RPGista
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Posts posted by RPGista
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@ SiyahParsomen
Thanks a lot, really glad you had all those good impressions of the mission, even though appearently you didnt read any of the story?
Its your choice, like I said, wether to read and interact with the story or not, your mission is to get the ring, but it would make it easier for you to understand whats going on inside the inner alley. The "bad guys" are actually the gang who is operating inside the barn. If you hit the thug that comes your way when you are going down the alley the first time, you'll see he has a letter on his belt, explaining the gang's plan, and why they have the box in their possession. The peasants are afraid of them but minding their own business. All others will basicly protect their houses.The church is working fine then, its supposed to be like that, you have to be creative to find your way!
The drawings were an experiment, been years since I drew for this kind of thing. Good that you liked them, and that you somehow understood the message without reading.
I was wondering what room did you think was a secret, because there really arent any.
Some are tougher to find, and some pretty tough to enter, but nothing is really secret. There are a couple of "secret" objectives though, it depends on what you do during the mission to acomplish them (one is kind of a consequence for an action, the other is completely optional (has to do with the box)).Thanks for the review!
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Thanks boys (and girls, sorry Thiefette!), it was a lot of work, but I think I'm satisfied with it.
A note:
Some of the testers were confortable with the map, others however were getting frustrated by some of the obstacles, and they are experienced players; some amount of experimenting and reloading is to be expected, do not despair if you feel you are stuck, post here and I'll give instructions as to how to proceed.
This is not exactly a typical mission - forget about gosthing, or never being seen; there are no penalties for being spotted, besides having to face the consequences if your not quick enough to fool your enemies. The stealth score in this mission is meaningless. Just be observant of the environment, and you should find a way, eventually. All obstacles are beatable and all situations manageable, I've made sure of that after countless tries.
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Very nice... I for one fully endorse the subject you are trying to study and change (AI perception of moving objects and lit ones), as I always felt it was a huge gap you must force yourself never to perform in order to not loose immersion. If you guys can, like Grayman said, sit down and find a simple solution that cover all repercussions, that would be amazing!
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Looks pretty awesome to me, very nice...
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- Popular Post
- Popular Post
"In remembrance of him"
version 2.0
You are a nameless hero, who was asked for help by someone you feel deep compassion for. Your plan is to avoid the streets and head towards your goal through the nearby buildings and inner alleys. Unfortunately for you, the area is not a peaceful one this night in particular.
This is not meant to be a classic Thief-like mission, though I believe all the major elements are there; its meant to be more of an adventure where the player has freedom to move inside the available space in different ways, can choose to confront or to sneak past challenges, to get involved with the characters around him and explore, or to avoid any detour and head directly for his objective; he will also be faced with obstacles to his progress that will have to be overcome using a mix of dexterity and logical thinking.
This is not a mission for beginners, ironically - there will be very little equipment other than your weapons, and you will need reasonable knowledge of your character's physical skills and limits (jumping, mantling), as well as being able to easily interact with objects, in order to succeed. Some of the encounters with enemies might also be difficult. Not every person will be aggressive towards the player, however. It is possible to find peaceful folks gathering outside, minding their own business. Of course, everyone who catches you invading their homes will defend themselves, and they might unite to face you. Others will be hostile to the player on sight - approach anyone outside with care; don't trust dangerous men carrying heavy weaponry. You don't need to kill any innocents to fulfil your goal.
Images
Building time
Version 2.0 (as of July 2013, revised to work properly with TDM 1.08 and newer versions)
List of changes:
Revised texturing on several places, as well as adding some more grime on surfaces that were left too bare.
Added detail on streets and some inside spaces.
Added new models (benches, vegetation).
Added new speech sounds for 2 NPC characters (thanks to Bikerdude for the narration).
Revised readables.
Some of the plataform elements were made easier to get through.
Aesthetics tweaks (more varied voice sets for AI, some more light sources and architectural details here and there, adjustments to light values, etc.).
