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Slow down, NH. See above post. We should be very careful about not letting our own enthusiasm dictate what we show the public. We could post something like this in our own public forums, but I wouldn't make it a public release, UNLESS it was combined with some other things, like mentioned above. In all seriousness, if we had the following: The bedroom map (in-game, with fire going), The ability for objects to vanish when frobbed At the very least, removing the D3 HUD and crosshairs THEN, I think it might be worth releasing a new video. But not until then. IMO, it's better to have people wondering what we're up to than it is to release things that make people (who know nothing about how hard things are) say, "THAT's all you've got so far??"

Okay, since it hasn't been done yet, I'll kick it off. First let me say, I assume this thread is to contain requests out of the ordinary, as stated by sparhawk at the TTLG forums: QUOTE I'm not talking of the standard features like buttons, switches, or similar stuff. Rather I'm thinking of things you might have wanted to implement in an FM but you couldn't because of limitations in the engine or in DromEd as opposed to the obvious, like rope arrows, swimming, etc. So here's a few ideas just to get things going. -random treasure spawns. An author would place a piece of optional treasure, and set a percentage chance that it will appear or not. -optional path nodes (although I think this might already be possible with Dromed). The AI can choose to ignore a node or go on a different, separate path altogether. -AI actions similar to NOLF2. I never played the game myself, but I'd heard they do things that are unexpected, at unexpected times. Many times I've played Thief and thought to myself, "why is that cook just pacing back and forth?" Clearly for gameplay, NOT realism. "Why would a guy just be standing here in a dark room, facing the wall, then turn to the fireplace, back to the wall, back to fireplace, etc?" Again, gameplay, not realism. I'd heard that in NOLF2, AI will often kick a can around, or fidget (already in Thief), or even leave patrol to go to the restroom. That sounds like a fantastic addition that might really lend some tension to the overall experience. -AI ladder climbing. Touchy subject, that, as it eliminates some safety and comfort in the game, but probably a good addition. Okay, there's a few for now. What ideas would you suggest?

If you look for some tutorials you can learn the basics in a few hours. It is really hard to learn when you just want to experiement with it, without looking at a manual. Fomr the big apps you can usually do a lot just by clicking around. Not so with Blender. On the other hand, the interface is asboluelty streamlined to support the workflow. If you learn the keys you must use you can do a lot of stuff in a short time once you are used to it. I saw on the blender forums that there are now also video tutorials available. This might be helpfull. Search on D3World for "blender tutorials" and you can find them easily, there is a direct link to these.

This workflow I highly recommend, not because the 3 programs suggested here are FREE, but because they are the best at what they do, IMO. I love these 3 programs. You will LOVE wings3d for modelling, if you are like me and HATE Blender's nerdy complex interface. (this is from http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/phpBB2/vie...ic.php?p=21397) Where to get these programs: www.wings3d.com (for modelling) CharacterFX www.insanesoftware.de (for animating) Lithunwrap (for texturing) is discontinued and available free at arras's site http://members.lycos.co.uk/arras1/ Also check out arras's site to see what he has been making with this workflow. Bloody awesome game objects. They are all very low poly though, for older systems. Look at the gallery forums at the www.wings3d.com forums to see the high-poly stuff people are making with wings3d. It's just as well suited for low poly as high poly - it has always used the "box modelling" interface, which only the latest versions of big name 3D apps have just made it the new pseudo standard for modelling. The reason this workflow is so good is because each of these programs has a specific purpose (modeling, texturing, and animating) and they are all VERY GOOD and VERY SIMPLE TO USE at what they are for. Ever hard of the term "jack of all trades, master of none"? That doesn't apply to this workflow

I'm gonna have another go, but I'm confined by the programs I have. ZBrush would be fine, if all I had to do was high detail bumpmap stuff, but I need to couple that with lowpoly, and Truespace is just TOO old and feature-lacking to cope. I need Max or Lightwave. Maybe I'll be able to get hold of one or the other. Any recommendations?

