geegee

Hi destined. Yes, this is strange AI behavior, but I had nothing much to do for awhile so re dmap'ed the test area over and over trying to figure it out. Nope, the AI only targeted one path_corner. I have to go out now but I could attach the .map file later (only 280 lines) after reproducing that configuration. I experimented with giving the paths the "chance" spawnarg but there were no results relevant to what I wanted the AI to do, which is, port in and immediately start one exact path to a destination - after which all hell breaks loose. I know that "chance" works when doing what Sotha calls "RIT" random interesting things, but in those cases the AI isn't teleported in and aimed at a corner to start. The AAS_flood/elevator example is good (and interesting) to know. For elevators I use grayman's prefab almost untouched and so far have escaped the horror of trying to set that thing up - now I know a bit more about what it is I'm pasting in there. Hi JackFarmer. I cloned your crane setup from hhtlc into a testmap just to see how it was done. Not in a million years would I have figured out those rotate stoppers! Anyway, in the test setup that worked every time I didn't have the teleported AI targeting a corner, but a path_waitfortrigger. The path_waitfortrigger then targeted the corner of choice. When I triggered the teleport entity, because I wanted the AI to start the path at once I used the same trigger_once to target the AI, and the AI was triggered the same instant it popped into the test area. If I wanted the AI to pause before starting the path I'd have the trigger_once target another trigger_once with a delay on it, targeting the AI. The info on how I could use the atdm:target_changetarget is going to be put to use in another area where I have some very complex pathing. I didn't know you could target an AI to add a path_corner. I've been using the changetarget targeted at a corner, then changing the corner it's pointed at. Having it target the AI might simplify things considerably (knock on wood).

Make up your mind.

@datiswous Pathing teleported AI is a legitimate topic. If you can't see the questions that I've been addressing in my test maps, leading to my post, that isn't really my problem. There's no way I can know what the experts on S/R, scripting and pathing might contribute to expand my understanding, if they should feel motivated.

Is there any protocol for gabbing about what one has discovered, when experimenting with getting something to work in TDM? I guess so long as I'm polite, people aren't forced to read it... I've been trying to get some teleported AI to follow paths, so created a small test map for the purpose. One thing I hadn't seen mentioned is that the test map requires that some AI (dummyAI) already be in the test area of the map at start. It can't be in a sealed room or a room that it can't exit from - it has to be able to access the test area where the teleport and paths are. Otherwise nothing related to pathing of the teleported AI (t_AI) will work. The dummyAI needn't be pathed, and it can be removed at any time before or after the teleportation. (I guess it tells the engine that dmap has to do the area calculations...) The wiki article https://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=Teleporting_entities is correct in explaining that it's best to target t_AI at a path_waitfortrigger, which in turn targets the first path_corner of t_AI's route. So to avoid yet another script I had a trigger_once target both the atdm:teleport and t_AI. That plan (is the only plan that) seems to work every time. One can target t_AI at a path_corner, but that only works in a half-ass way and the path_corner must target a looped path. The looped path doesn't have to loop back to the original path_corner, it can be a closed loop somewhere along the way. However, it appears to be absolutely arbitrary which path_corner in that series that t_AI will head to first, except it seems to be rare if ever that t_AI will head to the original corner it's targeted at. It changes arbitrarily with each dmap of the same setup. So that's hardly recommended. Why didn't I do it the correct way from the start? Best not ask that question, but at least now I feel confident that I can set up a more complicated in-game scenario.

You mean the far wall with the tdm low_brick_wall_old tex. It's a func_static but you're right, very monotonous - just a long rectangle. I guess I just got used to it, so left it, having so much else to work on. Your observation is noted, it'll be fixed up. Here's a closeup of the grass edge. I tried following Sotha's tutorial on building an edged road, but have my difficulties following arbitrary corners and meanderings. I used the standard tdm grass_edge texture, but since there wasn't one for grass4 I swapped the grass4 diffuse for one in Fidcal's material defs. As you can see, the grass4 in the edging is a very different scale than that in the patch it joins. I don't like that either. I've only recently started work on edging and will no doubt experiment with adjusting the alpha blend so I know how to give it more teeth, while also controlling the scale of the diffuse. The edging around the straw in the barn is atrocious and definitely technique is a work in progress and I'm a slow learner.