This mission was started shortly before the The Dark Mod's Beginner Contest was announced, and was adjusted and developed to be released for it as my first mapping effort (ever).
The map took, in total, around 5 intense months to complete (December - April 2012), not counting the time spent learning and getting used to the tools and mechanics of map creation (which was going on before that).
Help
- There is a fair bit of mantling needed to overcome some of the obstacles in the map, and sometimes the way forward might not be very clear. You need to look for a logical way to proceed, and trust in your ability to jump and hold on to any structural element or building part that seems to be inside your reach, and seems big enough for you to stand on, or is shaped like something you could hold on to.
- This is not exactly a typical mission - forget about gosthing, or never being seen; there are no penalties for being spotted, besides having to face the consequences if your not quick enough to fool your enemies. The stealth score in this mission is meaningless.
- Some of the testers were confortable with the map, others however were getting frustrated by some of the obstacles, and they are experienced players; some amount of experimenting and reloading is to be expected, do not despair if you feel you are stuck, just be observant of the environment, and you should find a way, eventually. All obstacles are beatable and all situations are manageable.
- Dont forget to adjust your gamma slightly if you feel the map is darker than what is confortable - its common to need to adjust the gamma a bit for each map, as they generally have different lighting design.
- Some characters might be specially alert when you find them, and might have increased senses. If you find that an enemy seems almost impossible to fool, don't trust the shadows to hide you, run for physical cover instead and wait for your chance.
- Use moveable objects to your advantage; you can place them somewhere and climb them in order to reach a high point, you can use objects to create a noise and distract someone, or you can pick up candles as a source of light to help you move around in dark areas.
- Readables are supposed to tell the story of the map and of its different situations. If you are only after your objective, all you need to do is avoid any contact with the characters and keep finding your way foward. There's no secret information in any readable, nothing you need to know. They are there just to add to the atmosphere and they will (hopefully) explain what is happening in each section of the map, if you are interested. There is one book in there which is optional even in my own sense, its not part of the story and wasnt written by me (its a fairly long one). Its there also for atmosphere and for its content, which some might find interesting.
- There are two alternative pathways to your final destination (the chapel); one is harder but easier to reach and spot; the other is harder to spot but much more relaxed once you reach it. (Hint: they can both be reached from the same area)
Walkthrough
- What is happening on the map:
The merchant on the first red brick house you see owns the plot you are about to invade, and rents the houses for the small community that lives besides his house, who are also mostly his workers. His factory is on the first floor of that long building, which contains several apartments. After bad luck and unfair persecution, he is now ruined and preparing to leave his house. At the same time, there's a gang of thieves that took possession of an abandoned barn down the alley, who are just waiting for reinforcements in order to invade and pillage the factory and then his house. Some of the peasants are aware of the thieves' presence, but think it safer to just mind their own business. Across the buildings separating the plot from the churchyard, you'll find a lone priest depositing body pieces in an open grave. This is Richard's body, which was mangled by a zombie the priest has been housing and protecting, because he was someone he loved. You'll need to find a way into the crypt he was being kept into, as this is the most likely place to find the rest of Richard's remains (and thus the ring you are after).
- Merchant house (first red brick house): After their conversation, the wife will be going back and forth between her bedroom and the living/dining room, while she waits for her husband to finish his letters. To be able to loot his desk and get his long letter explaining his misfortunes, you'll need to crouch all the way to the window, move the chair to the side, and wait, at the edge of the light beam, for him to eventually look to his side. Then crouch run to his right, where you can also get his bedroom key from his belt.
- Peasant house: most peasant houses are too far for the men standing outside to see you getting inside, but the bottom one is right next to them and you cant get into it without they seeing it and fighting you. You have to distract them somehow with noises or a weapon on the floor (arrow), but be prepared to do the same on the way out because they'll not allow you to go, after seeing you getting out of the house.