I finished the highlight for doors and changed the behaviour for items as well. Now the highlighting works in a uniform way for all entities. As you can see on the screenshot it may not be to nice for ingame, so I would need a texture that can be used for the highlight. Currently I simply use this one for testing: base/textures/base_door/doorlight_grn.tga http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showt...st=0entry4929 I think the texture should probably be just a white one so that it will brighten up the object in a uniform way but with lower brightness. Probably a moderately light gray. If you want to test the texture you can do the following: I used the frobTest.map. In materials/custom.mtr you (Renzatic) added this material description and I added this texture to it. Textures/Dark_Mod/Mansion/Doors/Mansion_Door02 { qer_editorimage Textures/Dark_Mod/Mansion/Doors/Mansion_Door02_ed.tga diffusemap Textures/Dark_Mod/Mansion/Doors/Mansion_Door02_d.tga specularmap Textures/Dark_Mod/Mansion/Doors/Mansion_Door02_s.tga bumpmap Textures/Dark_Mod/Mansion/Doors/Mansion_Door02_local.tga { // if ( parm11 >= 0.5 ) blend add map textures/base_door/doorlight_grn.tga colored } }

Hey I would like to personally thank you for your help on the doom3world forums for various questions I have asked. Thanks for the support and the help! Good Luck on your mod!

Hi this is bad marine ass from the Planetdoom and doom3world.org forums and I just thought I'd stop by to wish you guys good luck. I'm both a Doom and Thief fan, and I can't wait to see what happens when the 2 games get married I'm also a solo modder (current project is Doom 3 Aftermath), that means I do most of the work by myself like mapping, modelling, coding and texturing, and since I'm relatively new to the modding scene, I hope to learn more from teams like yourselves and I'm sure I could help out a bit with you guys if you're too busy or anything. Best of luck to the Dark Mod!

Sure, you can tackle the nobleman. Be sure to check the concept art thread. http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=344 As far as the technical details, that's outside my area of expertise. You'll have to ask either Deep Omega or oDDity about that. As well, oDDity has made available a male and female template which I am encouraging people to use as a base for our characters.

You could jump in at the deep end with the noble man or woman: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=362 http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=344

So the plan right now is to focus on one environment so that we can get a complete map together. Our Mansion Pack is going to need some specific models. I'll list them below, you sign up for whatever you find interesting. This will be our master list for the time being. I'll link these to appropriate reference pictures when I get a chance, and put the names of the people working on them next to them as they sign up. Items with stars beside them have already been spoken for. update: Jan 20th (removed completed models to make navigation easier) Character models ** - House Guard -- oDDity ** Noble Male -- alan9000 -- http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=344 ** - Noble Female -- TYROT http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=362 ** - Servent Male -- oDDity ** - Servant Female -- oDDity Furniture models ** - door handle/lock -- TYROT http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=779 -- ** - desk, large -- oDDity -- Example #1 ** - 4 poster bed -- Atti -- Example #1 ** - end table #1 -- Atti Example #1 - desk chair -- Example #1 ** - bookshelf, wide -- Atti ** - dining table -- Atti http://www.antiquefurniture.us/antique_fur...ining_table.htm ** - fancy sofa -- Fingernail -- Example #1, Example #2 -- WIP Loot items ** - bowl -- Atti Example ** - candlestick holder --Atti Example #1 - spectacles Decorative items ** - chandelier -- ATTi ** - tapestry -- -- oDDity ** - ink pot and quill -- oDDity ** - hunting trophey (mounted head) -- oDDity -- http://www.alexisturner.co.uk/files/file168.jpg ** - mounted weapon/shield -- oDDity -- http://www.long-sword.com/catalog/images/wall.jpg - potted plant #1 -- ** - various small sculptures -- oDDity -- Example1Example2 Other Useful Objects (nice for added atmosphere, but not necessary) ** - hairbrush -- Atti ** - wash basin -- Fingernail ** - chamber pot -- oDDity - door knocker -- Example ** - apple -- oDDity ** - teapot -- oDDity ** - cutlery -- Atti New Other Objects Since our modelers are going through these like mad, here's a list of every other conceivable thing I could think of us needing in a Mansion environment: ** - Small chest (like a jewellery box) (see below) -- oDDity ** - Large chest -- (see below) -- TYROT ** - Small heating stove -- Atti and TYROT Example ** - grandfather clock -- Atti ** - water pump -- Deep Omega Example ** - bathing tub -- Fingernail ** - bucket -- Atti - folded towels/clothing ** - cleaver / kitchen knife -- Atti ** - loaf of bread -- Atti ** - block of cheese -- Atti - cooking cauldron - pig on a spit ** - cooking pot -- Atti - small canisters (for herbs and stuff) - hanging goose ** - beer mug -- Atti ** - ladle -- Deep Omega ** - barrel -- BlackThief - torch bracket -- Example 1 ** - single bed (for servants) -- Atti ** -- KEYS! (how did I forget?) Deep Omega and TYROT -- Individual and ring of. -- Example 1, Example 2

Why oh why wasn't this posted on our forums!? Congrats oDDity.

