The Real Reason Behind The War On Iraq

[Macsen]

Edit: Macsen, is that the real thing? I put "democracy" into it and it comes back with a ton of links. I figured that would have been censored out, since that's what all the hubbub was about.

Well that's the thing, you don't know what's been censored. If it told you 'that word is censored!' it would be a wee bit obvious and jarring, instead it gives you links to websites that don't annoy the Chinease givernment in any way.

[Maximius]

It's not just nations; human beings are innately aggressive, violent, dominating creatures and will never be anything else, no matter what political ideologies are put in place.

 

Those things are true, but we are also innately capable of love, empathy, peaceful intentions, whatever, regardless of how we chose to apply them and to whom. Each individiual encompasses the whole of possible human experience in that sense, with exceptions for mental or physical barriers to such notions.(e.g. a psychopath who literally cannot think of the feelings or needs of other human beings or a life long blind person attempting to understand what it means to see) We would have to include those features as well to balance out the picture.

 

But Im uncertain as to how much we can profitably compare the two notions in a "side by side" manner, the political system and the "nature" of the beings living under it. The nature of individuals is profoundly shaped, but not utterly, by the political ideology they find themselves living under, the two are really part and parcel of a greater whole. What is certain is that the links between the two are not straight lines of influence but incredibly complex mixes of perceptions and realities.

 

And capitalism is more than simply a political ideology, though thats an important part of it. It +is+ the way the world currently works, it is the warp and weft of human society at this particular time in history. We have to look at the material linkages first in order to place the ideology in its proper context, so taught Marx. Greed may very well be a part of that ideology, but whether its greed or the perception that accumulating more to oneself is actually helping others as free market advocates argue, human motives and emotions are only a tiny part of the entities we know as nation-states or empires. I would argue that aspects of the people living under such a system will reflect that reality in interesting ways but then there will also be tensions where people are pulling away and standing in contradiction to the current Order of Things.

[sxotty]

Macsen, is that the real thing? I put "democracy" into it and it comes back with a ton of links. I figured that would have been censored out, since that's what all the hubbub was about.

 

Try something like tiananmen square

 

Or perhaps

 

Any other gross violations of human rights, try specific individuals who were locked in jail, political dissidents, try environmental issues and problems.

 

It isn't about democracy, WTF? You think they can just deny it exists?

 

No it is about the perception, when you search for "china river benzene spill" (a recent huge disaster) The links are very different...

 

First real google links: 1) "China tried to keep benzene spill secret" 2) UN Faults China For Slow Response To Toxic Benzene Spill

Happy China Google: 1) Another blast, toxic spill, worries China 2)China vows to punish any coverup of spill

 

I hope you can see the difference. They were fucking poisoning their citizens and giving tons of them cancer, but hey WTH they have a billion people so who gives a shit?

[c777]

usa, China, japan, germany, iraq

they all suck

wow they are really evil lol

[sxotty]

usa, China, japan, germany, iraq

they all suck

wow they are really evil lol

Don't forget Afghanistan, Akrotiri, Albania, Algeria, American Samoa, Andorra, Angola, Anguilla, Antigua and Barbuda, Argentina, Armenia, Aruba, Ashmore and Cartier Islands, Australia, Austria, Azerbaijan

 

The Bahamas, Bahrain, Baker Island, Bangladesh, Barbados, Bassas da India, Belarus, Belgium, Belize, Benin, Bolivia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Botswana, Bouvet Island, Brazil, Brunei, Bulgaria, Burkina Faso, Burma, Burundi

 

Cambodia, Cameroon, Canada, Cape Verde, Cayman Islands, Central African Republic, Chad, Chile, Colombia, Comoros, Congo, Costa Rica, Cote d'Ivoire, Croatia, Cuba, Cyprus, Czech Republic

 

Yeah the list goes on all the way to the end of the alphabet, but there are too many

[Spitter]

POLITICS

OPINIONS

INTERNET

[c777]

LOL

yeah too many

 

but really whats wrong with killing ppl??

i dont understand, its fun

[Napalm]

The US is estimated to have been directly responsible for the deaths of over 70 million peaople since 1900 in various nations in which it has meddled or attacked, by causing dictators to rise

 

 

I know this has been pointed out...butt his is an extreamely bias viewpoint... and its notreally true. On another note in the years of world war two Russian got about 30million, which is pretty high in the fact that it was less then a 10th of the time you marked the americans for being evil for.....

 

Also, you say that they are evil because they could fix all the world hunger/problems...however this is coming from the same group of people that freaks out and calls america an imperialist nation any time they go in to another country for any reason...

[Renzatic]

POLITICS

OPINIONS

INTERNET

 

SERIOUS BUSINESS

[SneaksieDave]

It isn't about democracy, WTF? You think they can just deny it exists?

..