- Factory: its on the first floor of the long building, at the bottom of the alley (close to the fire). To get there, notice there's a rope hanging from some kind of lifting structure, over one of the windows. To reach it, you need to bring a bench from one of the houses and place it close by, climb on it, then jump and hold on to the rope.
- Basement: You can first access it by jumping over the collapsed wall midway down the main alley. There's an abandoned courtyard and you can enter the building's basement from there. It is a ruined area full of debris, but maybe you can find something useful here (on easy, there's a fire arrow partly covered by dirt, behind a big broken table). To get out, you need to use the candle to light your way to a blocked door, and then break the boards with your sword.
- Square and Barn areas: This area has been taken over by a local gang of thugs. The square is guarded by an archer, and there are two tough swordmen inside the barn. You most likely saw one of them going up the alley when you were coming down. The gang leader has a coin box in his possession that belongs to the peasants/merchant. There are two routes leading from this dead end - one involves jumping to the broken balcony that is over the botton of the stairs leading from the square/courtyard, then jumping and climbing the longer structural beam tops that are sticking out of the wall, and then getting into an apartment through the glass window; the other involves going into the barn, up the stairs and out of it again through a balcony, from where you can jump to the neighbouring building, hold on to a cornice and enter the derelict building through an old window.
EDIT: video demonstration of possible ways to overcome both paths:
Route 1 (through the derelict building):
Route 2 (through the couple's kitchen):
- The apartment: You'll get into this area through the kitchen window, and you'll see a woman preparing some kind of late meal. She will then sit down in the living room area, facing the other extreme. You can crouch right in front of her and she might get a little suspicious. Keep going untill you are close to the door in the other end from where she is, open it, and wait for her to look away, still in the shadows. Then enter the room.
- Derelict building: This area demands some cold blood; theres a ruined wall in front of you, a doorway to your right, run and jump from it, holding on to a long beam on the right wall. From its top, jump to the beam opposite this one; from there, run and jump to the hole on the far wall, you'll most likely hurt yourself but you should be able to hold on to the pavement boards and pick yourself up (Prince of Persia style). If you happen to fall in the middle of the building, not all is lost, you can still climb a very large wood beam that is inclined against the wall and jump to the same hole, from its top. You'll end up on a broken balcony. To your right and below, there's a window and a drain pipe right next to it. Jump and hold on to it. Open the window from there, and jump through it when its open.
- Church area: As you aproach the church through the cemetery, a priest will appear, walk to an open grave, deposit something there and get back inside the chapel. It is a body piece. You can choose the explore the priest's chambers. Inside the church, there's an altar where the priest is going to be at, mostly, and an entrance to your left (as you go in the direction of the altar). Going down through it will take you to the chapel's crypt, where Richard should be. After several events, you are left with the challenge of defeating or luring outside a nasty enemy (possibly also risking alerting the priest, if he is still there). You can then bring a light source with you (there are several in the area), and look for Richard's body. By now it should be clear what happened to him - he was being fed to the creature and you caught the priest getting rid of the pieces. You'll find Richard's remains inside the crypt alcove where the zombie was being held. The arm bone is the interesting one for you. The ring is beneath it. It is sometimes pretty hard to lift the arm bones, they seem to get "stuck" and wont move. Luckly, you can still frob the ring from between the fingers, look closely and you'll see it there. From here you can simply walk to the chapel's main gate (opposite the altar) and the mission will be completed.
Credits
(in alphabetical order)
This mission would never be possible if not for the help of the entire TDM community, specially:
Bikerdude - For additional in-game speech, general help and for going over the map helping me spot and solve several technical issues.
Fidcal - For solving dozens of problems (too many to name), as well as for teaching me about the conversation system, which allowed me to achieve some very specific effects that I needed (thus saving the mission).
Grayman - For general help, for donating an awesome breakable object prefab that I included in this mission, and for helping me with the briefing.
