Posts posted by Oktokolo
3 hours ago, stgatilov said:
Unfortunately, "show full outline" and "respect occlusion" somewhat contradict each other when frobbed object touches something. So you either get one type of artifacts or the other.
Obviously the correct implementation would be "Show full outlines for the parts that aren't occluded".
Not sure if that is possible in this engine - but i definitely played games doing that.
And if that whole outline thing proves to be too hard to fix - the alternative of just painting some moving semi-transparent texture over the whole highlighted object is the solution i have seen in most games and it always worked pretty good when done subtle (the opposite of what we are voting for here).
Now, some time later, in my opinion, the outline itself isn't actually that bad an idea.
But the current presets are waaaaaaaaay too much and really inaccurate/sloppy. Especially the third doesn't seem to honor occlusion that much. And the first misses some edges, while the second highlights geometry nodes as if its mission would be to mock the low-poly geometry of stock TDM models.
If it would be more reliable, more accurate, a lot less bright in dark scenes (which are the majority in this game) - then it would probably be okay.
Maybe, just layering some almost transparent scrolling alternating darkening/brightening sinus over the object in the frob focus and ditching the outline alltogether would still be the better option. Movement always attracts attention and therefore that method could probably get the job done with a fraction of the paint...
Still voted "won't regret much" on all options, because i am pretty sure, that the accuracy issues can be reduced and that someone will find a way to tone it down to a level not hurting my eyes (which would also help making the inaccuracies less obvious)...
Looks good, but the whole scene seems to get naticably brightened too.
Not sure, whether just playing on slightly less gamma would fix that.
17 hours ago, stgatilov said:
It applies force equal to some hard-coded ratio (less than 1) multiplied by weight of the body.
You will have the same success as with a rat
So horses have the same weight as rats?
17 hours ago, stgatilov said:
Highlighting with plain white will make things look milky. Highlighting with diffuse texture does not work for some specular objects. There is no universal rule to highlight everything, I'm afraid.
Maybe, there could be a fixed set of different highlight strategies, which can be selected by the material and then applied by the highlight shader - so transparent stuff would get the treatment that currently is defined as stage in that flask's material.
Preset 3 (the really soft one) actually wouldn't look too bad if you could get rid of the artifacts.
It still literally highlights TDM's low standard asset polygon count though...
6 hours ago, stgatilov said:
The main plan is to remove frob-highlight stages from materials.
It seems that it is not possible to implement a universal rule for highlighting all objects. The current rule works fine in 99% cases, but there are some objects which don't react. The outline is here to help with these cases.
So... please stop saying "just disable outline!", don't ignore the problem.
As the outline is the problem, "just disable outline!" actually is the fix. The old highlighting has its flaws in bright environments - but it still almost always worked just fine.
So the new highlighting but without the outline should work just fine as well.
23 minutes ago, Filizitas said:
You dont even have SSR yet, so i highly doubt that there is any room for any GI solution.
Hmm, if we had SSR, could GI be faked by having multiple additive SSR passes?
2 hours ago, STiFU said:
Edit: I just copy pasted the post to notepad++ and enabled showing of whitespace characters. What are you doing there mate?
Better use your browsers inspect function.
But there indeed are paragraphs consisting of only a non-breaking space between the lines.
I too wonder, why nbohr1more did the extra work leading to a longer and less readable post.
On 9/9/2021 at 4:23 AM, stgatilov said:
Removed the feature in svn revs 9587 and 16353.
I always thought that button would delete the entire mission folder because that would make a lot of sense when you have a mission download function.
Never clicked it though. There always where some 20+ GiB behemoths to delete when i needed space...
Would still advocate for promoting that button to actually delete the whole mission folder instead of just removing it.
Was pretty close to the correct implementation already.
7 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:
A marsarrow with the ET in the Accountant mission?
Nah, marketing thinks the impact factor of moose arrows to be superior...