Having a beer at the bier outside the barn at the farm. My WIP will probably go by the name 'Lucy'. It's too large to be a first FM. The architecture is the easy part, and even that's very difficult to learn. I'm only now getting an inkling as to what goes into "building vertically" - so my FM is flat. Couldn't be flatter if it were steamrolled. But then there's lighting, audio, scripting, building a captivating immersive story... The architecture is getting close to finished. Or so I tell myself. The main plot, the core objectives, several optional side trips, are set down in outline form so there's a stable foundation. Lighting is passable. Ambient audio is very rudimentary or non-existent. Storyline audio is non-existent and at the moment the story is told mostly through notes tied to starting/completing objectives, and to fx. There are no intro screens/video/texts yet. I don't know if I even can finish the thing. Hmmm, now let's see how that file attachment thing works to send the pic

It appears that if I bind the ragdoll to anything, e.g. an apple or hook, nothing to do with the func_mover, loading a save will crash the game. Following lophyte's tutorial, after binding I used the property 'bindConstraint name1' with the value 'ballAndSocket waist Hips' Is that a mistake? EDIT TO ADD - I think I solved it. Yes, the problem is binding with the property/value above. The last line of lophyte's script is to unbind the ragdoll, so it'll drop to floor rather than hang in the air stuck to the mover at the movepoint entity. A save after that followed by a reload works and doesn't crash the game. So, I removed the bind/thrower1 property/value from the ragdoll, wrote a script saying void corpse_bind () { $marauder1.bind( $thrower1 ); } and put in a trigger_once calling corpse_bind just before the trigger calling corpse_move. With that setup I can save/reload everywhere. So the flying body goes back into my WIP, problem free.

I followed lophyte's 'flying corpse' Doom 3 tutorial and it worked perfectly. ragdoll (marauder1) bound to func_mover (thrower1), aimed at func_static (movepoint1) on other side of a func_fracture window with health=0. trigger_once calls corpse_move1, which is lophyte's script copy/pasted w. name changes: void corpse_move1 () { $thrower1.time(.4); $thrower1.moveTo ( $movepoint1 ); sys.waitFor ($thrower1); $marauder1.unbind(); } The ragdoll flies thru' window, breaking it, and falls to ground (as per last line in script). Yippee! So simple, for once. However, I can't load a savegame of the map. I reduced the problem to binding the ragdoll to the func_mover. That alone causes the problem.

I strongly recommend that someone new to DarkRadiant and TDM mapping follow Sotha's video tutorials https://wiki.thedarkmod.com/index.php?title=DarkRadiant_Video_Tutorials#Sotha These tutorials don't require previous understanding and they cover the essentials of creating a small FM from start to finish, clearly and systematically.

Somebody absolutely new dl'ing TDM won't be thinking of all this. Just about all recent experience of playing first-person games like this will be of playing commercial "titles" like Dishonored or Deus Ex etc., where each game has a beginning, usually including an intro to the mechanics, followed by a buildup of story and a buildup of powers to some climactic ending - the whole thing done with money to burn. So the concept "training mission" wouldn't even enter their heads. They'll just start playing and yes, in the back of their minds expecting to be told someway in-game what to do, especially for anything complicated, which in TDM includes stuff like snuffing out a candle or manipulating a held item. Can't fault new downloaders and players for this kind of expectation. TDM is a loose group of individual missions mostly unrelated except in sharing a game world and a TDM "look", so the commercial AAA title route isn't possible. Perhaps at start of every mission could be a default 'on' screen explaining the need for playing a training mission? Something like: you will need to know how to pick up and use, and sometimes manipulate objects in the game world. etc. A quick tutorial is here < >. A training mission is here < >. With a toggle-off (permanently) button saying screen won't be seen again. I wish I could think of something better - that seems underwhelming Perhaps a default mission could be already loaded at first run, so at mission start the new player just hits go. In which case the mission should be both short and interesting, with intent to quickly immerse the new player in the game world and hook them. Hey! It's easy posting ideas that others would have to implement! I'm finished already!

