Durad

In all honestly, I prefer the old way of texturing in most cases. I say this because nearly every game out there always takes the bump mapping to an extreme. No offense to TDM (which in MHO looks nicer than a lot of professional games), but I notice a lot of the textures I see from the screenies take the bump-mapping way too far. (like this one for instance http://www.mindplaces.com/darkmod/bonehoard_1.jpg) Honestly, I think that many times a much more realistic look can be achieved by simply painting on the details and lighting effects. I am not saying that bump-mapping does not have its place, but I think that some of it just has to be done on the textures, and that the bump-mapping should be kept subtle. No offense to anyone...just my 2 cents...

No, I am not saying that TDM is a rip-off. I am saying that rather than me build a level based on Thief (ei, what I would create would be a rip-off), I would rather work toward preserving Thief. And yes, just because I love Thief does not mean that I think it is perfect. I would nonetheless though want it in its original form as well, thus the purist version FIRST. A Mother's Love was a mission where you could summon tons of creatures in an arena and fight them/make them fight each other. It was happy-go-slashy fun.

Ok everyone, I just wanted to say that I am sorry if my proposal has caused any trouble. I have been speaking (well...PMing) with one of the team members, and he has convinced me not to pursue the project anymore. It is a disappointment for me, but I think that it is for the better. Would it be worth it? In a word, yes. We were going to start with a purist version (ei, as close to Thief 2 as possible), and then with that base, we were going to work on an improved version that would have had many of the things that we have always wanted to see in a Thief game (such as the ability for a mapper to plot "emergency plans" for the AI to follow (for instance, an alarm is sounded, an assigned group of guards search all the rooms in the building they were scripted to, as all civilians make their way (escorted by the remaining guards) to a chosen "safe-room", which would then be locked and have all entrances guarded by the guards who just escorted them. After the building was searched and no threats were found, a certain amount of the patrolling guards would be stationed at the building's entrance on high-alert, and things would otherwise go back to normal. It would be very scripting intensive for the mapper, but could be worth it for large, heavily guarded manors and complexes with advanced security. That was something that my sis was going to try to make work (and when my sis tries to make something work, it always happens ).), torch bearing AI, Shields, Pole-arms, improved combat, etc, etc. Honestly, I am not nearly as interested in creating a rip-off storyline in a rip-off world of the Thief world. I would much rather preserve and improve Thief. Yes, I like fan-missions, but usually the fun goofy ones (like A Mother's Love...my fav), not the intense story-line driven ones. When it comes to them, Thief has never been out-done. That said, I have my own ideas for a great stealth game that I would love to make (honestly, with a few modifications, I think it would make a perfect Thief 4), but the problem is that my team is not interested in helping me with it. The thing we have in common is a love of Thief, other than that, we all have our own ideas about our own games. I work a full time job, and don't have nearly as much time as I used to to mod. I probably could not put the time into a mod with a different team in order to keep it together. Anyway, I have decided to cancel the project, so it does not matter now. I have mods on other games that have been in a state of stasis for months now that I have to continue.

I actually don't know how to model. I have worked closely with some very good modelers (like Meliteros from the totalwar.org), but I cannot model to save my life. I am a pretty decent skinner though. If we are given the green light, everything we use on the project will be available for the community to use. Otherwise, I have other mods on other games that I will probably go back to working on.

I sent them another email especially for Briareos.

Very well, I will send a follow up email to make that clear to them, and then I will post what I sent them here. Actually, we had planned (most of the people I have talked to about this are in my immediate or close family) to keep it 'in-house' and not distribute it, but then we thought, why not let other people enjoy it if we can? If we do not get the permission, we will probably still develop it and keep it in-house. (though we may try to get a modeller involved as that is the weak spot of the team, and there are a lot of complicated models that need to be made) When we were first talking about this, we estimated that it would take about 3 years to make (we all work full-time jobs), but honestly, after looking some stuff over I am thinking it would probably be closer to 4.

I do realize. I have modded many games before, including doing TCs. I know how hard it is to learn a new engine, and I know how much goes into that. (I have been a skinner, score-composer, sound designer, 2-d art designer, tester, concept artist, and team leader on mod teams before) I am not saying I am great, or that I would do a really good job at it, but I do have an idea of the scope, and I am well aware that many more things always need to be done than what you plan for. The good thing is that the core of the people who would be working on it are my brothers and sisters (all passionate Thief fans). (My sister has been a contract programmer for an insurance firm for a few years, and has spent the last 5 years working full time as a programmer for a clinic, and is also an avid modder and gamer. She is the one who would be doing the coding.) We may succeed or we may crash and burn, but if we get the right permissions, I would sure love to give it a try.

I understand that, but if we did this, it would only be one of the many mission packs available for the Dark Mod. Honestly, I am a Thief fanatic and would love to build an engine from scratch and remake Thief 2, but neither I nor anyone has the time or resources to do that. Therefore, if I was too get permission and make a mod recreating Thief 2 with better graphics, etc., I would need a similar enough base. Honestly, Thievery just would not work, whereas the Dark Mod already has so much work put into it that it would be a perfect choice if I did such a project.

Well, I apologize for that then. I thought the mod was something that someone could make any mission they wanted on. I had planned to ask your team for permission if Eidos gave us permission. I was not aware that I did it backwards. I apologize, however I did make it clear to Eidos that I was not part of the Dark Mod team and did not give them any reason to believe that I was working in conjunction with you guys.

I understand that, but you would let us use your mod to build it on if we got permission, wouldn't you? You are probably right that we will not get permission, but it won't hurt anything to try. When my old XP laptop bites the dust (it is 5 1/2 years old), I don't want to be faced with the prospect of never playing Thief 2 again. I want to go back to making Thief missions, so even if I do not get permission, I may make a different project (unrelated to Thief) on the Darkmod instead. Either way, I will let you know what they tell me.

Ok, well I've contacted Eidos to ask their permission to remake Thief: TMA on the Dark Mod...it cannot hurt, right? My team and I (we mostly do M&B and Total War mods) are all avid Thief fans and most of us used to create Thief fan missions, and this is something we have been talking about for a while. Hopefully we will get permission for it. In the meanwhile I sent our coder the link to this site so she can examine the code to TDM and start making a new build specifically for this project...just in case...

Ah, thanks.

Oh, thanks. That really sucks...lol You'd think that after all this time they would either let people use the source code to allow Thief 2 to run on modern computers, or they would do it themselves. How can it be though that you cannot create a burrick on the Dark Mod, yet people can make entire Lord of the Rings modifications for Total War and Battlefield games? That doesn't make much sense. Is it just that the people at Eidios are being arseholes Nazis about enforcing it?

So, is it illegal to make one or distribute one? Also, what exactly is it that is copyrighted/trademarked? The name?

Hey all, I was wondering, is anyone trying to recreate Thief 1 or 2 on TDM? I ask because none of my newer computers can run the first Thiefs, and pretty soon my ancient laptop is gonna die (and with it my ability to play my favorite games). If no one is working on it, why? The complexity? Are there copyright issues?