6 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:
Sorry, mossarrow A moussearrow may also serve for distracting a guard, or better a beerarrow
Well, a moose arrow should certainly work fine for distracting the most thickheaded or even drunk guards...
16 hours ago, STiFU said:
We have too many new frob shader threads. I count 2 public and 2 internal.
Most can't see the top secret ones which are for inner circle eyes only...
And frobbing is a pretty important mechanic which is hard to get right and is perceived to work pretty good in current stable by most players. So it is hard to improve.
If you want to know the real potential maximum count of frob highlight threads, just ship the depth-ignoring glow version to stable users.
A mere two really isn't that much...
On 8/10/2021 at 7:03 PM, MirceaKitsune said:
I don't believe it's an emergency but do consider it an important change especially later down the road, as Linux is slowly moving away from x11 with many distros already going full Wayland by default.
I am all-in pro Wayland as it finally does GUI separation, which indeed is essential for desktop security when applications are expected to contain security-relevant bugs...
But that feature doesn't actually require TDM to be Wayland-aware to work.
And Wayland support would increase the maintenance burden.
Is the wrapper actually affecting performance significantly on low-end hardware which runs TDM just fine without Wayland?
Is TDM more likely to crash when running on the X wrapper?
7 hours ago, wesp5 said:
I think kicking in a door would make little sense in the TDM setting, because it should be incredible loud, thus alerting anybody nearby...
Even in the city, kicking in doors can be appropriate. In the slums of Bridgeport, only the gangers will react to you doing such things. So if you time it right, you can do whatever you want.
Immersion can be improved by rarely used game mechanics too. Having the option obviously doesn't count as much as actually doing it - but it still counts.
The only question is, whether there is someone who implements it and makes it easy to integrate in missions.
1 hour ago, wesp5 said:
Really? I don't think this is true, Arx Fatalis takes ages and I know of no mission that even comes close.
Arx Fatalis excells in game design and manages to get way more fun playtime out of the rather small map areas. It takes ages if you explore carefully, try all the mechanics and don't quest in the optimal order. There also often exist multiple solutions to problems you might "waste" time trying out.
Arx Fatalis doesn't use modular building. And the level designers did an insane job in hand crafting the environment making every location look unique and interesting. They really succeeded in creating that feeling of a multilevel ventilation-shaft-encircling underground dungeons sprawl. But every level's mapped out area is probably smaller than the City in "The Painter's Wife" or some other TDM missions i forgot the names of.
Compared with TDM, the settlements in Arx Fatalis are a joke when it comes to size and count of rooms. But they feel big and you can walk almost the entire map area (way less unopenable doors and other gamey borders.
It can be speedrun without using glitches in 40 minutes.
The immersive design and mechanics (including crafting and automap) in Arx Fatalis make it bigger than the maps of its eight layers.
It is one of the old "open world" games where the world is rather small but packed with unique stuff and interactivity instead of huge and filled with repetition.
5 hours ago, OrbWeaver said:
Crafting makes sense in RPGs where player characters exist for a long time (either on a server or in a long single-player campaign) and can accumulate a large quantity of materials and recipes. It is not a mechanic which makes sense in isolated, one-and-done TDM missions.
TDM has some quite massive missions. Some rival Arx Fatalis (the game with the most immersive crafting system) in size.
And while i almost never need healing, i still tend to eat food in missions - just because i can do so and it somehow feels good to get some healthy apple with your loot.
23 hours ago, Zerg Rush said:
Good idea, but on the other hand I don't see any real use in a mission. If the task consists of deactivating a transformer, it would be much simpler to put a switch on it. Having an arrow to deactivate circuits should work on all transformers on the map, which implies a lot of change in the plot.
Yep, rope arrows suffer from that problem as well.
You generally have to design missions with player tools in mind.
So obviously any new stuff would only be available after explicit inclusion in missions by their authors. The TDM devs wouldn't just add some gameplay alteration to existing maps.