Sotha - For general help, and for patiently teaching me about the briefing system.
Springheel - For helping with AI customising, and for creating a complex test map that taught me a lot about animations.
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Baddcog, Melan, Simplenoob and Sir Taffsalot for making an effort to beta test and give suggestions, in short notice.
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And last but not least, to the genius TDM team for developing this great and inspiring game, and for providing a huge amount of open assets and information to allow you to create your own ideas.
DISCLAIMER
This mission contains an excerpt of "Superstition In All Ages (1732)" by baron d' Paul Henri Thiry Holbach, a public domain book that can be found on the Project Gutenberg web-site (http://www.gutenberg...7-h/17607-h.htm), and that can be distributed freely.
The mission also contains new sounds found on the Freesound.org web-site, produced by user Syna-max (http://www.freesound...eople/Syna-Max/), thanks for making these high quality sounds available for everyone.
Download
http://www.mediafire...q13iidqqlig1w33
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/17706561/remembrance.pk4
*** The HELP section is being constantly updated with explanations, check it first if you have any issues with the mission. There is also a Walkthrough section in case you got stuck. ***
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Sorry, I expressed it wrongly. I have one ambient world light covering the map. Each room has its own info location entity, with a light level that is equal to the ambient light. There are spaces that are to have lower values than the standard level shared by most of the rooms, so those have different values on their respective entities. Going in and out lowers the light and gets them back to normal gradually; this works fine for ME on all occasions.
Two testers have now confirmed that this system works but only on either enhanced or simple ambient renderer settings. If set to normal, the location settings are not enforced and all you get is the general ambient world light, which ruins this map completely.
I need to know if theres something to be done about this, if its a tdm thing or if I missed something. I dont think I can release the map and expect people to read through some readme text explaning this; if they happen to play it on normal renderer, they'll get a completely different experience than the one intended, and its not even supported (things happen in the darkness you are not supposed to see).
EDIT- noticed the ambient light was badly named, maybe I just forgot to save when I was going through it after importing the map to the startpack one... Could this be part of the issue?
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Okay, this is getting depressing - I was about to release this mission at lunch but I got a report that if you play with your ambient rendering set on "normal", all of a sudden info location settings for dynamic ambient lights stop working and you get a constant bright ambient light, which Im assuming is the world ambient light that is still there. I NEED for certain places to go darker than the general ambient light level, so what I did was to set an ambient light level on all info location for all areas, changing just the ones that need to be different. In my laptop, I can even delete the ambient world light and it will work normally, but a while back I found out other computers will show the lack of an ambient world light regardless of the location settings. Anyway, the tester says that if you set the renderer to enhanced, the location system will behave correctly, but none of the other testers experienced this, and one even plays with the renderer on "simple", and had no issues. Regardless of what renderer setting *I* play on, they always work. So Im at a loss here. Is this normal with dynamic ambient lights? How am I supposed to force this on players who WONT read any instructions and might happen to have the renderer set to normal? I need to solve this before releasing the damn map.
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But yeah, Simplenoob is right, time to rest man... Im wasted. Tomorrow I'll release it (whenever I get confirmation there are no more errors), so lets just say Im finally coming to the party, fashionably late.
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I understand completely SeriousToni, you needent apologize. There are two things to keep in mind in MY case though, and I'll come back to your point later - when the contest started I had already designed (with a lot of bold choices, of course!
