting something obviously churchy at that point (Since then I have at least learned the limitations of Darkmod and know WHY that architecture was hidden).
I spent much time after that trying to jump up in the hole where the homeless man lives, figuring out more controls, playing training again, and running around at the rest of the level for much time, because I didn't find anything.
Finally I needed a hint from outside to find out that
a) the first door in the dark was openable (someone already mentioned it in the thread, but after the first few I tested where closed, I assumed the rest were too (I fI even saw it, can't remember, I might have had not so wonderful gamme / brightness settings at that time)
where I was supposed to find the keyAfterwards I continued what I had begun before, which is rumaging through the city part of the mission (which is my favourite part), finding out various ways to get on top of buildings, finding all sort of hints that would finally have brought me to the location of the key, And also finding out that hiding things, where the level architecture was flawed already (seeing skybox all the way down, missing renderings etc.), was okay for that level.
THEN I used the alternate route to finally play the main part of the mission.
So now you can decide what of that my FIRST is^^
I have got a long way with darkmod, and thinking like the mission designers (never played Fan missions before), since then, but for my first time it was quite frustrating experience.
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I finally managed to play through that Mission, and found it quite intriguing. The plot develops nicely, and there is much to read about what happened.
There were some quirks for me though, but most of them I can only write from memory:
(I used the Darkmod ingame mission downloader to get the mission)
- The Farm Ledger has wrong numbers (the one from the first entry) in the entry that marks the first time there is real profit
- One of the books has a different time scheme than the others (most around 1708-1714 or something, and one documenting that the father made something, I think it were the irrigation tunnels, in 1780 something. In that book most/all times are that way)
- One readable had a two word phrase written twice (sorry cannot remember which)
- I start on expert on most missions, was unfamiliar with the significance of the tension meter, and the mission said I was invited. Since I also didn't read about the mission here first, I missed that on expert you start elsewhere, and wherever I was going someone saw me and ended the mission for me, which I didn't understand at all. That should be spelled out in the mission description for expert, that you start somewhere not safe. (I assumed i could wander around normally at first)
- I would have liked a hint, that the bodies, after the snow experience, have to be dropped on top of the hole and have to fall down themselves, as nothing happened when I just carried them down, which is my normal thief behaviour - I don't just dump anyone anywhere, and I seldom rely on ragdoll physics to let a body fall somewhere. At first I though i was stuck until I found the solution in this thread.
- I didn't get Bernards Journal, I am not sure where I should have got it, this thread seems to suggest I should have got it from his body? That way I missed part of the story, and I also wasn't really sure why I should kill that person in the snowland now, apart from the objective.
- The flower beds need a "Keep Off" sign ;-)
- I didn't realize the old woman upstairs was Alma, and so was a bit confues why I didn't find her, since in one entry she stated she knows where he is and that she will go find him.
- It wasn't really clear to me why the curse struck, thats nothing that must be clear, but since Alma owned the land for some time too it isn't clear why she wasn't affected, Bernard was only after a longer time, and Oscar was affected fast, after a few weeks.
- Daylight sneaking is often too much trial and error (although it can be minimized by obervance quite a bit)
So far so good, despite some problems I really had fun, thanks.
Newbie DarkRadiant Questions
in TDM Editors Guild
Posted
I looked around for a long time, but can't find anything regarding this:
I am trying to build a part of town, with the nice look of illuminated, bright windows in a dark city. (Like it is with the "skybox" texture in thepool area of the startmap)
Some of the lit window textures are useful for this by default, they glow quite far.
Some other lit window textures though, are quite dark, if the world is dark.
I am searching for a way, to light them up.
Preferrably would be a method, to just add aspwanarg so it lights up as if it is lit by a real light.
Aside from that, I would prefer the most performance friendly method to achieve that.
It works right with a small light, placed over that window, but I think that this is not the best solution for that.