Viktoria

No, I'm not a troll. I was already a member here before the discussion relating to the poll.

I am not in any battle. I'm a lover, not a fighter. Personally, I like the rules on the Eidos boards. I think they are sensible enough without being OTT. EDIT: To whom it may concern. Absolutely no falsehood from me.... just the usual nonsense from you. Favourites can change over time... and really, only 1pt between TDP and TMA just confirms how much I like these two games in pretty much equal measure. EDIT2: What I stated about Eidos ToU, infractions and bans absolutely is true. If people need to seek clarification on any member they believe was banned without good reason, all they have to do is contact admin. I would suggest the person who is worried here do just that and report back here with their findings.

Yeah, I get you. I can't explain any more than I have. If I've failed miserably; so be it. Thank you both very much... sounds good. Decisions. Decisions. I've yet to finish Thief and I'm off to London for a few days soon but I'm sure I'll be free to fire one of them up not long after. PS. Regarding the person here who insists on creating a nuisance of himself with his usual hyperbole by implying that I lie, people only need to go and check old fan mission threads. I recall asking someone (NH perhaps?) about problems with clunky mechanics and lack of rope arrow. I also remember one mission where a rope arrow finally featured (early days again)... but it kept sticking and couldn't be retrieved. Something like that. Sorry I can't remember the exact details... but I know that history happened; so it is the truth. EDIT: Also, I know of no mod who issues ToU violation penalty or bans people for reasons that are either personal or invalid. Ultimately, it is the user who bans themselves after exhausting all warnings and 100 points. The truth.

I have played more than one. I played a couple back in the day but wasn't that impressed so went back to T1/T2 missions using Darkloader/Garrettloader. So I think my vote is fair. I certainly would like to play one of the more recent missions. Any recommendations? Something close to the first two games would suit me... and preferably with a thieve's highway.

I don't believe people are less critical over there. Have you read the thread? The edit I made added the words "to hear" into my sentence. I'm not saying they care which way I voted. It was the nonsense reasons given for me apparently voting the way I did. Again, all this information comes after the fact and I'm fine agreeing TDM is a game. But for the purpose of that poll, its impossible to vote for it because "it", for me, would depend on the missions played.

Yes, I expect to hear whatever people wish to say. That's what happens on forums and, yes, I'd expect to be called out more here. That's fine.

Why is not informed; given the reasons I stated when I voted? TDM isn't a game to me; but even if I thought it was a "game" at the time of voting, I would still not have voted for it because I would only be able to judge it based on particular missions.

I didn't come here to "defend" any position though... just to explain why I excluded TDM from that poll... and, yeah, I stand by all the reasons I stated. People can choose to agree or disagree; that's fine. I expected as much on this forum, obviously.

EDIT: to AB It is my personal opinion though. I may have barely touched TDM, but I have touched it. As for being a mod; its irrelevant. Plenty of other people share the same view as mine and they're not mods. Take from it what you will.

That's fine. Sorry for that double-post earlier... I had to respond to an edit.

I've explained the reasons for disqualifying in that particular poll, I don't see it as a game compared to the other options.

That quote discusses a game I have never heard of or played.

I need to play each mission in order to vote for them in a poll. Well, I did play one or two other TDM missions way back in the day and I wasn't that impressed... I went back to the T1/2 missions. It was the early days though. If I recall, control was slow and clunky and I don't think there were any rope arrows then.

Yeah, no doubt.

I haven't played them all... but I have played it.

I'm not refusing to acknowledge that its a game if that is what it is.... its just in that particular poll, I couldn't view it as a game - at least not on-par with the other options given. Dishonored and Thief have characters and a story and I can play through from beginning to end. My judgement of TDM would be down to what missions I loaded up and played.... so that is why I could only vote on the missions themselves. Admittedly, I'm not that experienced with TDM. I have only played one mission to date as I find myself addicted to the T1, TG and T2 fan missions.

Its not a claim, its just my personal view. I can't offer up any technical reasons for my pov... any more than I can tell you about what the engine is doing under the bonnet of my sportscar. I just love to drive her. I just don't view TDM as a game proper.... I only see the fan mission experience as the actual game part, if you like, because that is the part I get to play.

I'm saying I'm obviously not the only person who is confused as to whether TDM is a game (proper) - hence the FAQs asking/answering that very question... "Is it a game?" and this thread, "Is TDM a game?" The fact that's its called "mod" doesn't help I guess and a new name (I suggested "The Dark M0od" ) might be a good idea. Firstly, its not my poll so I can't edit it. I believe OP can't do so either because there is a short time limit for creating and editing polls. Secondly, each fan mission is the work of the respective creator(s) and therefore all differ in content and quality. I would have to consider each individually in order to score their value fairly.

I thought FAQs threads contain the most common questions from people - and the answers to said questions. Did I misunderstand?

"Is Thief a game?" would be a better comparison. I can imagine the fun in that thread. Anyway, back to the issue. I always consider it is the fan mission itself I "play". FAQs, means frequently asked questions - from other people.

I am afraid I have little technical understanding of TDM. I just view it as a platform where I load different fan missions and play them. If that is too simple a view of it, fair enough. I haven't played any of the missions since it went "standalone"... so maybe I need to get my head around that.

Yes, I realise that commercial wasn't specifically stipulated, but as I read the words 'contemporary stealth game' together with the options this is how my mind read it; as the other options were commercial games. No insult intended. Call it logic or confusion; but not entirely my fault because TDM faqs itself asks if TDM is a game or a toolkit. http://www.thedarkmod.com/faq/ So, as its true definition is questioned, I figured that it can't be just a game and only a game.... any more than it is just a toolkit and only a toolkit. TDM FAQs defines it as both which is fair enough, so I stated in the other thread that people can therefore define it as a game, a toolkit/platform, both, or neither... or whatever as they see fit. I define it more as a toolkit/platform

To continue our contribution to this futile discussion... I pretty much agree with all you say. I would only disagree with the conclusion that nobody is going to see/hear/understand the views of other people. That possibility always remains.

I'm not at all sure why you consider the relaying of facts a 'squirm'; but up to you how you define the discussion. It is also a fact that some here have put forward nonsense and hyperbole as to the reasons why I have the opinion I do. I have my own point of view on TDM, just as others do who share or don't share it; and that's all there is to it. I'm no different to anyone else.

I stand by my views on TDM in regard to the poll. I voted for Thief because it was the only contemporary game I prefer from the options given. There is absolutely no reason for anyone to be upset about my opinions. The nonsense reasons put forward by some here as to why I hold this view is derailing this otherwise interesting discussion.