I think I could start using and learning from this editor immediately. Writing materials by hand, which for me is largely copy/paste/editing to serve the purpose good enough, leaves a messy result requiring a tedious rewriting fix. Time better spent learning how to use such an editor. Looking forward to it. Thanks.

30. I expected some, but yipes! I think near all of them were caused by my twitchy fingers and forgetting to check if "rotate" is active. The bulk of them were from before I figured out that cloneselection works but doesn't offset when "rotate" active. At first I just figured it didn't work at all... Anyway thanks jonri, greebo and all the TDM superstars for making the most fun games tool I've ever played with.

@Destined Yes, I'd be most grateful if you post your script. Your method opens the door to whole new possible scenarios in a storyline. Sounds a bit like finding a valvewheel, transporting it across the map to the broken gate, snapping it in place and voila, the gate works! edit to add: thanks for the script!

Thanks Jack! I copied the format for ""Two entities are in the same radius of each other" in Heart of St. Mattis and, for two readables and two locations it worked! A major step forward, that! Also in my WIP I had a separate atdm:target_addobjectives_N for every new objective N, so I changed over to your way of doing it with just the one atdm:target_addobjectives containing the entire list 1,2,...,N. Much better. It still doesn't work for the func_static I put in an atdm:moveable_base cover. As I said, this droppable item worked when dropped into an info_location target - but only once and it broke everything else. But the identical cloned item pasted in my test map wasn't properly droppable, it would just hang statically in the air having lost all the droppable properties. But now my focus has tightened and I imagine that I can work that out. Perhaps exporting it as .ase and working with the model would.... anyway I'll see. Thanks again!! Objective complete! The droppable I made as per the wiki is composed of two parts, the func_static and the atdm:moveable_base. I reverted these to worldspawn then exported as .ase (which probably isn't required) then changed it into a single atdm:moveable_base droppable. I guess that should've been obvious, what with the stress on "name of single entity" found everywhere, and that two means two.

Hi JackFarmer, I didn't realize that the 'info_location' objective was a known bug. The wiki directs mappers to use 'info_location' because 'location' is broken and for some reason google searches on problems with 'info_location' didn't show anything. But good to know! I've been tearing my hair out. I wonder about existing maps using multiple 'info_location' and/or 'location', whether they're all broken? I've tried "two entities in a radius" and so far haven't got it to work. Even once. So I put experimenting on that aside, going nuts trying to figure out my mistakes with the others being more than I could take already. But now I'll keep trying and will check out your fm. Seems to me that the looping behavior when one info_location objective triggers the next, so they're overlaid for that exact "objective complete" moment, suggests that somehow completing the one instance triggers a global response for every possible info_location objective in the fm. Or something... hehe. I'm clueless about coding.

I've been building a rather large fm, no doubt more than I can handle (but it's fun and DarkRadiant is amazing!): brushes 17000, patches 8700, entities 5650. Perhaps I've overloaded the system and have to break it into 2 linked parts, which would require rethinking the storyline so each part has a definite start/middle/conclusion. Still, it's smaller than The Painter's Wife in all respects. Anyhow, I've run into problems setting objectives "item is in info_location". I'd earlier wasted time trying to get "item is in location" to work and finally gave up, shortly before a bug was reported and the warning put in the wiki. I can get "item is in info_location" to work, but only one instance. I imagine the player gathering up various objects and placing them here and there to trigger objective complete, helping to give a concrete sense to the gameplay - so multiple instances are required. When I try to add a second "item is in info_locaton" I get all kinds of errors, most common being the first info_location objective gets broken - drop the item and previously working "objective complete" isn't triggered. I've verified that 2 info_location objectives work, but in separate maps. Putting them together in one map is impossible. I've had them both activated and where the first (original) one still works, but then the 2nd one doesn't work, or the droppable item drops but loses all properties, it just hangs statically in the air until picked up again (maddening!). I've tried about every possible configuration that I can think of. One interesting configuration happened when I had the first info_location completion trigger the visibility of the 2nd. That set up a loop, "objective complete" endlessly ringing out with the text. So I dunno, is the info_location objective broken or am I missing something obvious?