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So, I know that blackjacking was supposedly made easier in 2.02, but I still can't make work even 5% of the time. Even against civilians. I can bonk them perfectly right on the back of the head without them being suspicious at all, and they just yelp in pain and turn to fight me. What *exactly* is it looking for? I know the wiki claims that against civilians, all it wants is either unalerted or you behind them, and against helmeted guards you need both unalerted and behind, but it's obviously looking for something more than this; I can literally walk up right behind a completely unalert civilian and when I blackjack them, it does nothing but piss them off.

What's the basic hit detection logic for the blackjack? I ask because when it comes to blackjacking someone, it seems like it gets more random the more armor the AI wears. If I run up and hit a dude with the blackjack who's wearing normal clothes (no armor), he drops like a sack of potatoes regardless of whether it was a direct head shot or at the torso. If they're wearing full plate armor and one of those helmets with a slitted faceplate then they're impossible to blackjack, which makes sense and seem to be made specifically to force ghosting in certain missions. It's the guys who have either partial armor (chainmail around the shoulders, or just a metal hat but no extra metal armor) which seem to be a case where I'm not confident of a 100% successful hit. I've done save scumming to test and sometimes it seems like only a frontal or side hit will take someone down, but even then the same repeated hit won't always work from one save to another. Note that I'm making accurate (to me) hits on their head, not torso shots. Is there an element of randomization added to the game logic that determines the success of a hit against an armored AI... or do I just suck and need some pointers?

About approaching from behind, it seems impossible to do it. The only way to effectively blackjack an AI is if they're stationary, which gives me plenty of eternities to creep behind them silently, or if you catch a moving one passing by you. I would defend that a stationary target forces you to be as silent as you can, but moving AIs seem to behave the same way, and there's some problems with this: The only way I see that allows you to catch up with them is by either sneak-running or normal walking (or running, obviously). But both options fail every time. They will always hear you. I'd hope there was a lesser chance to be heard when they're moving, as they would first confuse my steps for their own (awareness level 1, if you will), and then start wondering if they were hearing something else (awareness lvl 2), and then stop to listen but still not in alert mode (lvl 3), and then yes become alerted to your presence and turn around and search (lvl 4). Of course, this describes something that might happen in seconds, giving a fast player only the chance to run in and BAM. But this might solve my other problem: Most times where I quickly approach an AI and blackjack them, it doesn't work. There should be a slight delay to allow black jacking. Most of the time I'm quick enough to punch them as they're still saying "uh?" and they haven't even started unsheathing their swords, and it fails already. I know this system is to make the game harder, but it's frustrating instead. A slight delay to simulate a "confusion moment", or something like what described above might make it more forgiving and less immersion breaking. And such a delay would be controlled by the AI difficulty settings. I'm playing on "forgiving", and it is quite forgiving, but not in these cases. Another problem I noticed is that blackjacking AI with unsheathed swords from the back is likely to fail too. I'm not quite sure what's the problem, but at one time I had to reload the save quite a few times until I succeeded. And it seemed the problem was the angle at which I was attacking from. When I placed myself "strictly behind" (if you get what I mean, not even slightly sideways) then it worked. I did this twice with the same AI because I had to reload later on and hadn't saved afterward. I had the same problem again and had to adjust my position in relation to him. I think AI with weapons should be allowed to be blackjacked from any direction, just as long as it's outside of their field of view. Currently I find this mechanic very "gamey" and a tad frustrating. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want the game any easier. I just dislike when some mechanics are unfair or "gamey" or immersion breaking, etc.

Are you having trouble blackjacking the AI in The Dark Mod? Do you hit them in the head yet it always fails? Getting frustrated? Watch this video, which will demonstrate common issue people have with TDM, after playing the Thief series for so long. http://youtu.be/sw5EKIR6Paw

(I almost went with the title, "BJ -- still too hard?") Been watching a lot of Fen Phoenix's LPs of TDM, and he seems to be having a lot of difficulty with blackjacking. (check out his vids if you haven't already and leave feedback...this is exactly the kind of promotion TDM needs... except when he gets frustrated). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlSwkX1s1m0&feature=g-u-u I've lost the ability to determine whether blackjacking is hard or not, as I've got too much practice. What do others think? Here's a still from one of his vids, where he misses the guard's head and hits the shoulder instead:

We have fixed a bug in 1.04 that was making it harder to blackjack alert guards. Please do not vote based on prior experience, but try blackjacking guards after updating. If you are still finding blackjacking too hard, please be specific about the circumstances. Are you failing to KO guards with helmets? Alert guards? Are you failing primarily when trying to KO moving guards or is it standing guards as well? Have you tried the blackjack trainer? I'd like to get a sense of who is finding blackjacking difficult and why. Obviously if you are watching T2 speedrun videos, and expect to be able to run down a hallway and blackjack a guard on the elbow, you'll be disappointed with TDM blackjacking. But if people have reasonable expectations and are still finding it frustrating, it's something we should probably look at.

A couple questions regarding the blackjack and sleeping AI. Is there a reliable way to blackjack a sleeping AI? I seem to have trouble positioning myself in a way that makes the blackjack come down on their heads very well. I usually end up waking them up instead. Also, does putting unconscious AI on beds keep them from alerting other AI? If not, is it possible that such a feature might be added in the future? I have this habit of putting unconscious AI on beds or other cushions. I figure that if I'm going to club them over the head with a blunt object they might as well wake up in a somewhat comfortable position.

One thing I have done almost as a lark but that I wish had a logical impact in the game is to blackjack someone and then toss them on a bed. On the practical side, it got the body out of the way, but it was also kind of my non-ghosting signature - bonk everyone in an estate and waste a half hour making them all look like they were sleeping peacefully. However, from a more sober point of view, I had always wished that you could KO someone, set them in a bed, and if the body were seen there would be a good chance that the viewer wouldn't register the duffer as a crime victim. I found this especially ironic on the rare occasion I would actually KO someone who was snoring (usually just to shut them up). If a servant saw Lord Snorzalot asleep he would just walk by, but if the man were blackjacked in bed the call would go up, "help! murder!" ... even though the only difference was the Lord was not snoring. What would be the possibility (and the opinion of the community, for that matter) of implementing a "KOed in bed" feature? Just one of those flitting little thoughts.

I was curious about how the blackjack will be implemented. In TDS you cant KO someone with a sword out while you can still do it in T2 if he doesnt see you. In other words how difficult is it to KO someone? The second question is about Garrett's body movement, I recently reinstalled TDS and replayed a couple of missions-only to discover one of the things that seemed to annoy me before, your movement seems rather sluggish and disconnected to the game world, how's it working out so far in D3?