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New Horizon

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Posts posted by New Horizon

  1. I had mentioned this somewhere a long time ago, but I was part of a farmers market project years ago.  In order to protect ourselves, we formed a type of cooperative where our organization, Empress Merchants, could be disolved and no individual held responsible for any debts.  As it turned out, the business failed and we had to do just that.  I wasn't involved in the day to day running of the market but I took care of the debt collectors who tried to threaten us.  Once I told them the type of cooperative we had and that it had been disolved....they went away.

    I don't know if that would work for a broken glass cooperative but might be worth looking into if someone in Canada is so inclined.

    • Like 3
  2. Yeah, replacing the frob helper with a disable outline can't really hurt.  I personally haven't had much of an issue with frob and brighter light in too many instances.  If people want the classic look, it wouldn't hurt to make outlines easy to turn off.  

    • Like 3
  3. Who wants to go through every possible loot item and reskin them to ensure they are recognizable as loot?  In theory it would be wonderful to have all of the assets refreshed in order to avoid measures to assist players but that's going to be one hell of a lot of work to put into place.

    Who has the time, energy and dedication to do it?  It's perfectly reasonable to argue the point but will those arguing the point step up and assist in the work?

    • Like 2
  4. 3 hours ago, grayson said:

    Hi this is Graymans son

    My father was a poet, a painter, a writer, and a giant nerd. He studied nuclear physics, aerospace engineering, and AI. But all he really wanted to do was play video games. He recently lost a very long war with Cancer. 

    My dad has a little plaque you all sent him hanging on the wall next to handprints from his grandchildren. Whenever my children would call him he'd talk to them about "his boring video game stuff" according to my 8 year old... who never really understood why Grayman didn't like Pokemon as much as he did.

    I found a file on his computer stating that the last few levels he was working on 95%, 95%, and 50% finished. He also said working with another dev would take up too much time that he wanted to spend with his family instead. To be fair I worked with my father my entire life on random things (including Doom mods back in the day) and he never thought anything was finished. So I'd personally consider the two 95% missions to basically be done. If whoever he sent them to to Beta test wanted to share them with the development team I don't think he'd really mind and you shouldn't feel guilty if you do. I'll leave that up to you guys, but I will not be uploading them and they should not be posted publicly. The final mission will remain unfinished though. I will mention that it was going to be pretty damn good from what I read in his notes.

    He did ask that two levels that weren't related to the Steele missions do get uploaded to the abandoned level archive. I am in the process of doing that now. 



    You're father will be dearly missed and I am so very sorry for your loss.  I lost my own father back in 2006.  It leaves quite a void.

    Thank you for taking the time to come to the forums.

    • Like 1
  5. Hey folks.

    This Month, I have joined a running group in the Million Reasons Run.  It is collecting money for the Sick Kids Foundation which will then give that money to children's hospitals and related organizations in Canada.  

    Today, all donations will be matched dollar for dollar...so your 10 dollar donation or whatever you choose to donate, will be doubled.  So yeah, I am asking for money but it's a great cause.

    If you choose to donate, just use the link below and it will take you to my fundraising page!  


    Thanks! :)






    • Like 3
  6. Could the issue be remedied by taking into account how much of the player is blocked by an object + lightgem level + distance.  The game already takes distance + lightgem level into account when determining how quickly the guards react.  A further check could ease things a bit.  Deadly Shadows was able to handle it that way.  It checked something like 12 individual points on the player model

  7. Can it just brighten the item like classic Thief and then  subtly outline it?  The thing that turns me off about what I'm seeing is that we're back to solid colors overlaid on items as they were in Deadly Shadows.  In the early days of the Mod I figured out the whole material stage brightening to replicate classic Thief and it was then improved / modified over the years but of course all those material shaders are a pain.

    My only request is to please not go the TDS style route.  I think the outlines as springheel suggested would be nice.

  8. Well, obviously the textures are going to be higher res but still retain some semblance of the originals.  Models could be higher poly count but not outrageous.  I think with Thief, the look of the game was actually part of what made it work.  I honestly think there is a market for it.

    The engine still exists and New Dark has been updated quite a bit already.  The main thing though is that all the proven systems...sound / visual...they're already in place.  Improvements can be made...and the engine already had some unused enhancements that just didn't get ironed out before the release of Thief 2. 

    There was an early facial animation system in place, some early work on bump mapping...all kinds of tid bits that could be expanded upon and still deliver a Thief game will all the things that made it great.

    It's an artistic choice in todays Market.  It's no longer about all games must use the latest and greatest, developers can choose which style best suits the tone of the game they're trying to make.

    • Like 2
  9. 2 hours ago, chakkman said:

    How many copies do you think will it sell with such an antiquated tech?

    You say that motion capturing of Thief served no purpose. Of course it served a purpose. The vast majority of gamers these days are completely visuals centric. That's why you often have a gameplay which is thin like a piece of paper, but the latest awesome graphics tech. Games like Assassins Creed more or less play automatically while the player "enjoys" it like a movie.

    Times change, and people changed. That's the main issue. But, frankly, I don't think Thief attracted the mig mass, even back then. You say it was a commercial success. The question is, on which scale? Highly doubt that it was as successful as stuff like Half-Life.

    I think you missed my point.