) my map, which would be coming before I even knew about it. It wasnt meant to be included inside this tight time frame, but at there were talks about the contest in the forums and I thought it would be a good way of discovering new talent so I decided to adjust my ambitions to the time available so that I could be one more participant, as we needed examples to attract others. My mission is not inside any rules. It is just my first mission, and I wanted to make it from the start a bit different from the norm and exploring things like physical puzzles, linear but divided paths, relatable characters (with a sad tone) and some more complex AI behaviour than your generic go here, go there, go here, go there guard. I ended up with a HUGE amount of stuff to learn, and I can safely say, now that the mission is completed, that I spent 70% of the time trying to learn, figure out, reverse engineer stuff in the game, rather than actually tweaking or implementing it. And I spent a LOT of time creating my architecture, so you can imagine the number of hours lost just to get to know the engine. I believe its a mistake to say you can make a tdm mission in a couple of weeks, like it is sometimes suggested. The examples used to show that come from guys with huge knowledge of the engine and/or map making (Greebo, Melan, Fidcal, etc). It takes a lot of time to understand this stuff, let alone design and make it interesting. In my case, working mostly 10 hours a day, your left with weekends which can make it really hard to keep up the progress.The mission is ready right now, and has been for several days, just solving issues and waiting for reports from betatesters. As for your point, Im not surprised many people gave up along the way, I imagine after being confronted with this very difficulty I just spoke about. You guys should be happy you kept at it and you had the capacity to create your vision and also respect a set of rules and a deadline. And from what i see, coming up with awesome products! So you guys should be proud and happy, regardless. I didnt enter the competition to really "win" or to "compete", it was mostly an excuse to map and to give me a defined structure, Im actually glad I finished it when I did or I would have spent many more months doing essentially the same, as the mission is pretty much how I imagined it. Anyway, sorry if you felt my mouth was bigger than my actions, I was trying to keep the whole thing interesting during these months, but I dont think I ever bragged I was doing awesome, if anything I was always pointing out all the problems I still had to solve and that it was going to be pretty hard finishing it. Well, with help from a lot of knowledgeable guys, its finally done, and I hope you and others will find it interesting.
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Haha, no need for despair my friend (leave that to us!
), its not like I can rush my beta testers, I have to wait on the feedback to release a bug free mission. It will be here as soon as we all agree it is ready. -
Indie studios maybe? Faster at work than community efforts like TDM/Broken Glass, but less money than lumbering dinosaurs that make more playable movies than games.
I guess thats probably what they mean, since it is clearly the tendency today - a story driven interactive movie instead of a preexisting, complex static world where you connect the dots and fill the story with a bit of your own imagination.
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Wow, I did it somehow! Yes, maybe the triggering of the visibility entity was doing something to the exit obj, now that it is visible, I can finally have it working correctly! I also put the path corners of a certain AI well away from the exit brush, just in case it wont flag it like you said (though it shouldnt, only idPlayer). Now only small things to take care of, and Im done... Thanks a lot.
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To be fair, both of them start the Map pathless. A trigger set on motion by the player activates a "conversation" set of actions that at the end sends them to a path network, maybe that has an influence. Will carry out some tests, thanks for the tips and sorry for the constant questioning, just wanted to release this asap (wairing for beta testers feedback).
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Another minor thing Im getting - after giving a couple of unarmed AI path routes, they are now unable/unwilling to flee to their flee points for some reason, even though they were doing it just fine when they had no path network. They will just stand there after sounding the alarm...
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Sent you guys a message.
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I do have the get object as a condition for the exit one. It still ends the mission as soon as I frob it. I'll try to make it "optional" (not mandatory) but still a condition for the exit one, or the player might leave prematurely if he goes in that direction...
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Thats what has been keeping me then, he simply cant unlock the door... Didnt see that coming. He can easily open it when unloacked, but I had to lock exactly because the player could leave it open, so since he would frob it two times, it would look dumb for him to instead of opening, close the doors, then stare at them, then open again and leave. I made sure the player wouldnt have time to lockpick it before he went into the room (triggered event), but now I'll have to think of something else quickly. Thanks for the clarification guys.
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Yeah... can unlock1 for one door, can unlock2 for the other, and can unlock3 for the house door.
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I would ask if anyone is free for a limited play test before public release - I would really like to hear from a native speaker because Im mostly interested not only on mission feedback but also on a revision on all readables, as I wrotte them myself, and there should be things to correct in there. The point is to send a packaged mission to be played, so at least beta testers will be able to have the intended play experience if they choose to help.
