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Okay, I have listened to both sound sets now and I will stick with the old ones as the difference isn't much in my opinion and as a patch I want to stick close to the original.

Oktokolo is right, but judging all the needed changes I would say: Never touch a running system :)!

I disagree about nearby AI being alerted, because you sometimes don't even know if some are, but I could live with being unnoticed at the moment because this is exactly when I usually quicksave :)! Also regarding the loot objectives, I normally play easy difficulty because I love to knock everybody out, but with the stats scrolls I can still see how many loot there is and how much I am missing.

Great to see you are still working on this ! But I have two questions: 1) As Obsttorte is involved in the Classic Blackjack version, is this the one he wants to include into the core game? I though this was not possible using scripts. 2) Are the new footsteps something for the patch? Like are they fixing missing footstep sounds or are they only different sounding ones?

Yes, but some of them might have become ko-immune and others are much harder to knock out. I might sound like a broken record, but since I removed that "feature" with my patch, getting caught is less negative than it was before ;).

That sounds to me like an auto-save, which you have in many games and which often is an indicator of such things. Does TDM allow for autosaves?

Yes, it's refreshing sometimes. I loved Hazard Pay because it was so different to the usual city missions and as you know I am all about new features to keep the game interesting! Still to me there are some things I expect from a TDM mission, like that it is about stealth, I have lockpicks and a blackjack, and I can save whenever I want. Otherwise I could play any battle royal game ;)! But coming back on topic, to me normal saves would be enough, I don't need a one key quick save. This might be a compromise: the player could stop playing whenever real live needs it and they could save before trying critical things without the temptation to save all the time. Not saying that this should be implemented, I'm good with like it is!

Maybe, but then these maps probably were not as good or as fun as hundreds of real Doom maps out there. I just mean TDM provides a certain set of features, why should mappers ignore them?

Yes, but why would they want to do that in a game which is known to support quicksaves? I mean somebody could turn TDM back into a shooter like Doom 3 if they wanted, but why wouldn't they use Doom 3 instead?

I replayed the Stealth section of the Training Mission and I see only one place where info about the head turning could be added without breaking the message formatting which is in the second book. This is what I did and I updated the patch...

I think an easy solution would be to mention the random head turning in the training mission. After all this is where you are supposed to learn the differences to other games...

Oh no, I'm all for realism, so this is fine with me :)!

I just noticed this here and not on the beta board. So is there still a chance to get involved in beta testing ;)?

In that case I hope that it will make it into the core game. I always had issues with blackjacking myself, which is one reason I disabled the KO alert immunity in the first place.

This will probably not happen. If the core team rejects it, I could always add it to the patch :)!

Speaking of the majority, are there numbers on how many players play TDM? Because the download number of 2.10 on ModDB shows a little more than 1000 downloads, but old players probably use the internal updater instead anyway.

Another one is in "The Bakery Job". It's a simple one building map, the box is on the groundfloor on the table.

@Dragofer, are you reading this? Can this be fixed in your froblock script?

Kingsal, I just redownloaded your mission today and the tdm_user_addons.script instead of tdm_custom_scripts.script issue is still not fixed. Can you please do this in your next update? It does not only break my patch which I have temprarily fixed, but also e.g. Snatcher's mod as far as I know.

I was really amazed of how different Hazard Pay's setting was! You should certainly try this if you want a change from the usual environment.

I just uploaded a small update, because Dragofer provided a script to globally fixed uncorrectly used lit entities as unlit ones. Many thanks!

You could spin some kind of story of a magical guild that teaches thieves, similar to the one you used to explain Penumbra. Then everybody installing your mod could play the "Magical Thief" and even the Shadowmarks fit the setting! You could try to add even more features like Blink from Dishonored and other supernatural stuff. "Workshop" doesn't sound like much in comparison ;). Oh and maybe my problems with some of your new features are my own patch interfering with your mod...

I just tested your mod and while I can't say anything about specific missions, here are my observations: - Shadowmark: The card looks very dark even in lit places and it does not get highlighted if you pick it up. Also is there a trick to drop more than one card? Anyway, this is not something I will include in the patch. - Penumbra: This looks cool, but once the timer ran out, I couldn't use it again. Is this intended? Again this is too much for the patch, but maybe you should consider doing a "magical thief mod" with more features!

So the Penumbra item is basically a combination of the Speed Potion and the Invisibility Potion? When I found a screenshot of the cut potion I read the connected threads and it seemed to me that high speed is prone to break missions when it increases jumping width so I took the save route and restored it as Invisibility Potion for the patch, thanks to Kingsal.

You are too modest ;). While most core developers concentrate on performance and visual improvements, you were the only one besides me who directly looked into adding new global gameplay features! I still have to test your card deck and I'm curious what else you are cooking up right now. I believe that TDM can indeed cope with some more of the kind :)!