We will need a loadscreen as well. I just added it to the GUI design document. So please start thinking on some concepts. http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showt...st=0entry3674 Do we want this to have a simple progress bar (like it is done for D3 levels)? I could think that the ornamented bar, that Springheel was showing for health/stamina, could fit rather good. On the other hand I must say that the original design is much more interesting to look at. The one with the clacks and whirling hands, not the boring one from T3. What I have seen from the GUI screens sofar they contain no machinery. Maybe we can add some as this is an important part of the Thief universe and atmosphere.

Gah! Omega, check out the 2 page discussion on this very issue: http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=43 We came up with a number of reasons why this might not be feasible and/or fun.

Or the other thing could be that the shop is a pre-mission map. The question is if this adds really fun if you have to do it all the time. On the other hand it serves as a testbed for map creation. http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=43&st=0 I have a pretty good idea how this could work in terms of game mechanics as it would have been a part of the city section. If there is interest in this I could write up a description how I think it should work.

Great! So it had some effect to do this work. When you post it, please make a new thread though. Makes it easier to keep track and when I look through the forums to collect the consensus for the design.

Great! Could you take look here http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?act=ST&f=3&t=285 and assign or create some concepts for the other screens as well?

What is it with 3D apps and incomprehensible, overly complex and non standard user interfaces? Its as if they feel the need to justify the silly price tags by making them as unfathomable and proprietry as possible. Cinema 4D is heaven in this respect. Standard UI and elegant simplicity abound. Everything else is the spawn of satan. Shame on you software engineers Don't get me started on audio apps. All those hundreds of tiny tiny dials and sliders you're supposed to interact with via a clumsy mouse. WTF is that all about. Bastards edit - looking good omega

Yes it does. Trust goldfishguy. Apple Macs traditionally used to default at 72dpi for screen resolution but anything up to (and sometimes beyond) 96dpi is common these days. Take a 17" screen. 800x600 (about 62dpi) is going to be a different resolution to 1280x1024 (about 96dpi). comprendez. good. But anyhow goldfish guy, Springheels right too. Ain't no one got a 300dpi monitor. Not many folks have a 300dpi printer for continuous tone images for that matter. But yeah. Huge images on the internet is just rude. Post little pics if possible please. Or link to larger piccies if needs must. Life is nice and cosy when you are young and healthy and with good eyes - like you and me. 800x600 on a 17" screen is good for anyone a bit far sighted or a bit over the hill though. Feel sorry for anyone checking the forums on a web enabled phone.... (something I do from time to time)

Maya is the best overall 3d app available yes, but I spend a lot of time hanging around the CG commuity, forums etc, and Lightwave is regarded as the best poly modeler available. It has it's shortcomings obviously, no history, edges or NURBS are the main ones, but it's just so fast and intuituve once you learn it, and you can also virtually 'sculpt' in it , in a way not possible in other apps, apart from ZBrush. I used Lightwave 8, but it's virtually identical to lightwave 7 and 7.5, most of the changes in the newer versions were made to Layout, character setup and animation.

Ok, we have had plenty of discussion of what the lightgem should look like, and I think we have reached a consensus of sorts. http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=48&st=25 Now what we need is someone to actually create the thing. I would be willing to do it, but honestly, I'm not quite sure how. Is this going to be a 3d model? If not, how is it going to be animated? I know it's not as simple as just making a single image in Photoshop, but someone is going to have to explain how to approach this so that we can get going on this.

Ah, thanks. Applegeeks' forums aren't bad for tutorials either.

If you're interested in some good tutorials and critical feedback, there are a couple good forums to look at. Epilogue is one that has a lot of stuff available that might help. http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/phpBB2/

Well I read in another post o the forums here that 7500-8k polys is the target for characters. I'll have no problem whatsoever getting to that level from the current 30k It's never a good idea to have large details like the belt buckle just a flat plain with a normal map, it's always best to have some basic geometry there as well that more or less follows the high res shape. That's not a problem though, there's a plugin for Lightwave call qemLOSS which does just that job. I'll have to get this textured and normal/spec mapped and into Doom to see what the final effect will be. I currently have no idea how god/bad/average it will look inside the game.

If you find something out then you should probably download this http://forums.thedarkmod.com/index.php?showtopic=255 and incorporate it there to test it out. My next plans are to figure out how to change the buttons, and how to let the SDK do something for me.