    What did that extra expense add to the Thief gameplay?  Did it serve the type of game Thief is?  I don't believe it did.  It continued the Deadly Shadows trend of limiting player movement and choice.  

    They scaled Thief up to a AAA budget...a niche title...and in doing so watered it down to the point where it really didn't stand out anymore.

    I test games for a living.  I've seen all kinds come through our doors and there is a very decent market for games that 'look' retro but play on modern systems.  I've tested games inspired by classics like Ghouls and Ghosts, Quake, etc.  There have been some recent games built using 20+ year old tech that has been modestly updated to retain the aesthetic of those older titles but still be a modern game.  

    Basically, that look for a game is no longer seen as a limitation, it's an artistic choice.  It's a style.  

    So, for the type of game Thief is...my suggestion would be to NOT scale it up to AAA costs but rather work within the style that best serves the game and the gameplay.  The costs would be lower, production time would be shorter.   The studio wouldn't have to push as many units to break even and they might even make a decent profit given how games can be more easily distributed on Steam now.

    • Like 2
  10. On 3/8/2021 at 9:01 AM, chakkman said:

    The question is, who in a sane mind state would publish something like that? Even the original Thief's weren't really financial successes, let alone in 2021, where the stealth genre is dead. Well, deader than dead.

    TDM is as good as it gets in that regard. You won't see a new Thief, that's for sure.

    Thief The Dark Project was definitely a financial success and a critical success as well at the time.  The problem was that Looking Glass was already in bad shape financially and Thief's success was far too late to save the company.

    The issue with making a game like Thief today is a studio like Eidos Montreal insisting that it be a multi-million dollar AAA title, when it's not really that type of game.  It's more of an indie title.  Can you imagine how much all that motion capture cost to produce?  Did it serve the game beyond being eye candy?

    I personally think a game like Thief is a prime candidate for a release that actually uses the original engine, updated somewhat, but holding onto the visual style of the original games.  A retro look.  It has been done in recent years and seems to have been well received. 

    I think we're past the  point of having to constantly update the graphics and can instead focus on choosing a style that best suits the game.  Thief just felt right in the dark engine, kind of a product of the time.  I think when you take it out of that, it loses a lot of the character

    • Like 1
  11. On 2/11/2021 at 2:01 PM, Zerg Rush said:

    Just a little suggestion for the loot. Wouldn't it be possible to add when stealing something, not only the amount stolen until then, but also the total amount available in the mission?
    This is how you know, if it is worthwhile to continue searching, before finishing the mission. It is a bit frustrating to finish a mission and only then know that only half of the available loot has been achieved.

    That has come up before.  The reason TDM doesn't tell you what remains in the level is because there is no way the player would realistically know this.  I dunno, I feel it adds to the replayability not knowing.  There have been so many times in Thief that I've gone back to a mission years later and found a piece of loot that I had no idea I had missed.

    • Like 2
  12. 41 minutes ago, Filizitas said:

    There is lots of info here and long texts that so mistake me if i didnt read it.

    But is it true that we and the thief community dont have a modding codex?
    Is there no context driven codex for tdm?

    TDM is by now almost 12 years old, you could still set a codex of rules up for it.
    I think that would help alot. Make every mission from that point on that wants onto the tdm list dependant on a codex.

    It has pretty much always been handled as it was in the Thief Modding community.  Ask for permission to use and if permission is given, list your sources.

    The issue here is really an edge case and not the norm.  It really doesn't make sense to enact such protections in such a small community.  We operate in good faith here.  

    It feels like a big ask to develop and incorporate such encryption into the mod as an option and to remove a very helpful export feature from Dark Radiant.

    I don't mean to dismiss the concerns but given the small size and generally considerate conduct of this community, I don't think it's warranted.

  13. If the incident from Discord is what I think it is, that issue involved someone repeatedly making unapproved artistic and gameplay changes to other users WIP maps when they had only been given permission to do some performance optimization.  We're talking major gameplay and map design changes and when those major changes weren't embraced, that user would become angry that their efforts, unwanted as they were, might not be embraced.

    If this is more if an aesthetic thing, I would say just ask people not to use the high quality assets from you FM.  Heck, add a Pop up screen after the TDM logo on mission launch telling people not to use these assets as they do not meld well due to their higher quality.  Then release the lower quality versions.

    The majority of the community is respectful and it's small.  Thinking in terms of numbers here....we don't have hundreds of mappers.  

    This tiny community has lasted 20 years for a reason. Trust and mutual respect.

    If you don't want your assets folded into the core mod for distribution, that's fine too but I stand by my earlier post.  Encryption doesn't fit our model... outdated as openly sharing may be...it is the heart of our community.

    Ask and the majority will respect your wishes.

    • Thanks 1
  14. 14 hours ago, JackFarmer said:

    Erin: "I am better than you, you cannot teach me anything!!!"

    Garrett: "It's not about how much you steal, but what and how you steal."


    I stopped where you had to escape from a burning building.

    To this day I have not understood how they could screw it up so badly. But then I remember that someone from the forum once mentioned he met with Eidos people in Montreal and some of them didn't even know what Thief was. That certainly doesn't explain everything, but quite a lot.

    Yeah, Eidos Montreal was a train wreck.  The Thief Source code was given to them twice in order to try and get the right people to approve officially releasing it to the fans.  They lost it both times.  Infuriating.  They were just the wrong people for the job.

    • Like 2
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