Bump
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Any reason why a path interact wouldnt be able to open a wardrobe door? I have given the character can unlock for one door, for both doors, have locked both doors or just the peer master, no combination seems to work, he tries but the doors wont open (it works if its unlocked).
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I have tested my exit system and it does work - i was able to exit correctly through the brush ONCE. By tweaking with the objectives because others werent working, this one is getting skipped by the previous mandatory objective, a get item which is supposed to enable the exit one and also make it visible. When i get the item, the mission is completed. The only difference i can see from other examples is that the exit objective is not visible, and the get item targets a set visibility entity when completed in order to make the exit one show up. Been days of this, finally all others are working, except this is happening.
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Sounds like a brilliant idea, absolutely needed by guys like me! One small reservation, however: I remember you mentioning you were thinking about working with Blender for the tutorial, and though it isnt as encompassing as yours aims to be, Katsbits has a getting started blender tutorial with the same principle (making a (very simple in that case) chair in blender, up to texturing and optimising). The model is very simple and Im sure this one would be awesome to learn the techniques not mentioned there (working with high polys, modelling complex stuff, getting it all game ready), as well as having a community tutorial, just saying that there might be other things to work on too - I would also suggest something that I didnt really find much about (though Katsbits does mention it briefly in some tutorials): how to model map architecture in a modeler and then making it playable inside the engine, like a small house for example, or a tunnel, or an exterior piece (like arcturus moving grass test map), those could also be pretty interesting!
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Hey, thats an amazing recover there Xarg! Press on, it will feel good to finish it and making all that work available. I'm pretty much finished with the map too, only waiting on some help from biker on making my objectives work properly. I'll do one more "detail pass" in the meantime, but I would ask if anyone is free tomorrow morning (or as soon as I can pack up a beta version) for a limited play test before public release - I would really like to hear from a native speaker because Im mostly interested not only on mission feedback but also on a revision on all readables, as I wrotte them myself, and there should be things to correct in there. The point is to send a packaged mission to be played, so at least beta testers will be able to have the intended play experience if they choose to help.
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I actually think the side view is the best view for this animation, because you cant notice the small seam that happens when the second step hits the floor (that was already greatly minimised by Arcturus), and it flows very well... If only there could be small adjustments to the head direction (it should indeed face the player, and not be so inclined IMHO), and maybe the weapon angle because of the clipping thing, this would be an awesome addition, great work.
Fan Mission: In remembrance of him (by RPGista)
in Fan Missions
Posted · Edited by RPGista
@ Simplenoob
Yes, the priest and Kevin are connected. There are only hints (like his behaviour when you get to the church), you are supposed to infer whats happening there, and that will also help you to discover how to find the ring.
Glad you guys are enjoying the mantling, took some testing to get it right, and some thinking to make it challenging, and not too obvious. I never tried to get back to the courtyard before, I guess we can all trust you to find every gap in the maps geometries!
I'll try not to give the coin box away: there is actually a way to physically drop the box in the environment after you collect it in your inventory - its the default "r" key for me. This will make it appear on your hands, from where it can be manipulated and dropped with the frob key. "Using" the box wont work here. Think about it, the merchant is leaving that same night, he is not gonna go back to the factory. There might be an obvious place for him to find the box later in the evening, when he decides to pack and leave...
If you read their letters, you will know that Jon was their trusted employee (hes mentioned a couple of times), and also the thugs mention him (spoiler from the previous post: If you hit the thug that comes your way when you are going down the alley the first time, you'll see he has a letter on his belt, explaining the gang's plan, and why they have the box in their possession.) Additional hint: the right spot does have something to do with a related readable.
EDIT: Just saw the pics, how did you get there?! I thought I had nocliped all that area? And no, of course your not meant to be there hehe. Theres nothing there.
Thanks for the nice words (and all the work!)