12 hours ago, OrbWeaver said:
Isn't GOG for commercially-released but old and abandoned games?
OpenTTD is licensed under GPL v.2 and has not been commercially released.
Psychonauts 2 is a full-price title released last week.
They are just a normal game distribution site.
They no longer call themselves "Good old Games" - it is just "GOG" now...
22 hours ago, Petike the Taffer said:
I think one of the best ways to "explain away" the existence of electric arrows in TDM would be to have an arrowhead that includes some conductive material on the inside and some sort of made-up gobbledygook alchemical substance that would act as a trigger to the conductive material. Once the arrow arrives at its target, the alchemical substance in one of its compartments is triggered and the substance itself then acts as a trigger for the conductive material in the arrowhead, creating an electric discharge of some sort.
In real life, graphite bombs are a proven surgical tool. You can use them to short-circuit whole transformer stations, a single overland power line, or a power plant connection station. Just be sure to detonate a single one above the target, so the cloud of graphite-coated filaments gets optimally spread over all the conductors.
Carbon-coated filament might sound a bit hightech. But small-scale, just spreading coal dust might work fine in a steampunk game...
Water arrows for torches and coal arrows for electric lights, steel for humans and silver for monsters...
Nexus Mods is a great site for getting new mods for games which don't provide a mod distribution infrastructure themselves.
But maps/levels are provided ingame and there are only very few mods for TDM.
So what is it, a TDM user would look for on Nexus Mods?
Players in general don't search for new games on mod distribution sites. They come there after they got a game they want to add some more flaver to using mods.
Often they even wait until the second playthrough before even evaluating what the mod scene offers.
But luckily, there are specialized game distribution sites - like Steam, GOG, Epicgames, and Itch.io.
So if you seek more exposure, try getting TDM listed there first.
2 hours ago, JackFarmer said:
One would wish for the old home computer or PC times back when the players still had to show a certain standard knowledge in order to be able to install and play games at all.
You don't and shouldn't need special knowledge to install a game. The game's installer or your repo's package manager installs the game adhering to the OS-specific standard where things go - and then the game just works™.
So if they would start ranting about problems running the game due to permission problems or the like - yep, that would indeed be TDMs fault (i believe, that sort of problems have been fixed with the new installer though).
And when it comes to actually playing the game...
Yes, they will rant and some will also troll - as they always do. It happens for all games in all genres on steam and everywhere else. Not a big deal if you don't need the game to be a financial success.
TDM isn't for everyone. But it isn't only for people older than X either. The playerbase isn't static. It ages as every human does. Some die. Some are newly born.
I expect there to be a lot of players already which just don't know, that a better version of the graphically badly aged thief series exists and comes with over hundred levels...
Somehoe this community just expects them to know - but most likely a lot of them don't, because TDM isn't mainstream and niche games in general are hard to find.
I stumbled upon most good stealth games around ten years after release. And i searched.
Some i still find only through GOG (like the Death to Spies series).
Maybe , bringing TDM to GOG would work too - as gamers there are less mainstream-AAA-centered.
4 hours ago, Kurshok said:
And it's not about making the war go on longer, although I don't mind if that happens so long as freedom is maintained for the Afghanistani people and the current terror we see with young war brides being taken and schools being shut down is stopped.
There is only one example where war actually brought freedom - and that was against the highly hierachical and centralized Nazis which started WW2 to conquer Europe.
Since then, each try on bringing freedom with bombs failed epicly to the point that not even the imperium believes in bringing freedom with bombs anymore.
ISIS exists, because we systematically bombed away any structure of power that would have prevented that from happening.
And getting new suicide bomber recruits is dead easy if you search for them in a region where everyone knows someone who lost a family member by drone strike.
Frob outline poll
in The Dark Mod
If you don't see a difference, chances are, you got an error when trying to switcgh between them and actually only saw one of them all the time.