I hope you can see the difference. They were fucking poisoning their citizens and giving tons of them cancer, but hey WTH they have a billion people so who gives a shit?

 

I think I shall never understand such replies. Did I say something to provoke that or are you just spewing hostility in random directions? Oh wait, this is teh intarnet...

 

Anyway, I tried tiananmen square and found plenty of results, the first in fact mentioning numbers of protestors and about not having right to self determination, although I spelled it wrong (unintentionally) - which indicates censorship isn't very thorough. If they paid google anything to set this special case up, they wasted their money. Also, I searched "google censor china" and found a whole bunch of racy stuff. I don't see how it achieves anything except pointing a giant finger at censorship.

[Ishtvan]

From Chinese Dark Mod

Ishtvan: " 运动控制现在支持爬行 , 蹲下爬行, 和蹲下跑, 除标准D3 之外运动。并且, 乒乓开关蹲下 可能容易地被设置在doom3cfg (我没有增加这, 已经是那里) 。 "

 

Wow, apparently I remember my 華語 better than I thought.

[sxotty]

I think I shall never understand such replies. Did I say something to provoke that or are you just spewing hostility in random directions? Oh wait, this is teh intarnet...

 

Anyway, I tried tiananmen square and found plenty of results, the first in fact mentioning numbers of protestors and about not having right to self determination, although I spelled it wrong (unintentionally) - which indicates censorship isn't very thorough. If they paid google anything to set this special case up, they wasted their money. Also, I searched "google censor china" and found a whole bunch of racy stuff. I don't see how it achieves anything except pointing a giant finger at censorship.

 

First, what are you talking about? There is no random directions to the spewing. Perhaps you should read what was written, ah well.

 

Second, google isn't censoring it China is. They did not think about misspelling apparently. Furthermore, did you pay any attention? I showed concrete examples of how they were censoring it, to portray Chinese actions in a positive light. If you looked up tiananmen square you would have seen that too. The point is not to deny that things exist when every already knows they exist, the point is to shape perception by linking to articles that display them in a positive light, and as new generations come up they can slowly cyt down what they see. They closed out sattelite TV as well if you did not know. Until China actually opens its markets they will have massive control, b/c any company would sell off its daughter to get access to 1/5th of the worlds population that is denied to everyone else.

 

Third, it only goes to show the ineptness of large buraeucracies.

 

Fourth, unless you see what a chinese citizen searches for you will never really know.

[SneaksieDave]

Hilarious. Okay let me spell it out slowly for you:

 

My point was, what are you getting (and continuing to get, see? ^^) hostile about? Because a person asked a question? About a search engine? I know the anonymity of the internet gives people the tendency to do that, but do go pick a fight with someone else for no reason. I wonder who shit in your cereal today.

[obscurus]

SERIOUS BUSINESS

LARGE BOLD CAPS!

EDIT: D'oh! that didn't work.... Ahh, that's better...

Edited January 30, 2006 by obscurus

[Renzatic]

That's because you didn't put the / on the closing /size...but 48 wouldn't work anyway, it only goes to size=7.

 

I should know, I tried going to 50 with the Serious Business reply.

[Domarius]

Thanks for the links, Maximus.

 

From reading all this, I guess there will always be an empire, the real concern is which one. The US seems relatively okay, but time will tell I guess.

[sxotty]

Hilarious. Okay let me spell it out slowly for you:

 

My point was, what are you getting (and continuing to get, see? ^^) hostile about? Because a person asked a question? About a search engine? I know the anonymity of the internet gives people the tendency to do that, but do go pick a fight with someone else for no reason. I wonder who shit in your cereal today.

And you are suggesting that this is a polite way to discuss something.

 

Pot meet kettle.

 

Thanks,

 

Like I said before I was not hostile towards a person, I was hostile towards the laise faire attitude people have with respect to other people getting killed since they don't happen to know them. No one seems to care that many hundreds of people were poisoned that was my point. (AND I did not say, nor do I now say that you are one of those people that doesn't care, I really don't know if you do or not and would not presume to say whether it was the case)

 

I wasn't fighting you, that was the entire point of saying that you might want to read it again. I didn't even know I was responding to your post. Sorry if it hurt your feelings to suggest your were wrong about them not censoring it, I know being wrong can be a terrible burden to bear In fact if I read what I actually wrote your reply is much more rude than my statement in my eyes. You selectively quoted it to make it sound mean and vindictive. Perhaps you should work for fox news.

 

BTW on the topic of empire I can hook youguys up with many articles about it as well if you care.

Edited January 28, 2006 by sxotty

[Maximius]

Thanks for the links, Maximus.

 

From reading all this, I guess there will always be an empire, the real concern is which one. The US seems relatively okay, but time will tell I guess.

 

 

No problem, just shoot me a note if you ever want to read more.